InspectorMorse
Wise Old Thumper
How utterly awful
I really hope that she will improve now
Did the Vet run some blood tests
I would imagine her renal function has been impacted by the toxin overload
Sending millions of vibes for her x
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Poorly Freja :-(
- Thread starter dollyanna
- Start date
How utterly awful
I really hope that she will improve now
Did the Vet run some blood tests
I would imagine her renal function has been impacted by the toxin overload
Sending millions of vibes for her x
a reader of books
Warren Veteran
Oh, poor Freja! That must've been so painful. 
I'm so glad the vet the vet took it out when he thought it was only a tiny bit of food. Gosh, no wonder she's been struggling so much. I hope her mouth heals soon so she'll be a lot more comfortable eating. It's so good that she's been improving already. Sending her so many vibes. 
I'm so glad the vet the vet took it out when he thought it was only a tiny bit of food. Gosh, no wonder she's been struggling so much. I hope her mouth heals soon so she'll be a lot more comfortable eating. It's so good that she's been improving already. Sending her so many vibes. 
Sorry for slow updates - between going back to work, fitting in all their meds and syringe feeds and getting everyone else cared for I'm not online much!
We're making slow but relatively steady progress I think. She went into stasis again Monday night just after I'd given the vet an update and said she was doing well but we pulled it back quite quickly with some extra fluids and syringe feeds - I think it was a combination of overestimating how much food she was eating for herself and her hurting her tongue the day before. She was just about holding her own so I was trying to reduce her stress by not feeding, but she'd got cocky and tried eating a fibastick Sunday night and watching the video I think it must have spiked her and made her sore again and knocked her eating.
She's back on emeprid now just to try and keep her on a level, and we've gone back to 3 times a syringe feeds, aiming for 200ml each time but she doesn't always take it. She is at least taking just well soaked pellets, I no longer need to liquidise them smoother as well, makes life a little easier! We're using the Beaphar pellets which are quite small and 85% hay and her gut is working well.
She's mostly eating cavallo nero, not sure why but that seems to be the easiest for her, she'll take a bit of kale and a bit of herbs but cavallo is definitely the easiest.
Weighed her today, she's still 7.2kg which is still over a kg under where she should be - she is noticeably skinny even with her thick coatbut until she starts eating more herself I can't do a lot about it. It's impossible to syringe feed enough to do more than maintain her. I might try grinding some sunflower seeds up to boost the calorie without adding too much bulk. She's already used to them too.
She has started eating the Loop treats again which is her favourite, but only if you break them into 6 pieces and give them one at a time, and she is less than half her usual speed eating them.
I can only imagine the pain she's been in and is still in - despite plenty of pain meds - and the unknown damage inside her tongue from the wire moving around. I think it's still quite swollen from what little I can see from the outside.
IM - her bloods, amazingly, came back really good other than very minor blips that are explained by the weight loss and reduced nutrition. Certainly nothing to worry about.
We're making slow but relatively steady progress I think. She went into stasis again Monday night just after I'd given the vet an update and said she was doing well
but we pulled it back quite quickly with some extra fluids and syringe feeds - I think it was a combination of overestimating how much food she was eating for herself and her hurting her tongue the day before. She was just about holding her own so I was trying to reduce her stress by not feeding, but she'd got cocky and tried eating a fibastick Sunday night and watching the video I think it must have spiked her and made her sore again and knocked her eating.She's back on emeprid now just to try and keep her on a level, and we've gone back to 3 times a syringe feeds, aiming for 200ml each time but she doesn't always take it. She is at least taking just well soaked pellets, I no longer need to liquidise them smoother as well, makes life a little easier! We're using the Beaphar pellets which are quite small and 85% hay and her gut is working well.
She's mostly eating cavallo nero, not sure why but that seems to be the easiest for her, she'll take a bit of kale and a bit of herbs but cavallo is definitely the easiest.
Weighed her today, she's still 7.2kg which is still over a kg under where she should be - she is noticeably skinny even with her thick coat
but until she starts eating more herself I can't do a lot about it. It's impossible to syringe feed enough to do more than maintain her. I might try grinding some sunflower seeds up to boost the calorie without adding too much bulk. She's already used to them too. She has started eating the Loop treats again which is her favourite, but only if you break them into 6 pieces and give them one at a time, and she is less than half her usual speed eating them.
I can only imagine the pain she's been in and is still in - despite plenty of pain meds - and the unknown damage inside her tongue from the wire moving around. I think it's still quite swollen from what little I can see from the outside.
IM - her bloods, amazingly, came back really good other than very minor blips that are explained by the weight loss and reduced nutrition. Certainly nothing to worry about.
