Coccidia - Baycox and Gut Stasis

[Jinny]

Littleblack, my nearly 13yr old, male un-neutered, Netherland Dwarf, nearly went to the Bridge again on Thursday night. He's been ill a while, and there is more going on with him I believe, but on the last vet visit, the vet identified a build up of Coccidia, and prescribed Baycox.

I followed the directions, and last Thursday night (the day after the 2nd dose that you don't give anything on for the next 5 days), Littleblack developed Gut Stasis, so badly that I could see his intestinal tract through his skin. I followed vet's advice, and quickly administered all the drugs he instructed, and then was told to wait. I massaged his tummy for hours, and after a massive battle, loads of tears, we won, and I pulled him through.

Then the time came around to treat him again. The vet said to go ahead. I did, but this time his reaction on Day 3 was worse. In fact I honestly thought I was going to lose him last night - to the point I messaged friends and told them it's a matter of hours with him. I set to work, but he was in such a bad way, that finally, he was floppy, no swallow reflex, pale skin, slow eye reflex, couldn't even hold his head or body up. I fought to keep emotional control, as I didn't want to stress him out. By massaging his throat and with vocal encouragement, I Syringed 0.6ml of Metatone (I figured maybe the vitamin B might help him), and 0.9ml of Septrin, down his throat, because I thought it might help if he has an infection, and also that he adores the taste of both, and I was clutching at straws.

I lay down in bed next to him, just as we always do, with my nose under his chin, blowing hot air into his chest, told him I was sorry, and I loved him, thanked him for everything, and wished him sweet dreams, as I wrapped my arm around him and continued to gently massage his belly. I dozed off at some point, because like last time, a short time later, I was suddenly awoken by determined licking of my face. When I woke up he binky-ed about (I now know this 'happiness' is the surge of Cortisol, and may not be a sign of true happiness), and he willingly drank re-hydration fluids, and Pro-biotic, and Pre-biotic powders in water, and took 10ml of Critical Care without a fuss. After a while, he started producing pin head sized droppings.

Today I rang the vet. I explained what had happened again, and that if I had not had the Gut stimulant that I had, at home, I know he wouldn't be here today.....and suddenly it clicked....the Baycox. That was the only change in his diet and medication routine. I asked the Vet Nurse, if Baycox could do that, and told her I was unwilling to put him through that agony again. She didn't answer, because maybe they don't know - but a quick Google, finds a few mentions, that in some cases it can cause extreme gut stasis.

I am in no way blaming the vet - he is a good and well respected, bunny savvy vet that has done wonders for us before. However, my real grief with the whole thing is that had I have known this were a possible issue, I would have monitored more closely for the signs, and started treating him sooner, before having a 12 hour battle, emotional and physical, on my hands.

But I really can't complain - he is here and alive, and he is hopping about playing with a cardboard roll at my feet at the moment, smacking me with it, trying to get me to go to bed, so he can snuggle down too.

I guess I just want to know if any of your Bunnies have been on Baycox, and developed Gut Stasis because of it. Just so if the vet isn't aware, then he can have evidence of that case, and hopefully it will save a bunny one day.

 

[Jack's-Jane]

Littleblack, my nearly 13yr old, male un-neutered, Netherland Dwarf, nearly went to the Bridge again on Thursday night. He's been ill a while, and there is more going on with him I believe, but on the last vet visit, the vet identified a build up of Coccidia, and prescribed Baycox.

I followed the directions, and last Thursday night (the day after the 2nd dose that you don't give anything on for the next 5 days), Littleblack developed Gut Stasis, so badly that I could see his intestinal tract through his skin. I followed vet's advice, and quickly administered all the drugs he instructed, and then was told to wait. I massaged his tummy for hours, and after a massive battle, loads of tears, we won, and I pulled him through.

