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Calcium in Oxbow Bunny Basic/T?

It seems to me whatever people suggest you get a little defensive,unless its just a language barrier.I hope you find the answer you want soon.:)

Well the thing is, it's all suggested a thousand times.. Not by you guys of course.. But hay has been an issue for years. I'm getting kinda tired of it. (Well, tired of the rabbit.. Every bunny does it so why can't he.. Of course that is not your fault but it's annoying that NOTHING works.. It's costing me a lot of money (hay is cheaper.. Really..) and worse, a lot of worries.)

And I thought, there is calcium in everything he eats, at least it seems like that.. So I never really worried about not enough, never really thought about it either. I mean, I also give him dried herbs every day.. Shocking how much is in there! Up to 2%!
 
Reading the last post again (the one before mine I mean) I think what's important is to know how much calcium he needs, and base his food on that? I remember someone telling me the 'calciumneed (?)' of an average bunny (2.5 kg?) is about 500 mg a day.. You think that's correct?
 
Ok so it sounds like you have tried most things. Although I would still have hay available to him, I would definately go with what Tamsin says, minimise the pellets, up the veggies and try and go for the highest fibre veggies you can find. As far as I know these are:

Herbs and other uncultivated leafs like weeds (check they can be eaten first) soft fruit leaves like strawberry, non stone fruit leaves like apples and some normal trees (not oak or conifers)

Kale/sprouts
Mangetout/sugar snap peas
cauliflower
corgette
celery
raspberry, blackberry, apple, pear, dried apricots (although limit because of sugar content)
Green beans - although remove the seeds as these are toxic.


The one thing I would also ask, he stopped using the litter tray around the same time that he stopped eating hay? Given his age has the vet considered the possibility that he might be suffering from arthritis? if he was in pain then that could leave him to stop eating hay, even whilst continuing to eat everything else. If he is looking a bit stiff and like he might be in pain then a pain medication called metacam may help.

On the pain front, a molar spur, even if very small could still do the same thing. You can see in my siggi a netherland dwarf called Rosie. She has only had to have one dental in her life due to a molar spur. The only symptom that she displayed at first was not really eating as much hay as normal, I thought that this was possibly due to her being a bit on the tubby side and cut down her pellets which helped a bit but then a week later she started to dribble from the side of her mouth. Her spur was so tiny the vet could only just see it & didn't think it was big enough to cause the dribbling to the extent that she was but one dental later she was back to her normal self.

We do get many rabbits in the rescue that do not eat hay when they first come in but I can't think of one off hand that we could not get eating hay again by the time we left, perhaps not masses for some dental buns but at least having a bit of a nibble.
 
B is on a low calcium diet due to several bouts of cystitis.She only now has meadow hay or grass.Even Timothy hay upsets her.She has a handful of pellets in the morning & 4hours of wet veg in pm.Being a french lop I worry how her joints will be when shes older due to the low calcium intake.
 
Ok so it sounds like you have tried most things. Although I would still have hay available to him, I would definately go with what Tamsin says, minimise the pellets, up the veggies and try and go for the highest fibre veggies you can find.

I'll always have hay available for him, I never give up hoping but I did give up trying every kind of hay there is. My other bunny did start eating hay when I tried a few different things (minimised his pellets and tried different kinds of hay) and now Indy just gets what Fred likes. Before that I bought every different or new kind of hay there was available to try if that helped..

As far as I know these are:

Herbs and other uncultivated leafs like weeds (check they can be eaten first) soft fruit leaves like strawberry, non stone fruit leaves like apples and some normal trees (not oak or conifers)

Kale/sprouts
Mangetout/sugar snap peas
cauliflower
corgette
celery
raspberry, blackberry, apple, pear, dried apricots (although limit because of sugar content)
Green beans - although remove the seeds as these are toxic.

Now there is quite a language barier I'm afraid, I have no idea what's meant by most words, but I'll see if I can translate it online, maybe that helps.

About the strawberryleaves: I feed him dried strawberryleaves now and he really loves them. Never really knew you can give fresh leaves as well. Now I'll try to translate everything first because me not getting half of it is not very helping of course :p


The one thing I would also ask, he stopped using the litter tray around the same time that he stopped eating hay? Given his age has the vet considered the possibility that he might be suffering from arthritis? if he was in pain then that could leave him to stop eating hay, even whilst continuing to eat everything else. If he is looking a bit stiff and like he might be in pain then a pain medication called metacam may help.

