Struggling to cope with bunnies- please help

FifiBun

Warren Scout
Apologies in advance for the massive post, and sorry to be one of those who only posts when they need something :/ I do really love reading all about your babies.

following lovely Craig's advice, I got fifi a husbun :) ( I was told she needed to be a single bun when I rehomed her). I wanted to go down the rescue route, but there was such a wait for home checks due to 'c' word, and I didn't want her to be alone any longer.
I got chatting to this lady who told me she could bond any two male and female buns ( which I did think was quite an outrageous claim, but somehow just intuitively trusted her). Anyway, she told me to find a neutered rabbit for sale and she would bond them- she just told me to make sure they were a similar age.
Oh my god, those ghastly for sale sites...pre loved and pets for homes... absolutely heart breaking... people just waking up to the reality of the rabbits they got their kids for Christmas, and throwing them out like rubbish.. separating bonded pairs..anything to get some money back. I sent so many "please don't separate your rabbits, it will f them up" messages.
Anyway, I quickly discovered that neutered bucks are something of a scarcity on these sites - people who care enough to have their bunny neutered don't get rid, but I managed to find a suitable boy.
They spent 5 days at this 'bunny whisperers' and came back totally loved up.
It was soooo lovely to see them snuggling up and grooming etc.
Fifi had been such an easy single bunny, she had the run of the whole downstairs, never wee'd outside the box, never chewed anything she wasn't supposed to. A few rogue poo's but nothing too bad.
Since Christopher Robin ( I've named the boy), came a few weeks ago a lot has changed. He loves a strokey sesh, which is lovely because fifi is really hands off for the most part, but I cannot pick Christopher Robin up- he kicks like mad. Also he has had a wee outside of the litter box quite a few times. For these reasons I've confined the buns to their room and the kitchen, where it's easy to deal with mop ups. This is still a very spacious area for 2 buns.
There are poos everywhere, but the worst thing is, Fifi has stopped eating the squidgy, smelly poos, and at least three times a day, and every morning, I walk into poo carnage- HUGE PILES of this squidgy poo- smeared every where - bear in mind this is my kitchen..
I've stopped giving them greens in an attempt to get her eating the poos again, but I almost think it was better when they had greens.
At the moment we are both at home- my fiance working at home because of the c word, and I'm able to clean up every time I go in there, but on the few occasions we've been out most of the day I've come back to poo smeared every where, puddles of wee on the floor, normal poos everywhere, huge piles of the soft poo. I've cried twice- not to sound like a total drip, but it's really taking it out of me, and I can't imagine what it's going to be like when there's no one at home during the day.
Also I'm so stressed out because Fifi is a really, really fluffy lion head, and her bum is constantly a stinky mess, and it's so stressful for us and for her to have to hold her and cut and soak the poo off of her.

Food wise, they both have a large tablespoon of burgess pellets in the morning, and hay all day. That's it.
I realised quite soon after getting Christopher Robin that he wasn't eating the hay I was giving, and his poos were tiny and I could feel his spine!! So I swapped them to the hay that the lady who bonded them were giving them, and they are mad for it. I saw him eat properly for the first time. I was starving him!! [emoji31][emoji173]
this hay is farm hay ( that's all I know). Its much greener than the strawy type Timothy hay they were on. So the likelihood is that it's this hay that is stopping fifi eating her squidgy poo, right? I mean she quite often would not eat it, but now it's the rule rather than the exception. Sometimes she'll lay in a spot for a while, and when she gets up..oh my god...The hugest pile of stinky shiiizz, she'll run through it before I can get to it quickly enough, there are normal poos everywhere no matter how much I put them back in their 2 litter boxes. I have no kitchen anymore, their toys cover the floor, which I am absolutely fine with, but everything is getting covered in smelly sh**, I'm so scared of fly strike with fifi, I can't pick up Christopher Robin, he's wee'ing. I'm not bonding properly with them because they are separate in the kitchen, I do spend time with them in the kitchen, but I desperately want them in the living room too, and really as part of the family, but I dare not bring the wee and poo to the rest of the house- carpet etc.
Please help, I am SO stressed out, it's a constant battle. I don't know how I'll ever be able to have people in our home when lockdown ends- no one would ever eat here that's for sure!
I can't give them each different hay for obvious reasons. I'm so happy that they are loved up and together, but I wish I could enjoy these bunnies just a little. I wake up every morning dreading what awaits me downstairs, and throughout the day. I won't put them outside.
Any advice would be SO GRATEFULLY RECEIVED!! [emoji120] if you've read all this, THANK YOU!!!