Then the time came around to treat him again. The vet said to go ahead. I did, but this time his reaction on Day 3 was worse. In fact I honestly thought I was going to lose him last night - to the point I messaged friends and told them it's a matter of hours with him. I set to work, but he was in such a bad way, that finally, he was floppy, no swallow reflex, pale skin, slow eye reflex, couldn't even hold his head or body up. I fought to keep emotional control, as I didn't want to stress him out. By massaging his throat and with vocal encouragement, I Syringed 0.6ml of Metatone (I figured maybe the vitamin B might help him), and 0.9ml of Septrin, down his throat, because I thought it might help if he has an infection, and also that he adores the taste of both, and I was clutching at straws.

I lay down in bed next to him, just as we always do, with my nose under his chin, blowing hot air into his chest, told him I was sorry, and I loved him, thanked him for everything, and wished him sweet dreams, as I wrapped my arm around him and continued to gently massage his belly. I dozed off at some point, because like last time, a short time later, I was suddenly awoken by determined licking of my face. When I woke up he binky-ed about (I now know this 'happiness' is the surge of Cortisol, and may not be a sign of true happiness), and he willingly drank re-hydration fluids, and Pro-biotic, and Pre-biotic powders in water, and took 10ml of Critical Care without a fuss. After a while, he started producing pin head sized droppings.

Today I rang the vet. I explained what had happened again, and that if I had not had the Gut stimulant that I had, at home, I know he wouldn't be here today.....and suddenly it clicked....the Baycox. That was the only change in his diet and medication routine. I asked the Vet Nurse, if Baycox could do that, and told her I was unwilling to put him through that agony again. She didn't answer, because maybe they don't know - but a quick Google, finds a few mentions, that in some cases it can cause extreme gut stasis.

I am in no way blaming the vet - he is a good and well respected, bunny savvy vet that has done wonders for us before. However, my real grief with the whole thing is that had I have known this were a possible issue, I would have monitored more closely for the signs, and started treating him sooner, before having a 12 hour battle, emotional and physical, on my hands.

But I really can't complain - he is here and alive, and he is hopping about playing with a cardboard roll at my feet at the moment, smacking me with it, trying to get me to go to bed, so he can snuggle down too.

I guess I just want to know if any of your Bunnies have been on Baycox, and developed Gut Stasis because of it. Just so if the vet isn't aware, then he can have evidence of that case, and hopefully it will save a bunny one day.

I have known of some Rabbits who developed a type of 'colic' during treatment with Baycox. But whether the colic was due to the drug or to the fact that the Rabbits had coccidiosis I dont know. I hope LB has a better day today xx

 

[mabels mum]

My rabbits were on septrin to treat coccidia with no side effects. It could be worth considering that instead if ever needed again.

 

[Santa]

What dosage of baycox has he been on - and was it given neat or diluted with water? There have been cases of adverse reactions thought to be due to a mistranslation between mg/kg and ppm in one of the older rabbit textbooks, meaning that bunnies are being significantly overdosed, so could it be possible that this has happened here? I've also heard that it can sort of 'burn' if given neat without diluting, and I guess that could cause a colicy/pain reaction. I have used baycox without problem before. Septrin can also be used to treat coccidiosis although it is not as effective and requires a longer course, so if you're finding a severe reaction to baycox at the right dosage then it may be that it just doesn't suit your little one, I guess we can all have random adverse reactions to things. I do hope your little one is ok xx

 

[bunny momma]

I am so glad Littleback chose you over the bridge. He is so lucky to have you to give him such good care.

 

[MightyMax]

How stressful for you ......

Sending many vibes for Littleblack so that he continues to get better and improves on the best medication for him ...

 

[Jinny]

Thank you for your replies.

He was on 0.15ml of Baycox 5% solution. I don't know if it was diluted, but I wasn't told to dilute it, so gave the dose as is.

I read some information on here on a brilliant thread on Coccida today. I can't believe it. Pretty much the exact signs of this, were showing in December when I first took bunny to the vet. I actually asked for Septrin as he had been on it before, and had done brilliantly on it, but the vet said no, as he wanted to be cautious, but on the other hand he didn't know what was wrong with Littleblack. I even rang back twice and asked if they thought he should have antibiotics.... but again, I was told that it was best to be cautious. I know I shouldn't be angry at the vet about this whole incident, but at the moment, while I DO trust this vet implicitly, and would recommend him to anyone - I think it's more a case of me riding the emotions of the last few days, and looking for something to blame for having a nearly dead bunny buddy.

