Is this cruel?

[SOAD]

Awww sorry Jill, but I've had some nasty cuts off some agressives buns, granted I've never needed stiches :lol: , but I just think there has got to be another way. At the end of the day not my bunny, so you have to do whats best I was just answering the question that was asked with what I felt, I wasn't being nasty though

I understand Tree...it's a hard decision as REALLY aggressive buns are rare and if you have a grumpy biter then teeth removal would seem very uneccessary...

Cruel is a strong word anyway I certainly wouldn't say anyone was cruel. Yeah I guess only the people involved can make the right judgement, we shouldn't assume to know other peoples buns. I think people judge different things as being cruel anyway, so what's cruel to one person isn't nessarily cruel to another, if you get me :lol:

 

[toffee]

Hmmm.... I think it would be better for Bitey Bun (sorry don't know his name/haven't been bothered to read post properly ) if he didn't have his teeth removed. Difficult though if he is otherwise friendly.

It might make him angrier if he couldn't bite.

.

 

[Jack's-Jane]

Yes, 'cruel' is a strong word, sorry.
I only used it as it is the word used by Angie in her thread title
NO OFFENCE MEANT



Janex

 

[Jack's-Jane]

Just a shot in the dark here. When he bit you was it....Errrrmmmmm.....around your 'time of the month'
Even though he's had the snip some Buckness will remain and it has been known for Buns to detect differing hormonal smells (NO OFFENCE, WE ALL HAVE THEM!!) around the human's menstrual cycle.

Janex

 

[Angie65]

No offence taken - I wanted views I keep swinging between opinions myself :?

Just to add - bitey bun was going to be put to sleep by a vet & ended up with a woman who ran a cat rescue. He bit her 4 times & was put on RIN. He was on there a while, before I got him. He is only temporary, but to be fair, I don't think it would be fair to rehome him when he's like this. He could kill someone (could I just say OW :lol: ), & maybe he just needs to be NOT shunted around for a bit. :lol:

Louise - usually I'd agree with leaving him alone & not getting in his way - this is how I'm with Smirnoff :lol: - he's a nipper (but not a biter), & sulks for ages if he gets picked up!!! But Calel runs AT you, so it's not a case of avoiding him, if he's not in a friendly mood, you can't get near him/near his water/partner anything. If he is, you can give him nose rubs & he shuts his eyes! (So cute!)

I'm not gonna be rushing into having his teeth removed (Only had him 5 weeks ish?) - it's more of a "if all else fails.....is it cruel?" - & I agree with the "he's expressing himself" remark. there is SOME reason why he's doing this!! I just don't know what!! I can open & shut the door fast, I can push him away with my (welly-enclosed) foot (NOT my wrist! NOT my wrist), but it seems a shame for him to miss out on the human-rabbit interaction bits that he enjoys.

Never occured to me that Treacle could be in danger :? Will watch em closely.

& re other buns - apart from the babies (9 weeks old), there's no un-neutered males here, & he's in a different room. & I change clothes before I go near him (or should I say ADD clothes :lol: )


AND JANE!! YES!! Right! Easily solved: Pill Injection!! :lol:
You have a lot of experience with ill buns (I've met 2 abscesses ) so I don't honestly know the Ins & Outs of Living without Teeth, & until Bitey-bun I might have considered this to be Not-for-the-rabbits benefit :?

Anyway, gonna check out a few more websites - found a good one the other day re aggression, so I'm sure there's loads of other things to try.

Thanks guys for your views

 

[Leanne]

I don't think it is fair to remove his teeth. Firstly, he is obviously still having trouble adjusting to his new life & may seem bold & relaxed most of the time but he obviously gets worried & attacks. It could be the smallest thing that makes him fear aggressive such as a sound you can't even hear! Secondly, to put a rabbit through such a big op, and it will be as the teeth & roots are healthy & it will be a nasty op in my opinion is cruel (sorry). I think its just a matter of time & he will slowly become less temperamental. I have living proof of such a rabbit. Vinnie was a year old when I got him, he came from a breeder who kept him locked in a hutch behind another hutch 24/7 & let children clean himout, he was taken to be pts because he would bite so hard. He would literally come running at me too & grab whatever he could. The problem is that with any animal, when it is trapped (even if in a fairly big garden) the animal can't run so its next defence mechanism is fight. Thats all he is doing. It will be erratic like this for a fair while im afraid but do persevere. Vinnie 10 years on is the sweetest, most affectionate bun ever! It took about a year in all for him to finally stop biting. I have scars on my legs from where he would swing from it like a crazed pitbull! Maybe back off with so much contact & take it slower with him? When you change the litter trays or do anything else he is threatened by, give him a small tasty treat next to where you are doing the task at the start of the task so that he will then associate the task as a good thing. When you are done, just walk away with no contact or sound so he sees that you are not interested in him...
Its worth the savaging trust me

 

[Angie65]

Thanks I am hoping time will help him. He sounds like he had a similar history as your bun :?

Although he's meant to be temporary - if he's never to be re-homed I guess, i can carry on as we are for as long as necessary. It's not really about him biting me - it's about his future forever home. He's not gonna ever get one is he, the way he is? So he'll be staying. So that's 14 permanents.