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Apologies in advance for the massive post, and sorry to be one of those who only posts when they need something :/ I do really love reading all about your babies.

following lovely Craig's advice, I got fifi a husbun :) ( I was told she needed to be a single bun when I rehomed her). I wanted to go down the rescue route, but there was such a wait for home checks due to 'c' word, and I didn't want her to be alone any longer.
I got chatting to this lady who told me she could bond any two male and female buns ( which I did think was quite an outrageous claim, but somehow just intuitively trusted her). Anyway, she told me to find a neutered rabbit for sale and she would bond them- she just told me to make sure they were a similar age.
Oh my god, those ghastly for sale sites...pre loved and pets for homes... absolutely heart breaking... people just waking up to the reality of the rabbits they got their kids for Christmas, and throwing them out like rubbish.. separating bonded pairs..anything to get some money back. I sent so many "please don't separate your rabbits, it will f them up" messages.
Anyway, I quickly discovered that neutered bucks are something of a scarcity on these sites - people who care enough to have their bunny neutered don't get rid, but I managed to find a suitable boy.
They spent 5 days at this 'bunny whisperers' and came back totally loved up.
It was soooo lovely to see them snuggling up and grooming etc.
Fifi had been such an easy single bunny, she had the run of the whole downstairs, never wee'd outside the box, never chewed anything she wasn't supposed to. A few rogue poo's but nothing too bad.
Since Christopher Robin ( I've named the boy), came a few weeks ago a lot has changed. He loves a strokey sesh, which is lovely because fifi is really hands off for the most part, but I cannot pick Christopher Robin up- he kicks like mad. Also he has had a wee outside of the litter box quite a few times. For these reasons I've confined the buns to their room and the kitchen, where it's easy to deal with mop ups. This is still a very spacious area for 2 buns.
There are poos everywhere, but the worst thing is, Fifi has stopped eating the squidgy, smelly poos, and at least three times a day, and every morning, I walk into poo carnage- HUGE PILES of this squidgy poo- smeared every where - bear in mind this is my kitchen..
I've stopped giving them greens in an attempt to get her eating the poos again, but I almost think it was better when they had greens.
At the moment we are both at home- my fiance working at home because of the c word, and I'm able to clean up every time I go in there, but on the few occasions we've been out most of the day I've come back to poo smeared every where, puddles of wee on the floor, normal poos everywhere, huge piles of the soft poo. I've cried twice- not to sound like a total drip, but it's really taking it out of me, and I can't imagine what it's going to be like when there's no one at home during the day.
Also I'm so stressed out because Fifi is a really, really fluffy lion head, and her bum is constantly a stinky mess, and it's so stressful for us and for her to have to hold her and cut and soak the poo off of her.

Food wise, they both have a large tablespoon of burgess pellets in the morning, and hay all day. That's it.
I realised quite soon after getting Christopher Robin that he wasn't eating the hay I was giving, and his poos were tiny and I could feel his spine!! So I swapped them to the hay that the lady who bonded them were giving them, and they are mad for it. I saw him eat properly for the first time. I was starving him!! [emoji31][emoji173]
this hay is farm hay ( that's all I know). Its much greener than the strawy type Timothy hay they were on. So the likelihood is that it's this hay that is stopping fifi eating her squidgy poo, right? I mean she quite often would not eat it, but now it's the rule rather than the exception. Sometimes she'll lay in a spot for a while, and when she gets up..oh my god...The hugest pile of stinky shiiizz, she'll run through it before I can get to it quickly enough, there are normal poos everywhere no matter how much I put them back in their 2 litter boxes. I have no kitchen anymore, their toys cover the floor, which I am absolutely fine with, but everything is getting covered in smelly sh**, I'm so scared of fly strike with fifi, I can't pick up Christopher Robin, he's wee'ing. I'm not bonding properly with them because they are separate in the kitchen, I do spend time with them in the kitchen, but I desperately want them in the living room too, and really as part of the family, but I dare not bring the wee and poo to the rest of the house- carpet etc.
Please help, I am SO stressed out, it's a constant battle. I don't know how I'll ever be able to have people in our home when lockdown ends- no one would ever eat here that's for sure!
I can't give them each different hay for obvious reasons. I'm so happy that they are loved up and together, but I wish I could enjoy these bunnies just a little. I wake up every morning dreading what awaits me downstairs, and throughout the day. I won't put them outside.
Any advice would be SO GRATEFULLY RECEIVED!! [emoji120] if you've read all this, THANK YOU!!!