When I rang the vet, and told them what happened, and asked for Septrin, and more Cisapride, and Tramadol, to replace what I had used over the time he was so ill, the vet without question said yes, without even questioning my request for more Septrin. I went in today to get them - no charge at all for any of it. They even gave me extra Cisapride and extra Septrin to keep him on too. I told them there was no way I was giving Baycox again. And anyway, Littleblack has always LOVED Septrin, really stretching for the syringe and gulping it back, and holding into the syringe. He even would try and bite the bottle. He has a thing for the Banana sweet smell it has. lol.

Nearly dead bunny, (or "Zom-bunny" as my brother has now nicknamed him), is now alive and sitting up and eating Vitakraft Alfalfa Sticks as I type - junk food I know...but it's the first proper food he's eaten on his own, and enthusiastically, in a while. He also had a game of tag with the cat last night, in the middle of the night, which I stopped as they were both on me at the time, and woke me up.

The problem I now face is that he is positively emaciated. If the RSPCA saw him, they'd take him and euthanise him. I have read that if Coccida attacks the intestines, you get problems with Mal-absorption, and Mal-nutrition. Prognosis is guarded to poor. I know I am fighting a possibly short term battle, with a likelihood of having to say goodbye sooner rather than later - but for now, as he is showing signs of wanting to fight back - I'm gonna fight right back with him.

He can't have fresh veg, as it goes right through him, even though he bit me earlier to get a bit of Romaine Lettuce (giving a tiny bit and monitoring his gut movements every time) - so I need to find an alternative nutrient packed, vitamin packed, diet for him, as soon as possible.

I also read on that thread about Coccida, that cage cleaning with disinfectant and such, is important. I always did a daily toilet area poo-pick out, and always dug to the bottom of his hay bed, to pullout anything damp. I did that 2 times a day, or after every feed since December. But after reading the thread, I did a total clean today, and will keep doing so until his load results come back better - and I bought new food bowl and new water dish, and disinfected those too - so I can swap them out when cleaning, and keep I will keep up with the daily sanitising...just to give him the best chance of getting through this.

 

[Jack's-Jane]

I hope that LB will do as well as possible and that the Septrin helps if his problems are related to coccidiosis. I guess taking things one day at a time is the best thing for both of you xx

 

[Zoobec]

I'm sorry I can't offer any advice, but want to send LB mega vibes xx

 

[mabels mum]

Mabel seemed to be carrying coccidi with no symptoms. Arthur had lost lots of weight which was how we knew something was wrong and got the diagnosis. His poos were also tiny and hard. They needed two courses of septrin each a month long. Arthur was always starving and begging for food. We gave him his normal pellets,greens and hay with Mabel, and then gave him handfuls of sneeky extra pellets several times throughout the day when Mabel was in a different room. Four weeks since the end of the septrin and after the all clear he's a good healthy weight and loads of energy too. I switched them gradually to burgess excel pellets with oregano rather than the ordinary ones as I read oregano can help with coccidia. I also got a steam cleaner from Argos to thoroughly clean their home. They are due for a poo analysis in a couple of weeks but I'm confident it will come back clear again.

God luck with the treatment and I hope he gains weight soon. I'd recommend pretty much unlimited pellets and unlimited hay topped with ready grass. Hopefully you can build up the greens gradually soon.

 

[Sarahbun]

killing coccidia

Thank you for your replies.

He was on 0.15ml of Baycox 5% solution. I don't know if it was diluted, but I wasn't told to dilute it, so gave the dose as is.