InspectorMorse
Wise Old Thumper
Glad to hear that her bloods are mostly OK. I really hope she will soon be able to eat a lot more for herself. Not sure if I have mentioned Emeraid before. IME it’s much better than CC and the Intensive Care formula mixes to a pure liquid, looks a bit like oat milk. No bits in it at all. Might be something to add in to her diet.
emeraid.com
emeraid.com
EmerAid Intensive Care Herbivore - EmerAidVet
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emeraid.com
EmerAid Herbivore Sustain - EmerAidVet
Where to Buy EmerAid Sustain Herbivore® EmerAid ® Sustain ™ Herbivore is a therapeutic diet scientifically designed to support herbivorous mammals, including rabbits, guinea pigs, and chinchillas, and herbivorous reptiles, such as adult iguanas, all tortoises, and some turtles, recovering from...
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bunny momma
Wise Old Thumper
I am sorry she had a setback, yet glad she is back on track and eating some things on her own. Sending vibes she will heal now that the awful wire has been removed from her tongue.
Well, until yesterday things were going slowly but steadily better - Friday night she ate loads overnight (advantage of having an immobile bun is that it's very easy to leave a slightly separate pile that he can't reach but she can without it being entirely separate!) and was eating well during the day, asked for a feed at lunchtime so I obliged - I thought I'd drop a feed as she was eating so well - and she took it happily. We skipped the 6pm feed but come nighttime she was clearly after more so she had a big feed that night. Not sure if it was the bigger feed, or whether it was just a slow effect of stopping the emerprid on Friday, but last night we had very few poos and she didn't eat much, she really fought me for her lunchtime feed despite that which is odd, and this evening her poos had gone tiny and very very few so she got jabbed with my emergency dose today.
I don't know if she just needs more support with emeprid until she is fully eating by herself as every time we take her off she goes downhill (within 24hrs and then 48hrs, so maybe that's an improvement of sorts), or if - my nightmare - there is a piece of bitten off wire somewhere else. She doesn't really show signs of that, no real signs of pain as opposed to general discomfort, but she's really grumpy today and fighting me with every feed. Maybe it's as simple as she needs the fibre of the feeds to continue until she is decidedly eating hay or similar herself enough, and I think she's really lost her confidence in eating after so long hurting, and so many things associated with the pain now. I did try fresh grass yesterday but she had none of it. She will eat cow parsley but it's very sparse for the amounts we need for them - oh how I wish it was summer and we had fresh forage in abundance!!
Hoping she picks up overnight and I'll email the vet first thing to get more emeprid at the very least.
I don't know if she just needs more support with emeprid until she is fully eating by herself as every time we take her off she goes downhill (within 24hrs and then 48hrs, so maybe that's an improvement of sorts), or if - my nightmare - there is a piece of bitten off wire somewhere else. She doesn't really show signs of that, no real signs of pain as opposed to general discomfort, but she's really grumpy today and fighting me with every feed. Maybe it's as simple as she needs the fibre of the feeds to continue until she is decidedly eating hay or similar herself enough, and I think she's really lost her confidence in eating after so long hurting, and so many things associated with the pain now. I did try fresh grass yesterday but she had none of it. She will eat cow parsley but it's very sparse for the amounts we need for them - oh how I wish it was summer and we had fresh forage in abundance!!
Hoping she picks up overnight and I'll email the vet first thing to get more emeprid at the very least.
InspectorMorse
Wise Old Thumper
Is she still on pain relief ?
Very much so.
bunny momma
Wise Old Thumper
In my experience, I found it best to reduce motility drugs rather than stopping them completely, especially when a bunny was getting them for many days after a stasis event.
Though given the timing, it was likely that she ate too quickly or too much at night.
Perhaps she is not chewing her food enough when she eats and is not producing enough saliva? Is she drinking enough?
Sending her more vibes.
Though given the timing, it was likely that she ate too quickly or too much at night.
Perhaps she is not chewing her food enough when she eats and is not producing enough saliva? Is she drinking enough?
Sending her more vibes.
I don't think it's possible for her to have eaten too much or too quickly, because even though she's eating it is so very little compared to what she needs. And today is the first time I've seen her eat herbs at close to normal speed. But I think you're right, the emeprid needs tailing off more gradually - but I've spoken to our vet and said I want to keep her on emeprid until she is eating normally ie off syringe feeds and clearly eating hay, and then reduce it more gradually and he's agreed with that so we've got 5 more days worth for now. She is night and day on it - this morning's feed was slow and defensive, but after we picked up the meds and gave her the evening dose (24hrs since yesterday's) she has been great, eating faster, eating relatively well - my scale of relatively well is very distorted!! - and took her syringe feeds very nicely.
I've bought some brand new fine/soft herbal hays today, just from PAH but they are completely novel to her and I'm hoping that's enough to catch her interest. She's had a nosy and thrown it around but not clearly seen her eat it yet.