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Ps- re reading what I posted I realise how bad it sounds when I say 'I want to be able to enjoy these bunnies just a little '- they are here because fifi needed a new home, I had no interest in keeping rabbits, but I had to take her. I am shockingly inexperienced and clueless. I just meant it would be really nice if it wasn't 100% total stress. I am honoured to have these critters in my home, and just watching them knowing they are happy is more than enough for me!

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Aww, its lovely to hear Fifi has found love. Sorry to hear about your kitchen though.

I think owners often look to reducing greens whereas more likely it will be the nuggets. Excel do have a bit of a reputation for bunnies having ceco issues so maybe you could switch over to science selective. ? Incase it is the hay I'dmake sure your provide 2, one your boy likes & another for Fifi. Presumably he'll ignore hers. If she doesn't find it as tasty as him she might not be getting enough fibre.

Although I've had her many years my little old lady Mouse has developed a more sensitive tum recently. I was doing multiple bum baths daily. About 2 weeks ago I decided to strip her diet back to several hays, loads of forage I pick, herbs & nuggets from haybox (no soya). This has worked for Mousey. I think I'm on day 12 of no bum baths. She has mobility issues. If dietary modifications don't help I'd suggest a check up. Mobility issues are often cited, dental too

Good luck. I hope it gets better
 
I'm sorry you're a bit overwhelmed, but you know you're doing the right thing by asking for advice here :D I agree with all what J&B said: providing whatever hay they like is good, you don't have to separate it, they do that themselves :lol: And swapping out the pellets for a different brand might work as well. Picking up rabbits is an art I've never mastered: Lopsy is all about the loves as long as his feet are on the floor, but it makes any kind of care difficult (impossible when he was younger, it was huge feet everywhere). My 'on this day' photos for around this time (late Feb-late March) of are full of pictures of rabbit wee in the wrong places it turns out :roll: so it MIGHT just be time of year! Mine are outside though so I dunno if that makes a difference (probably not XD). Thies week, for example, they decided to totally trash (shred, dig up, throw out etc.) one litter tray and then wee all over the floor around it, I was lucky the box next to it didn't get a soaking :roll: I would suggest MORE litter trays but it gets silly after a while: mine have 3 (2 in the playhouse, one in the hutch) and even though I've tried removing the extra playhouse one, they won't have it. I didn;t have this problem with Lopsy and Aboleth, just Lopsy and Chibbs! Lopsy-Aboleth had to have an extra tray a couple of times a year (around now and probably Autumn) but they got over it not being there; Chibbs-Lopsy, no chance. And it's not Chibbs alone!

You're doing a great job, it's not easy, it's much easier to ust give up so you're amazing for carrying on :love:
 
Aww, its lovely to hear Fifi has found love. Sorry to hear about your kitchen though.

I think owners often look to reducing greens whereas more likely it will be the nuggets. Excel do have a bit of a reputation for bunnies having ceco issues so maybe you could switch over to science selective. ? Incase it is the hay I'dmake sure your provide 2, one your boy likes & another for Fifi. Presumably he'll ignore hers. If she doesn't find it as tasty as him she might not be getting enough fibre.

