Pebbles not eating hay- anyone with same experience? update -teeth are improving!

[fruitandnutcake]

It has been nearly 2 weeks since pebbles had his dental under GA. I have been weighing him, and watching him closely and I've noticed he won't touch hay or grass. he still feels bony, but has slightly increased his weight from 1.62Kg to 1.77kg, back to 1.65Kg. I have reduced his pellets down from 16g to 3g a day ( vet said he can go without pellets, but reducing down slowly by 1g a day) with unlimited meadow hay (half a bale in run) and a hanging basket full of burgess timothy hay with marigold. He will eat weeds, carrots, apples and bananas (small quantities) and he loves fenugreek crunchies. I have brought a few different bags from the "naturals" and "woodlands" range eg. Ginko plus and Chinchillas floral feast as these seem to look more like hay - but he won't touch these at all. he won't touch ready grass and I've ordered a "selection pack" from the hay company - hopefully it will arrive tomorrow.

What else can I do - even if I cut out all pellets/fenugreek crunchies/fruit/vegetables and weeds he probably still won't eat hay! What do I do next???

Anyone had a bunny like this?

 

[fruitandnutcake]

just in case this was missed - my hay selection still hasn't arrived - hopefully today.

pebbles still isn't eating anything other than a few nuggets - should I increase his nuggets if he won't eat anything else?

 

[fruitandnutcake]

A week later, and Pebbles hasn't touched any hay - the other bunnies have munched their way through the hay experts selection packs but Pebbles just isn't interested. I had cut out apple/carrot and banana from his diet hoping that would encourage him to eat hay - but no.

pebbles weight has dropped from 1.6kg to 1.4 Kg, so I have now put him back on to pellets and dry wholemeal bread, which he is eating. He will still eat weeds and fruit, so it isn't a case that he can't eat anything.

So what is the next best thing (nutritional wise) to hay - and do I just assume he will never eat hay again and resign myself to the fact he is going to need regular dentals from now on.

At the moment I'm having to separate him from Poppy when I feed him, so she doesn't eat his food! I'm going too take him to vets again just to see if they can check his teeth to make sure they don't need doing again after just 3 weeks.

 

[Indiechic]

I wouldn't recommend giving him bread (thats just my personal view due to bloating)

Could the hay be too stalky? I found my dental bunny bailey tended to eat softer smaller strands of hay rather than the stalky longer stuff i gave the others. I used to use oat hay & timothy as he wouldn't touch meadow no matter what.
I found decreasing his pellets didn't make him eat hay, nor did decreasing fruit & veg. Sometimes bunnies just decide they don't want it & its hard to force them xx

Sorry there were no replies to your original post. Hope your bunny starts feeling better soon xx

 

[biscandmatt1]

it is possible for them to need a dental again that quickly so it could be that. i suppose it could be possible some spurs were missed during the dental maybe? i remember reading somewhere that maybe a bit of bruising could have happened aswell. did he get pain relief afterwards? if not, maybe he tried to eat hay and it hurt him so now he doesn't want to?

if his weight has dropped again then i would go back to the vets for a full check up.

did he eat much hay before the dental? what about the fruit he is having? has he been for any vet treatment before - could the experience have stressed him?

could it be he isn't keen on any of the hays you have tried? they can be super fussy some bunnies can't they! :roll: maybe try some soft hay and some stalkier hay and see if he prefers one or the other. what about adding some tasty dried herbs to the hay aswell that he will have to burrow through to find?

i would be concerned by the weight loss though and think there possibly may be something else going on.

do you go to a rabbit vet?

just thinking out loud really.. so probably covered things you have already considered.

sorry you got no replies to your original post aswell.

eta: i agree that bread is not a good idea and may cause problems for his tummy.

eta: on the galens garden website and auntysallys website, they do hay in pellet form. i know this won't help with the grinding down of the teeth, but it might help nutritionally???

 

[fruitandnutcake]

Thanks for the replies

I'm phoning the vets as soon as they open to see if they can look at him today. I'm not sure whether he was actually eating hay or not before his dental, but I suspect he wasn't.

He loves soft milk thistle, hawthorn, ox-tongue and dandelion, carrots, cabbage, fruit - so I'm considering blending hay and banana to see if he'll eat that.

I have tried: normal meadow hay, burgess excel hays with dandelion/marigold and the other one. The selection pack from hay Experts: Western Timothy Hay, Orchard Grass, readiGrass, Alpine Meadow Hay, Pure Pastures Meadow hay, Oat Wheat & Barley

He is a very laid back rabbit - doesn't seem particularly bothered by vets - he had a tumour removed in July, followed by hernia op 10 days later - so could be tumours returning, but he has been checked over each time he has vaccinations and at last dental, and they can't feel any tumours. And his weight has only dropped since I reduced his pellets over last week.

I'm going to increase the pellets up again and see if weight goes back on - if it does then I know it is just a food issue.