Well, the thing is, he didn't stop eating hay, he just never did. I think he just doesn't see it as food..

On the pain front, a molar spur, even if very small could still do the same thing. You can see in my siggi a netherland dwarf called Rosie. She has only had to have one dental in her life due to a molar spur. The only symptom that she displayed at first was not really eating as much hay as normal, I thought that this was possibly due to her being a bit on the tubby side and cut down her pellets which helped a bit but then a week later she started to dribble from the side of her mouth. Her spur was so tiny the vet could only just see it & didn't think it was big enough to cause the dribbling to the extent that she was but one dental later she was back to her normal self.

He just didn't change any eating habbit, the not eating hay has been this way for six years now. There wasn't even really a spur, just one tooth that's a tiny bit eh.. 'wrong'. But I'll ask my vet again. (Haven't spoken to him yet. Thursday my other rabbit will be neutered, I'm planning on leaving all the information such as the email from Oxbow etc for him then.)


We do get many rabbits in the rescue that do not eat hay when they first come in but I can't think of one off hand that we could not get eating hay again by the time we left, perhaps not masses for some dental buns but at least having a bit of a nibble.


This is what Oxbow had to say about the calciumlevel in the BBT:

Dear Ms:
Your research into our BBT is correct. We are required by most countries to label our Calcium content in the range that you found. The range for Ca in BBT is 0.35% to 0.85%. The actual is about the same as the product that you are currently using.

BBT is a product that was very carefully formulated for adult rabbits. Oxbow has an advisory board of small animal specialists, who are very careful and very deliberate about nutrient decisions like this one.

BBT does not contain any added Calcium. The Calcium comes naturally from the component ingredients. Due to variations in the ingredients, and also due to lab analysis variation, we have chosen this range.

We hope this answers your question, and that you are able to use BBT successfully with your rabbit. Please consult your vet as well with these questions.

My Best Regards,

Now I'll try to translate all the veggies first.

Oh and I found a (Dutch..) list of calcium in vegetables. We believe Indy needs about 300 mg of calcium a day. I now give him 25 grams of SS Mature a day, which is good for at least 150 mg of calcium. I don't mind having to weigh his veggies everyday.. I mean, if I can find a combination of veggies that contain the other 150 mg (or reduce the pellets so I can give more veggies) then he won't get too less or too much calcium, right??
 
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Yeeey, Googletranslate is really helpfull today.

Herbs and other uncultivated leafs like weeds (check they can be eaten first) soft fruit leaves like strawberry, non stone fruit leaves like apples and some normal trees (not oak or conifers)

In summer I give him a lot of dandilon (?) leaves, he loves them. I'll start with strawberryleaves as well, appletreeleaves (and branches) he doesn't really like, but maybe when I mix them up with his veggies.. I have tried giving him willow and applebranches complete with leaves but he won't eat that.


Kale/sprouts - I give these to him but never too much and always in combination with other veggies (of course..) because I as far as I knew this is a.. Cabbage?
Mangetout/sugar snap peas - Googletranslate doesn't know what you mean by this.. Neither do I.. :oops:
cauliflower - Same story as the sprouts, and I only give the leaves.
corgette - I'll try that.
celery - And that too.
raspberry, blackberry, apple, pear, dried apricots (although limit because of sugar content)
Green beans - although remove the seeds as these are toxic.

Okay I tried to translate all the other veggies I give him but I get the most ridiculous words. I know they're 'good' veggies so I better give up before I really start making you all laugh :p
 
Last thursday my other rabbit Fred was neutered and I dropped of the information for my vet. I didn't see him that day and he hasn't responded so far.

Unfortunately, Indy passed away last night. The day before yesterday started as any other day, his breakfast was gone in no time, he was happy to see me.. Around 10, everything was still fine. And an hour later it just couldn't have been more wrong. I never saw him in so much pain. And believe me, I haven't even shared half of his health problems over the last year.. I saw him in pain way too many times.

Of course I called my vet right away, but she couldn't see us until 3. He seemed to get a bit better, was able to sit up straight. Around two he got worse again, much worse. He couldn't even stand on his feet anymore. When we arrived, my vet gave him painkillers right away, explained she had to stabilize him first and then do more test (xrays, ultrasound (?)) but that probably wouldn't be until the next day. Unfortunately his heart couldn't handle all this anymore and that night he died..

Ironically that same day Supreme responded.. And, as most topics about this subject here already told me, BBT is indeed the best food to give when having calciumrelated urinaryproblems.
 
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