Although I've had her many years my little old lady Mouse has developed a more sensitive tum recently. I was doing multiple bum baths daily. About 2 weeks ago I decided to strip her diet back to several hays, loads of forage I pick, herbs & nuggets from haybox (no soya). This has worked for Mousey. I think I'm on day 12 of no bum baths. She has mobility issues. If dietary modifications don't help I'd suggest a check up. Mobility issues are often cited, dental too

Good luck. I hope it gets better
Thank you so much Joey and Boo : )
Christopher Robin was on science plan before coming here so I have some. I'll give it a go, but fifi has always been on burgess and never had the issue before. Still I'll try anything.
How wonderful to be on day 12 of no bum baths! SO happy for you and for sweet Mousey[emoji173]

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I'm sorry you're a bit overwhelmed, but you know you're doing the right thing by asking for advice here :D I agree with all what J&B said: providing whatever hay they like is good, you don't have to separate it, they do that themselves [emoji38] And swapping out the pellets for a different brand might work as well. Picking up rabbits is an art I've never mastered: Lopsy is all about the loves as long as his feet are on the floor, but it makes any kind of care difficult (impossible when he was younger, it was huge feet everywhere). My 'on this day' photos for around this time (late Feb-late March) of are full of pictures of rabbit wee in the wrong places it turns out :roll: so it MIGHT just be time of year! Mine are outside though so I dunno if that makes a difference (probably not XD). Thies week, for example, they decided to totally trash (shred, dig up, throw out etc.) one litter tray and then wee all over the floor around it, I was lucky the box next to it didn't get a soaking :roll: I would suggest MORE litter trays but it gets silly after a while: mine have 3 (2 in the playhouse, one in the hutch) and even though I've tried removing the extra playhouse one, they won't have it. I didn;t have this problem with Lopsy and Aboleth, just Lopsy and Chibbs! Lopsy-Aboleth had to have an extra tray a couple of times a year (around now and probably Autumn) but they got over it not being there; Chibbs-Lopsy, no chance. And it's not Chibbs alone!

You're doing a great job, it's not easy, it's much easier to ust give up so you're amazing for carrying on :love:
Thank you so much keletkezes:)
Especially for your kind words, I really am struggling! The thing with the hay is that fifi definitely prefers the new stuff, so given the option of the two will always go for the non Timothy stuff. I'll give it a go though!
Your buns have fantastic names! And I have to confess to having had a guilty giggle at their trashing antics! Thanks again. I really needed to hear that [emoji120][emoji173]

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I'm sorry you're a bit overwhelmed, but you know you're doing the right thing by asking for advice here :D I agree with all what J&B said: providing whatever hay they like is good, you don't have to separate it, they do that themselves [emoji38] And swapping out the pellets for a different brand might work as well. Picking up rabbits is an art I've never mastered: Lopsy is all about the loves as long as his feet are on the floor, but it makes any kind of care difficult (impossible when he was younger, it was huge feet everywhere). My 'on this day' photos for around this time (late Feb-late March) of are full of pictures of rabbit wee in the wrong places it turns out :roll: so it MIGHT just be time of year! Mine are outside though so I dunno if that makes a difference (probably not XD). Thies week, for example, they decided to totally trash (shred, dig up, throw out etc.) one litter tray and then wee all over the floor around it, I was lucky the box next to it didn't get a soaking :roll: I would suggest MORE litter trays but it gets silly after a while: mine have 3 (2 in the playhouse, one in the hutch) and even though I've tried removing the extra playhouse one, they won't have it. I didn;t have this problem with Lopsy and Aboleth, just Lopsy and Chibbs! Lopsy-Aboleth had to have an extra tray a couple of times a year (around now and probably Autumn) but they got over it not being there; Chibbs-Lopsy, no chance. And it's not Chibbs alone!

You're doing a great job, it's not easy, it's much easier to ust give up so you're amazing for carrying on :love:
Also great to hear that it could just be a 'time of year', thing

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Aww, its lovely to hear Fifi has found love. Sorry to hear about your kitchen though.

I think owners often look to reducing greens whereas more likely it will be the nuggets. Excel do have a bit of a reputation for bunnies having ceco issues so maybe you could switch over to science selective. ? Incase it is the hay I'dmake sure your provide 2, one your boy likes & another for Fifi. Presumably he'll ignore hers. If she doesn't find it as tasty as him she might not be getting enough fibre.

Although I've had her many years my little old lady Mouse has developed a more sensitive tum recently. I was doing multiple bum baths daily. About 2 weeks ago I decided to strip her diet back to several hays, loads of forage I pick, herbs & nuggets from haybox (no soya). This has worked for Mousey. I think I'm on day 12 of no bum baths. She has mobility issues. If dietary modifications don't help I'd suggest a check up. Mobility issues are often cited, dental too

Good luck. I hope it gets better
I'll definitely try offering both kinds of hay, but I'm pretty sure they're both mad for the greener one. Thank you!

