Should I be worried?

Just a little bit of background first - my house bunny Frankie is about 6 years old and has been under the weather for about 6 months. He's normally a very boisterous little thing chasing us round our house, but he's been moping in his run and losing weight. During this time I took him to my vets numerous times but was fobbed off with mostly vague answers as to what it might or might not be, usually ending up with 'well, he is getting old'. They also gave him occasional courses of antibiotics and anti-inflammatories, which made him seem better for a short time before he sank back into this 'depression'. During this time I gave him a 28 course of Panacur, not prescribed by the vet, just because from my reading online it seemed that he might have a bout of e cuniculi. We also started grinding down his Excel nuggets, mixing them with water and syringe feeding him to try and get his weight up a bit. He's really keen to take this food, following us round when he's hungry to ask for it! Although he is obviously poorly - I wouldn't say that he's unhappy - he still comes to say hello and rubs his chin on me, he still climbs right into his hay ball to pick out the choice pieces and he still throws his bowl in the air if he wants feeding...

I finally changed vets a few weeks ago - the final straw with my old vet practice was when one of the vets told me they weren't sure if you could even do a blood test on a rabbit.

The new vet was (and is) amazing - I wish I'd changed a long time ago - she immediately could see something was wrong and took blood tests and told us to continue with the syringe feeding. It turns out he has kidney damage caused by the e cuniculi virus, a middle ear infection and one side of his face is paralysed, most likely from the ear infection. So now he's started quite a high dose of medication - he had two injections yesterday, an anabolic steroid and a vitamin B shot. He's also started on Lapizole for the e cuniculi and septrin antibiotics twice a day for the middle ear infection...

So finally getting to my reason for posting - last night and this morning I've noticed he's been off balance - toppling over three times and struggling to get back up - twice he did manage on his own, but I helped him one time. Should I be worried? I don't know whether perhaps this is just a side effect of having all these new drugs that he's not used to. Or maybe the antibiotics beginning to have an effect on the middle ear infection which is making him feel funny. I don't really want to take him back to vets as it really stresses him out and he's already been twice in the last week... does anyone have an experience of anything like this?

Thanks so much

:wave: welcome to RU

Sorry to hear that your first vet wasn't willing to help your bun but so glad you have a rabbit savvy vet on hand now.

What you're describing can be a symptom of the E. Cuniculi. I've had a case where the bunny did this but after a long course of Panacur it slowly got better. Does he have a head tilt too?

Thanks - this seems like a great forum with lots of useful advice!

He doesn't have head tilt at all... and he can move round fine, it's just that every so often he slowly topples over. And it's only started since we've been to the vets...

I wonder whether it could be that he's got so used to having a middle ear infection that he's 're-balanced' himself to deal with that - and now that he's on the antibiotics he's having a bit of trouble readjusting!? Or, I could be totally over-thinking this...

Or perhaps the stress of having all these medications...

As I type he's sitting here giving himself a good wash and hasn't toppled over - so perhaps I'm over-worrying about this

I have had experience of this and I am sorry to say that I really think you need to take him back to the vets immediately. It sounds to me as though the anti-biotics he is on are not actually ones that are suiting him, and the falling over is a sure sign that things are worsening, and his medication needs to be changed. I am so glad that you have now found a much better vet, because this will be invaluable now. Please keep us posted.

Do you think this is a side effect of the antibiotic, or a sign that the antibiotic isn't working?

The other reason I'm reluctant to take him back is that I know the rabbit vet isn't back in until Monday...and I really don't want to see anyone else.

He's eating and drinking OK and he hasn't toppled now for a good few hours

minky said:

Thanks - this seems like a great forum with lots of useful advice!

He doesn't have head tilt at all... and he can move round fine, it's just that every so often he slowly topples over. And it's only started since we've been to the vets...

I wonder whether it could be that he's got so used to having a middle ear infection that he's 're-balanced' himself to deal with that - and now that he's on the antibiotics he's having a bit of trouble readjusting!? Or, I could be totally over-thinking this...

Or perhaps the stress of having all these medications...

As I type he's sitting here giving himself a good wash and hasn't toppled over - so perhaps I'm over-worrying about this

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It is likely that the middle ear infection is the primary cause of his vestibular symptoms. It may be that a more aggressive approach to treatment is needed as far as antibiotic therapy goes. In my experience Septrin is not that effective in treating ear infections and I have seen greater success using an injectable antibiotic such as Depocillin alongside another antibiotic-Metronidazole.

I would advise you to call the Vet again and discuss whether it would be better to change the antibiotic now or whether the Vet feels that completing the full course of Septrin first would be more appropriate.

If your Rabbit does seem to become more unbalanced, develops a headtilt or nystagmus (flicking eyeballs) then you need to get in touch with the Vet immediately

I hope that your Rabbit will recover soon.

Do you think this is a side effect of the antibiotic, or a sign that the antibiotic isn't working?

The other reason I'm reluctant to take him back is that I know the rabbit vet isn't back in until Monday...and I really don't want to see anyone else.