Well. At least i can use my right hand now. :shock: :lol:

 

[Gem]

Although he's meant to be temporary - if he's never to be re-homed I guess, i can carry on as we are for as long as necessary. It's not really about him biting me - it's about his future forever home. He's not gonna ever get one is he, the way he is?

If someone came along that could give him a home would you rehome him?
:?

 

[Angie65]

Although he's meant to be temporary - if he's never to be re-homed I guess, i can carry on as we are for as long as necessary. It's not really about him biting me - it's about his future forever home. He's not gonna ever get one is he, the way he is?

If someone came along that could give him a home would you rehome him?
:?

Not until he's no longer biting. I think he needs stability.

 

[raine]

Angie, good luck with your decisions. Despite your severe injury from him, its commendable that you still are trying to help him.

 

[Angie65]

Angie, good luck with your decisions. Despite your severe injury from him, its commendable that you still are trying to help him.

I'm into extreme sports :shock: :lol:

 

[Leanne]

Awww well he is lucky to have you

This will probably sound terrible but I have been thinking about the inevitable recently as Vinnie is now looking his age & I will obviously be VERY happy if he see's another spring, but if he goes before your bitey boy has been rehomed, I will be looking for a new husband for Lovage when the time comes and would much rather take on an aggressive bun that has little or no hope of being homed such as he....
so if you are stuck & need to downsize at that point in time I will pm you!

Oh I feel evil for saying that, but you know what I mean???

I wish they could all live forever although we would have to too!!!

 

[sgprescue]

Have you thought of having him scanned to look for female sex organs? It seems hemaphrodite bunnies are a bit more common these days...........it would explain the aggression :wink:

 

[LurcherGirl]

Sorry, yes, I think it is cruel... Just like declawing rabbits and cats or debarking dogs is... It is for our convenience, not for their own good! Apart from that, you are only removing the symptoms of biting, but not the cause... The bunny will still be frustrated, frightened, have a medical problem or whatever else is the cause of this biting!

I feel that you just need to take precautions when dealing with him and perhaps keeping contact with him to a minimum. He has a bunny partner, so doesn't need close human company really.

Vera

 

[Jack's-Jane]

Sorry, yes, I think it is cruel... Just like declawing rabbits and cats or debarking dogs is... It is for our convenience, not for their own good! Apart from that, you are only removing the symptoms of biting, but not the cause... The bunny will still be frustrated, frightened, have a medical problem or whatever else is the cause of this biting!

I feel that you just need to take precautions when dealing with him and perhaps keeping contact with him to a minimum. He has a bunny partner, so doesn't need close human company really.

Vera

Good grief do dogs get 'de-barked'.... :shock: :x :x

Janex

 

[LurcherGirl]

Sorry, yes, I think it is cruel... Just like declawing rabbits and cats or debarking dogs is... It is for our convenience, not for their own good! Apart from that, you are only removing the symptoms of biting, but not the cause... The bunny will still be frustrated, frightened, have a medical problem or whatever else is the cause of this biting!

I feel that you just need to take precautions when dealing with him and perhaps keeping contact with him to a minimum. He has a bunny partner, so doesn't need close human company really.

Vera

Good grief do dogs get 'de-barked'.... :shock: :x :x

Janex

Absolutely. I am on a pyrenean mailing list and there was a discussion just the other day where someone said they had their dog debarked... It is an American thing...

I would also do a full health scan of the bunny including blood tests and x-rays and scans... in dogs all sorts of medical reasons can cause aggression; ie. thyroid problems, tumours (particularly brain/head), hormone imbalance etc. I am sure it is the same in bunnies.

Vera

 

[Gem]

It seems hemaphrodite bunnies are a bit more common these days...........it would explain the aggression :wink:

Really :?:

I have a hemaphrodite bun and he/she's the soppiest thing ever :?

 

[Jack's-Jane]

OH NO, the Poll is 50/50.... :shock: Some help we are on decision making.... :roll:

Janex

 

[Sarah]

As I was the one who originally saw this bunny here is some history on him.

He came from a "rescue", run by an elderly lady who, although well meaning, kept the bunnies in small hutches, with no exercise AT ALL. He went to bite her (presumbly to defend his tiny space) and was hit.

I have taken five bunnies from there since June, all of which have required veterinary treatment, and three of which have now died.

I was asked if I would take him as he was basically given four weeks to live and, as I had no room, my friend offered to have him on a temporary basis. She was terrified of him, did not handle him at all whilst he was with her and, as Angie says, was bitten several times. She used a net to catch him to return him to his hutch.

I was and am very grateful to Angie for taking him on and I admire her greatly for the dedication she has shown to him. However I do feel ultimately responsible for him and if at any time in the future he needs to be rehomed for whatever reason, he (and his girlfriend) will be welcome here.


Sarah

[/u]

 

[Azraelm]

He sounds like an incredibly aggressive bunn, much worse than Hann in any case :?, whom I have a scar on my wrist from.

Must say tho, I really hate the idea of teeth removal unless for a medical reason of course....as others have said, it will not change his behaviour, and i think that's what needs working on.

Perhaps he could go to a home where he will not be pushed into being handled and can just be the kind of bunn who is left to be?