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I'll definitely try offering both kinds of hay, but I'm pretty sure they're both mad for the greener one. Thank you!

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Maybe she'll eat the other one too and get whatever she needs to start eating the poos again. Thanks so much Joeyand boo

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Your buns have fantastic names! And I have to confess to having had a guilty giggle at their trashing antics!
I can only take credit for Aboleth TBH ;P It's always something when they DO trash stuff, they're normally relatively sedate :lol: Chibbs had a massive go at the newspaper in the litter trays and on the floor when we first got her, I was worried I was going to have to remove newspaper entirely but turned out she was just 'playing' with it, so a few balls later and it's MOSTLY stopped. New bunnies always make it hard: once you've got used to how two work, when one goes and the dynamic changes, however subtly, it takes everyone (and everybun) time to adjust. We still call Chibbs weird because Lopsy and Aboleth were quite similar and she's so different :lol: She had to learn to reach up and eat for a start :love:
 
I agree with all that has been said by j&b and KK. I would add that in my view Fifi not eating her cecos is something you will be able to get on top of. The weeing outside of the tray is probably also fixable, but might take a bit longer.

If I've understood correctly, they are both liking the new hay? If so, and they both eat lots of it, then I doubt the hay is responsible. Although you can come back to try changing this, if other changes don't make a difference. It also does no harm to offer more than one type of hay anyway, so if you want quick results rather than establishing what the problem was, then offer two different types.

Much more likely is the issue of pellets. I would definitely change the pellets to Science Selective. Also how many are you feeding? Too many will certainly cause an issue with cecos. If you feed them their pellets together, could it be that Fifi is eating more than her fair share and so more than previously?

I hope that you get this sorted. I can really understand how distressing it is. Lovely that you now have a bonded pair though :love:
 
I agree with the advice you have been given :wave: please don’t feel bad for saying you are finding some things stressful. How long have they been bonded now? Sometimes during and immediately after bonding, and moving or extending territories, it can be a bit of a poo fest! If you can keep hay to litter tray area only, keep sweeping up poops and mopping up any puddles and neutralise with 50/50 vinegar/water, I hope things will settle soon. Sometimes it’s easier to get them trained if the flooring is not carpet or soft furnishings.
 
I can only take credit for Aboleth TBH ;P It's always something when they DO trash stuff, they're normally relatively sedate [emoji38] Chibbs had a massive go at the newspaper in the litter trays and on the floor when we first got her, I was worried I was going to have to remove newspaper entirely but turned out she was just 'playing' with it, so a few balls later and it's MOSTLY stopped. New bunnies always make it hard: once you've got used to how two work, when one goes and the dynamic changes, however subtly, it takes everyone (and everybun) time to adjust. We still call Chibbs weird because Lopsy and Aboleth were quite similar and she's so different [emoji38] She had to learn to reach up and eat for a start :love:
[emoji23][emoji23][emoji23]

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I agree with all that has been said by j&b and KK. I would add that in my view Fifi not eating her cecos is something you will be able to get on top of. The weeing outside of the tray is probably also fixable, but might take a bit longer.

If I've understood correctly, they are both liking the new hay? If so, and they both eat lots of it, then I doubt the hay is responsible. Although you can come back to try changing this, if other changes don't make a difference. It also does no harm to offer more than one type of hay anyway, so if you want quick results rather than establishing what the problem was, then offer two different types.

Much more likely is the issue of pellets. I would definitely change the pellets to Science Selective. Also how many are you feeding? Too many will certainly cause an issue with cecos. If you feed them their pellets together, could it be that Fifi is eating more than her fair share and so more than previously?