He's eating and drinking OK and he hasn't toppled now for a good few hours



I personally feel that the antibiotic is not working, as if your bun has a middle ear infection, and you are probably dealing with Pasterella which is what my Roger had, this is definately a worsening of the condition, as in as the infection really takes a hold and then the balance becomes affected, hence the falling over. I totally agree with the other thread that Septrin is not really a strong enough antibiotic to sort this condition. Roger had the Depocillin injections and Metronidazole antibiotic, and he had Metacam to keep him comfortable. I understand completely your reluctance to take him back when the rabbit vet is not there, and to be honest, if I were you now and as your bunny sounds pretty ok at the moment, and it is not like he is flipping over constantly, and he is eating and drinking, then I would have monitored him constantly and waited until Monday unless he gets a lot worse. Is your bunny in a cage? I'm only asking because Roger initially was,but he flipped over constantly and it was terrible to see, and I was really worried about him injuring himself, banging his head that kind of thing, so I did away with his cage, and had a spare single duvet that I put a cover on and folded in half, and set him up on that. I put a towel on top of it and then if it got wet or dirty just changed it for a clean one. He loved it so much that he then spent the last 3 yrs of his life with his duvet and never went back into his cage. I put food and hay on the towel, water right by the side of the duvet, and Roger was so comfortable and stretched right out on it. Then if he did fall over when he went to move there was nothing to hit himself on.

I will definitely ring the vet on Monday... he's also got loose stools, which the vet did warn us about, but that must be making him feel a bit rubbish too.

He's in a puppy pen in our living room - it's open though so he can come in and out as he pleases. He has a little rug that he sits on and because we were worried about him being cold now he's lost weight, we got him a reptile lamp which gives off a gentle heat like sitting in the sun - so he likes to sit under that

The thing that I find odd is that our previous vets basically said 'do nothing' and so for the past few months he hasn't been on any medication or anything, and although he wasn't making an improvement (still moping around) he wasn't getting any worse. And that was for months - it just seems funny that we've given him medication and literally hours later he starts falling over. That's why I thought it might be a side effect of suddenly being on so much medication.

I understand totally where you are coming from but it could well be just coincedence that he has gone on to meds and then started falling over, when he may well have started falling over anyway without the meds, because the condition was just getting worse. When Roger was very poorly and lost weight through the winter months and like you I was worried about him being cold especially at night, I bought a couple of premature baby t-shirts or you could just get newborn depending on the size of your bun, and he was perfectly happy and lovely and warm with one of these on. Don't get me wrong I'm not in favour of dressing animals for the fun of it and don't agree with it at all but I have used t-shirts for thin bunnies to stop them getting cold.

I would just keep a close eye on him over the weekend keep him off the sofa or anywhere where he could fall from. Give the vets a ring on Monday and try to speak with the same vet that you had the consultation with. Continue to get plenty of food in him particularly fiber.

Also some barley rings would help with weight gain now you have found the cause of the problem.

Based on my experience with Mischa I would agree that the facial paralysis, ear infection and loss of balance are all connected and being caused by that infection.

When my Mischa had head tilt (also caused by infection) it did get slightly worse before it got better but if I were you I wouldn't want to not let the vet know in case the abx isn't working. I agree with Jane in that if there are worsening symptoms I would get him to the vet ASAP. However, I think right now rather than take him and stress him I would ring the vet and let them know and see what they want to do.

The loose stools may well be due to the abx, they can sometimes upset their stomach. Maybe ask your vet about a probiotic to go alongside the abx. I used to give Mischa Protextin Pro Fibre pellets whenever he was on an abx.

I just checked and my new vet practice closed at 11.30am - they transfer you to Vet24 which is just for emergencies out of hours.

I think I'll just keep an eye on him and if he really gets a lot worse I'll have to take him to this emergency place - although I wonder what they would do for him as he's already on the antibiotics and Lapizole - I'd much rather speak to the vet who saw him.

Fingers crossed he'll be ok. He still hasn't toppled over again and he's just had two syringes of food, a big drink of water and some parsley, so hopefully that's a good sign.

His poos are a bit funny - some loose and some really small - I think this must be the antibiotics - it hasn't put him off eating more so hopefully nothing to worry about.

Sorry got no advice but didn't want to read and run.

Looks like you're doing the best thing for him, hopefully you will get an antibiotic which works better.

Hmmmm...... I don't have any advice either. But your bun is in my prayers.

Just an update in case any one is interested... apologies if I'm boring everyone - I know I can get a bit OTT when it comes to my rabbit!

He just jumped into his litter tray - he did stumble a little - a good sign that he went to the loo in there though I think, I was worried he might be be able to - but he once he was finished he jumped out and ran over humming to himself (which he only does when he's happy). A good sign I hope!?

YAY!!! At least he's feeling better!

That is brilliant news and am so glad he is feeling better and is so happy.

minky said:

Just an update in case any one is interested... apologies if I'm boring everyone - I know I can get a bit OTT when it comes to my rabbit!

He just jumped into his litter tray - he did stumble a little - a good sign that he went to the loo in there though I think, I was worried he might be be able to - but he once he was finished he jumped out and ran over humming to himself (which he only does when he's happy). A good sign I hope!?

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Wow everyone on here I think is exactly the same. My post regarding Doughnut being ill is ongoing as nice to have advice and support when you are so worried and people understand how much your bun is loved.

Hope the improvement continues.

Thanks - it is really nice to know there are other people who can understand why it's so worrying! I've had my bunny for 6 years, he's moved house with me three times, stuck with me through a rough break up and so, I know it sounds silly, but it's like it's me and him against the world!

I spoke to the vet practice this morning and they think he's displaying classic symptoms of e cuniculi, probably exacerbated by the stress of two vet visits in a week and all this new medication. They've advised to keep an eye on him for the rest of the week and bring him in on Friday if he hasn't improved at all. He's on Lapizole so hopefully this should help. So far he's only toppled once today and managed to right himself pretty quickly

I've lost weight worrying about Doughnut, when she's really ill I can't eat a thing. When she seems better and not in pain I feel better so have something to eat.

Since she's still poorly I worry when I'm at work and can't wait to get back to her. Don't worry we have all been there!