But she's back to eating a reasonable pile of herbs and cavallo, and she's happy again, so for now that's enough for me.
Last night she did start actually grinding her syringe feeds for the first time too, so it's taking longer to feed but she is eating them better. She's also showing her tongue much more during feeds, stretching it out to lick her lips for the first time. I am feeling happier that her tongue and mouth are pretty much healed, we just have to get her confidence back with trying foods that have caused her so much pain in recent times I think. We feed such a variety that it's nigh on impossible to find novel foods at this time of year that aren't potentially associated with pain.
I've bought some brand new fine/soft herbal hays today, just from PAH but they are completely novel to her and I'm hoping that's enough to catch her interest. She's had a nosy and thrown it around but not clearly seen her eat it yet.
But she's back to eating a reasonable pile of herbs and cavallo, and she's happy again, so for now that's enough for me.
Last night she did start actually grinding her syringe feeds for the first time too, so it's taking longer to feed but she is eating them better. She's also showing her tongue much more during feeds, stretching it out to lick her lips for the first time. I am feeling happier that her tongue and mouth are pretty much healed, we just have to get her confidence back with trying foods that have caused her so much pain in recent times I think. We feed such a variety that it's nigh on impossible to find novel foods at this time of year that aren't potentially associated with pain.
a reader of books
Warren Veteran
Keeping her on Emeprid until she's eating normally and then gradually reducing it sounds like the best plan to me, too. I know that when my bunnies have had gut slowdown, the vets always want them to be on Emeprid until they're eating completely normally. I hope she'll start to nibble her new hay a bit. I'm glad she's eating her greens, though, and that she's happy. 
That's wonderful that she's started to chew and use her tongue more, too, when you're syringe feeding her. I hope she can find some confidence again in trying foods that have hurt her. Sending her so many vibes. She's been through a lot, poor girl.
That's wonderful that she's started to chew and use her tongue more, too, when you're syringe feeding her. I hope she can find some confidence again in trying foods that have hurt her. Sending her so many vibes. She's been through a lot, poor girl.Finally!! Some real progress. We've seen her steadily eating more and a greater variety, but dropping syringe feeds reduced output too much. We dropped painkillers end of last week, no change. Monday we dropped the morning dose of emeprid, no change. Over the past 5 days we slowly reduced her syringe feeds as he eating of things like pellets increase, and she has been syringe feed free for 2 days now, this is day 3. Yesterday was good output - still a lot less than normal, but good enough - but today wasn't quite so good. BUT - she has finally gained some weight, 220g in the past week.
I've got a few more injections left so I'm going to keep going with them until they run out and hopefully by then she can stand on her own 4 feet again. As long as her output is normal, albeit reduced, and her weight gain stays steady, then we're good. She's got a lot to catch up on, at a rate of 200g a week it will be about 6-7 weeks before she's back at her healthy lean weight but that's ok. Spring will have sprung by then too which will help!
She's still eating me out of house and home in herbs and cavallo, and has added a huge variety of dried forage, but she is also now nibbling at hay finally. She's still not taking some foods - carrots, broccoli stalks, fruit - and is very fussy about taking things from your hand but I think it will come in time as she regains confidence in food.
I've got a few more injections left so I'm going to keep going with them until they run out and hopefully by then she can stand on her own 4 feet again. As long as her output is normal, albeit reduced, and her weight gain stays steady, then we're good. She's got a lot to catch up on, at a rate of 200g a week it will be about 6-7 weeks before she's back at her healthy lean weight but that's ok. Spring will have sprung by then too which will help!
She's still eating me out of house and home in herbs and cavallo, and has added a huge variety of dried forage, but she is also now nibbling at hay finally. She's still not taking some foods - carrots, broccoli stalks, fruit - and is very fussy about taking things from your hand but I think it will come in time as she regains confidence in food.
Yeah, I think I can only confidently say her mouth and tongue were healed about a week ago, when she started yawning, using her tongue more, and showing much better jaw movement. But it seems like she just got scared of eating almost anything because it hurt for so long, either to chew, or because it stung on the wounds, and with very little novel food to offer we've just had to wait until she's got brave enough with each successive attempt to try things again. Buying the new forage was an attempt to increase her eating with things that she hasn't associated with this episode, once I knew she could eat dried leaves (plantain) happily.This all sounds very positive.
The tongue has got to be terribly hard to heal, especially with it always being in a "wet" area and pretty much always on the move...(eating wise in bunnies at least)
More vibes for lovely Freja. xxxxx
But carrots are still an absolute no, and broccoli stalks, though she is now eating the entire cavallo and kale leaf and not leaving the stalks everywhere!