I will cut out the bread - but he does love it - he'll go in the fridge and pull out the bread bag just to get to it!! I just wanted to make sure that he was still eating so I gave him his favourite things!

He passed a load of squidgy poos this morning - he is indoors at the moment so I can keep an eye on what he is eating and what poos he is passing! Lovely!

 

[fruitandnutcake]

forgot to say I also tried VitaKrart Alfalfa Slims - and he had a little nibble of one.

 

[biscandmatt1]

i hope the vets goes ok. let us know what they say

 

[fruitandnutcake]

Just weighed him again and his weight has gone up by approximately 100g since yesterday! whew! I think it is just a case of increasing his pellets to a suitable amount now and trying him on pelleted hay - he won't eat alfalfa bales either.

 

[fruitandnutcake]

Just took Pebbles to vet, and she had a good look at his molars, and they have grown again in just 2 and a half weeks. She has given him painkiller to last 24 hours, and I have some antibiotics to give him each day. If he doesn't eat hay over the next 24 hours then we will just increase his pellets till his weight has increased and he is strong enough to go for another dental. However, I'm not sure if it fair for him to have to go through this every few weeks.

 

[ripminnie]

Hi :wave: if you have decreased his pellets quite a lot and he isn't eating hay, he's bound to lose weight! I would definitely give him more pellets, maybe even switch to junior ones as they will put weight on him more quickly. Porridge oats are also good for putting weight on, and bunnies usually love them. I hope he starts eating some hay soon though! Sending loads of vibes for Pebbles x

 

[Tamsin]

The trouble is, as you know, whilst he's not eating hay, his molars will grow much faster. So whilst he might need a dental once a month on no hay, if you can increase the wear, it might be you can increase the gap between dentals.

Have you tried him on fresh grass? It sounds like he enjoys a god selection of weeds already so this may go down well. People tend to think of hay as being important to tooth wear because it feels dry and tough but grass is just as good, it's actually the roughness of the surface that's important so although grass is soft and bendy it wears just as well.

If he will eat grass, then I would gradually built up the quantity of this to the levels that you would feed hay in. Once he's eating that, and the weeds/leaves, you can then reduce the pellets and veggies. That should maximise the amount of wear that his teeth get.

I think you'll need to get him on that sort of diet before you can really tell what sort of pattern of dentals he will need.

 

[fruitandnutcake]

He has been out on grass a lot, and doesn't seem to eat it - he isn't even touching his fenugreek crunchies at the moment. I'm just trying to find the best food to wear his teeth down now. I'm guessing harder foods like pellets and fenugreek crunchies are better than fruit & veg. I'll keep giving him access to lots of hay and grass and weeds - hopefully that will help.

 

[Tamsin]

No, it's not about harder, with that sort of food they crush it and it's gone. You need food has a rough surface and moves the teeth back and forth like hay, grass and rough leaves. These are also low calorie food so they need to eat more of them and also high water content so again they'll need to eat more to fill up.

If you pull a piece of grass through your fingers, it catches, that's tiny little hooks on the grass surface.. they are what wears the teeth.

A lot of veg doesn't have the same properties. Take carrot, that requires more chewing than say a grape, because it's 'harder' but because it doesn't have rough surface it causes less wear. Each bite also contains more volume than grass so less chewing per volume.

The absolute best for wear would be just grass and weeds, plus tough leaves such as blackberry. As she's under weight, I would keep up with pellets/crunchies temporarily for the calories not the wear.

Try picking grass and feeding it in with the other leaves/veg or by hand.

 

[fruitandnutcake]

Well, we seem to have made a breakthrough today I made him a mixed salad (rocket, greek cress, mizuna, mustard, pak choi, radish leaves, edible leaf carrot & other bits and small bits of grass) and he munched his way through quickly and even got a few bits of grass in his mouth too, so I made him a large bowl of salad, with more grass in it - and he munched his way through most of it - leaving some grass behind. Now he is sitting on the lawn munching away at the grass - at last! Small bunny steps in the right direction!

 

[Tamsin]

Aww, that's great news! That sort of food will be excellent for his teeth and tummy.

Scamp's weird about grass, I grew him a tray full and he just sat on it.... left it for days and not a nibble. Cut the same grass and offer it by hand and he'll munch away :lol: I guess he just didn't associate the two.

 

[fruitandnutcake]

Unfortunately, due to the strong winds, and now rain, Pebbles stopped going out on the grass and wouldn't eat cut grass I gave him. On the odd occasion I thought I saw him have a nibble on a bit of hay - but I think that was more my wishful thinking :lol::lol:

Anyhow, I have continued to increase his pellets and given him a continuous selection of greens, weeds and salad leaves and am pleased to say he has put on 375g in a week!

We went back to the vets today - and she was impressed - his teeth are looking better, not worse.

So she has given me more antibiotics and I'm to continue daily monitoring of his pellet consumption and weight and hopefully he won't need another op for quite a while.