I hope that you get this sorted. I can really understand how distressing it is. Lovely that you now have a bonded pair though :love:
Thank you so much Omi for your help [emoji120]
Yep, they are both eating the hay. They have about a tablespoon of the pellets every day, but this has always been the case so I'm a bit foxed really. I'll make sure fifi isn't eating any Christopher Robins share too.
It's a great comfort to hear that you think I can get on top of the ceco thing ( I didn't even know it was called that)

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I agree with the advice you have been given :wave: please don’t feel bad for saying you are finding some things stressful. How long have they been bonded now? Sometimes during and immediately after bonding, and moving or extending territories, it can be a bit of a poo fest! If you can keep hay to litter tray area only, keep sweeping up poops and mopping up any puddles and neutralise with 50/50 vinegar/water, I hope things will settle soon. Sometimes it’s easier to get them trained if the flooring is not carpet or soft furnishings.
Thank you so much Zoobec :)
They've been bonded for about 3 weeks, so it's all still very new for all of us

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I agree with the advice you have been given :wave: please don’t feel bad for saying you are finding some things stressful. How long have they been bonded now? Sometimes during and immediately after bonding, and moving or extending territories, it can be a bit of a poo fest! If you can keep hay to litter tray area only, keep sweeping up poops and mopping up any puddles and neutralise with 50/50 vinegar/water, I hope things will settle soon. Sometimes it’s easier to get them trained if the flooring is not carpet or soft furnishings.
It's a great comfort to hear that a "poo fest" is something that can happen when things are new. They are on a stone floor. There is under floor heating, but I don't think that would affect anything

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Feeling so much better after reading your responses guys. Thank you so much [emoji173][emoji173][emoji173]

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Just caught your thread, can't offer any additional advice, but sounds like you are doing a wonderful job with your bunnies. They are very lucky to have you looking out for them, and their welfare. Good luck, I'm sure they'll get there x
 
Just caught your thread, can't offer any additional advice, but sounds like you are doing a wonderful job with your bunnies. They are very lucky to have you looking out for them, and their welfare. Good luck, I'm sure they'll get there x
Thank you Pets mum [emoji173][emoji173][emoji173]

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Hello and sorry I'm a bit late to this thread. I kind of feel the guilty one here as I had suggested a hus-bun for Fifi.
I am plased that you have got Christopher and that you have a bond between Fifi and Christopher. Although I am also saddened that things have not gone as smoothly as you would be wishing right now. I wish I had some answers to help you with the problems you are having. All I can offer you is some thoughts.
I'm still only about 4 weeks into my bond with Flo and Leo and the first few days were an absolute poop-a-rama in the kitchen/diner. And most mornings I still find some sticky poop bomb left in the middle of the floor. By and large both Flo and Leo are pretty good with their toilet - Flo even comes in from the garden to go to the toilet area but during the night, they both feel it's fair game to place little bum mines all over the floor. It's getting better but I know how you feel.
Diet wise, perhaps you could look at something called Pro-fibre which is something I give both bunnies every day. It helps maintain gut movement by giving them additional fibre that some pellets don't. I also use slecet for Flo and Leo and the combination tends to work.
I fully appreciate your worries about fly strike as we approach the warmer weather so I hope that you can resolve the gut and poop problems quickly.
It may also be just some settling in by Christoher - without knowing how they were bonded, one or both might be still stressed in some way from the process. Stress could be causing the abnormal poop issues. Christopher is also going through alot of emotional changes from where he was to where he is now. He has to find a way to adjust to things and it will take him some time. It will also take time for Fifi to adjust to the new friendship as her life has now changed dramatically.
Christopher might be kicking because it's his natural defence. Some bunnies react like this and hopefully as he begins to settle and get used to being stroked and comfoted by you. he will reduce his reactions.
Our new bun Flo was a boxer to begin with but working intensely with her over the time she has been here, she has reduced the boxing and is now beginning to settle. She still has the occasional boxing reaction - which I think is just her defence mechanism. We were talking about her just a few hours ago and how Flo is still quite nervous at times when she is around us. She doesn't present as relaxed as Leo is but it's only been 7 weeks and we don't know what memories she is harbouring from her past. The main thing is, and something you also indicated, is that the friendship is for the bunnies, not for us.
As Christpher and Fifi develop their friendship and move forward, I hope that their journey together grown strong with their love and also supported by the endless patience and love that you give them.
Owning rabbits is never easy - it has it's ups and downs. Just when we think we have something something else pops up just to keep us on our toes.
Can't wait for the photos of Christopher and Fifi.
Craig xx
 
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