I read some information on here on a brilliant thread on Coccida today. I can't believe it. Pretty much the exact signs of this, were showing in December when I first took bunny to the vet. I actually asked for Septrin as he had been on it before, and had done brilliantly on it, but the vet said no, as he wanted to be cautious, but on the other hand he didn't know what was wrong with Littleblack. I even rang back twice and asked if they thought he should have antibiotics.... but again, I was told that it was best to be cautious. I know I shouldn't be angry at the vet about this whole incident, but at the moment, while I DO trust this vet implicitly, and would recommend him to anyone - I think it's more a case of me riding the emotions of the last few days, and looking for something to blame for having a nearly dead bunny buddy.

When I rang the vet, and told them what happened, and asked for Septrin, and more Cisapride, and Tramadol, to replace what I had used over the time he was so ill, the vet without question said yes, without even questioning my request for more Septrin. I went in today to get them - no charge at all for any of it. They even gave me extra Cisapride and extra Septrin to keep him on too. I told them there was no way I was giving Baycox again. And anyway, Littleblack has always LOVED Septrin, really stretching for the syringe and gulping it back, and holding into the syringe. He even would try and bite the bottle. He has a thing for the Banana sweet smell it has. lol.

Nearly dead bunny, (or "Zom-bunny" as my brother has now nicknamed him), is now alive and sitting up and eating Vitakraft Alfalfa Sticks as I type - junk food I know...but it's the first proper food he's eaten on his own, and enthusiastically, in a while. He also had a game of tag with the cat last night, in the middle of the night, which I stopped as they were both on me at the time, and woke me up.

The problem I now face is that he is positively emaciated. If the RSPCA saw him, they'd take him and euthanise him. I have read that if Coccida attacks the intestines, you get problems with Mal-absorption, and Mal-nutrition. Prognosis is guarded to poor. I know I am fighting a possibly short term battle, with a likelihood of having to say goodbye sooner rather than later - but for now, as he is showing signs of wanting to fight back - I'm gonna fight right back with him.

He can't have fresh veg, as it goes right through him, even though he bit me earlier to get a bit of Romaine Lettuce (giving a tiny bit and monitoring his gut movements every time) - so I need to find an alternative nutrient packed, vitamin packed, diet for him, as soon as possible.

I also read on that thread about Coccida, that cage cleaning with disinfectant and such, is important. I always did a daily toilet area poo-pick out, and always dug to the bottom of his hay bed, to pullout anything damp. I did that 2 times a day, or after every feed since December. But after reading the thread, I did a total clean today, and will keep doing so until his load results come back better - and I bought new food bowl and new water dish, and disinfected those too - so I can swap them out when cleaning, and keep I will keep up with the daily sanitising...just to give him the best chance of getting through this.

I'm so glad you still have LittleBlack. Very sadly we lost our 7 month old bun to Coccidiosis just before Christmas. She showed no symptoms, was eating and pooping normally and 2 days before had been checked out by the vet as part of her post-op (spay) checks. On the morning of the day she died she seemed fine, greeting me as normal and eating her hay. By the time I returned home from work that afternoon I found her almost unresponsive, flat on her side. I took her straight to the vets, but sad to say she died on the way there. Wracked with guilt, I insisted on a PM and the results came back that she had died from complications due to coccidiosis. I was fastidious cleaner, litter trays were emptied and disinfected every morning, evening and then again before bedtime. The vet said that our bun came to us with Coccidiosis and as there were no clinical symptoms there was little that we could have done. When I asked the vet about sanitation she explained that the Coccidio oocytes (the microscopic eggs that develop into spores) are hardy and not easily killed. She recommended cleaning with a 10% ammonia solution (which I bought on-line - just look for 'household ammonia' and check that it's 10%) which I'll use to clean the flooring where our bun lived/hopped about on before I even consider having any more buns. I have disposed of everything else including her hutch, bowls, blankets etc Coccidia like moist conditions, but hate dry conditions, so if using steam cleaning please be sure to dry out thoroughly afterwards. The eggs develop into spores at just above room temperature, so a house bunny set up can be quite favourable conditions for coccidiosis unfortunately. I'm sending vibes to you and your Littleblack, he sounds like a fighter and you sound like a fantastic rabbit parent. :thumb: