Advice on petrified rescue bun please.

[Anniebirdy]

Little Marble, who recently came into S.T.A.R is such a frightened little bun. Not just frightened, but beyond terrified. .
Any unexpected movement and he is so desperate to 'escape' he will sometimes even smash into the wall. When he is in your arms, he makes no effort at all to wriggle free, but I can sense this isnt because he's thinking ''Oh, this is ok''; he is just so petrified he just 'gives up'. He will at times come to me if I lay down flat and offer him food, but any movement to touch and back comes the terror with a vengeance. he has had surgery on his teeth and is grief stricken, but even so, I think there's more to this. I thought poor little Minky (Nibbles) the Leeds35 bun was scared, but Heavens, it dosent compare to this bunny's terror.
I am always extremely quiet and gentle around him, only pick him up if it's absolutely necessary, always try not to do anything to add to his fears.
What can I do to help him more? It's not the 'lack of friendliness' that bothers me at all, that's his choice if he dosent want to be a snuggle bun and I respect it, but it's the total terror behind it what bothers me. Something has happened to him on top of everything else, Im certain, something terrible. But how can I undo it and start to heal him when I have no clue what has put this absolute terror in him in the first place?? he is so bad, he almost has a asthma attack with fear on the few times Ive actually HAD to pick him up.
Im in tears just explaining about him, this is so wrong, this dreaful, heart stopping fear of his is soooo wrong

 

[yvette]

There might be sight problems.....I dont know...poor wee mite.

 

[GrahamL]

There might be sight problems.....I dont know...poor wee mite.

I was about to say something similar.

I wonder if he has hearing problems, or now yvie's mentioned it, sight problems. I was leaning towards hearing, as if you walk into a room, he can't hear you, but then suddenly sees you, will automagically trigger his fight or flight instinct and in your case, its flight, hence the mad run and smashing off of walls trying to get away from whatever predator has managed to get this close to him. He's living on instinct, poor mite

I'd wonder about having his hearing and sight checked out properly

Are there any piccies of him?

 

[Anniebirdy]

There might be sight problems.....I dont know...poor wee mite.

I dont think it's his sight Yvette, because he seems fully able to see a tasty morsel etc, and iven just the smallest movement of my finger when Im lying on the floor like a rag doll can terrify him into bolting for cover. It's so, so sad xx

 

[Anniebirdy]

I was about to say something similar.

I wonder if he has hearing problems, or now yvie's mentioned it, sight problems. I was leaning towards hearing, as if you walk into a room, he can't hear you, but then suddenly sees you, will automagically trigger his fight or flight instinct and in your case, its flight, hence the mad run and smashing off of walls trying to get away from whatever predator has managed to get this close to him. He's living on instinct, poor mite

I'd wonder about having his hearing and sight checked out properly

Are there any piccies of him?

here you are Graham

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gJgIZdb4OVU

 

[GrahamL]

here you are Graham

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gJgIZdb4OVU

He doesn't look particularly terrified of life in that video, but i dont know if things have changed since then.

He appears to be quite curious about his surroundings, do you know how his bonded partner died, out of interest?

 

[Sky-O]

I had a wildie who was the same. Would run in a literal blind panic and crash into things. He was a serious risk to himself.

In reference to the blind comment, he won't 'see' the food, he will smell it out.

Try singing when around him, whenever you are in his earshot. If that helps then grand.

Also, try flicking a torch in his direction when you're around so that he knows you are there, but don't do anything other than use the torch as a warning you are around.

Then they never have any surprises of you just appearing, they learn that you're around but not going to do anything. Doing which ever of those things works best for him will hopefully help.

It is possible to win them round. I had Roger handfeeding within five days of coming here. He is still exceptionally nervous, but he doesn't run in a blind panic and is much better when he has a friend.

 

[GrahamL]

I had a wildie who was the same. Would run in a literal blind panic and crash into things. He was a serious risk to himself.

In reference to the blind comment, he won't 'see' the food, he will smell it out.

Try singing when around him, whenever you are in his earshot. If that helps then grand.

Also, try flicking a torch in his direction when you're around so that he knows you are there, but don't do anything other than use the torch as a warning you are around.

Then they never have any surprises of you just appearing, they learn that you're around but not going to do anything. Doing which ever of those things works best for him will hopefully help.

It is possible to win them round. I had Roger handfeeding within five days of coming here. He is still exceptionally nervous, but he doesn't run in a blind panic and is much better when he has a friend.

Was really hoping you would come and post

 

[Anniebirdy]

He doesn't look particularly terrified of life in that video, but i dont know if things have changed since then.


He appears to be quite curious about his surroundings, do you know how his bonded partner died, out of interest?

He's kind of OK if Im 'ignoring' him Graham, but if he realises the attention is actually on him, that's when the terror kicks in. Will charge up my camera and get a video of what he is so often like later on, see if that can show a truer picture of what happens. I dont know what happened to his bonded partener to be honest Graham, I had quite a job getting a straight answer from the lady who contacted me over him, so it's difficult to say....

I had a wildie who was the same. Would run in a literal blind panic and crash into things. He was a serious risk to himself.

In reference to the blind comment, he won't 'see' the food, he will smell it out.

Try singing when around him, whenever you are in his earshot. If that helps then grand.

Also, try flicking a torch in his direction when you're around so that he knows you are there, but don't do anything other than use the torch as a warning you are around.

Then they never have any surprises of you just appearing, they learn that you're around but not going to do anything. Doing which ever of those things works best for him will hopefully help.

It is possible to win them round. I had Roger handfeeding within five days of coming here. He is still exceptionally nervous, but he doesn't run in a blind panic and is much better when he has a friend.

Thankyou Sky. Ive moved him into the spare bedroom where he can see the other 3 buns, see me touching and handling them, have companionship of his own kind but they cant 'get at' each other, so Im hoping that may help, simply by easing his loneliness. I will try the torch, I have a little one that wont dazzle him, but if he can see properly, he will deffinately see it.
I just hate seeing an animal display such terror, especially what should be a 'domesticated' animal, I just wonder and wonder what on earth has caused it...

 

[parsnipbun]

I also have one of my wildies who is like this -

He came in to human company (not at first with us) at the age of about 6-9 months and so is truly wild. We do not know where he came from - other than the pub he was found in in the middle of town - and by the time he came to us he had been with two other sets of humans for about 4 months and would not have stood a chance let loose in the wild again.

However, although he is very happy in his aviary set up, and with the other buns he is with, he is very very scared of humans.

We just let him be and he lives with two other wildies (including a hand reared who is totally fine and one that came in at c10 weeks old and is getting much braver) and a domestic bun.

He has been neutered and came through fine - but largely he just lives a wild life. We let him out for runs on the lawn etc and he goes back in when he wants to - he once got through to next doors garden and had to be 'shepherded' back by 6 people - a heart stopping procedure - but once he realised where the gap was that he had got through he shot back again - it was just he had lost his way.

 

[AnyBunny]

Little Marble, who recently came into S.T.A.R is such a frightened little bun. Not just frightened, but beyond terrified. .
Im in tears just explaining about him, this is so wrong, this dreaful, heart stopping fear of his is soooo wrong

Any chance he could be injured or in pain? I seem to remember a bunny called Dave (?) on here a while ago who had very similar reactions and turned out to have an airgun pellet in his face which was causing him great pain, especially when touched.

 

[Anniebirdy]

I also have one of my wildies who is like this -

He came in to human company (not at first with us) at the age of about 6-9 months and so is truly wild. We do not know where he came from - other than the pub he was found in in the middle of town - and by the time he came to us he had been with two other sets of humans for about 4 months and would not have stood a chance let loose in the wild again.

However, although he is very happy in his aviary set up, and with the other buns he is with, he is very very scared of humans.

We just let him be and he lives with two other wildies (including a hand reared who is totally fine and one that came in at c10 weeks old and is getting much braver) and a domestic bun.

He has been neutered and came through fine - but largely he just lives a wild life. We let him out for runs on the lawn etc and he goes back in when he wants to - he once got through to next doors garden and had to be 'shepherded' back by 6 people - a heart stopping procedure - but once he realised where the gap was that he had got through he shot back again - it was just he had lost his way.

He was, by the account I've been given, a much loved bunny... Once. Then his owners stopped loving him (Physically I mean0 and he hasnt been handled for a number of years. However, Ive had a couple of contradictory stories off the lady who contacted me, and my friend who collected him for me got slightly different stories again, so it's really hard to know what has gone on with the poor little chap

Any chance he could be injured or in pain? I seem to remember a bunny called Dave (?) on here a while ago who had very similar reactions and turned out to have an airgun pellet in his face which was causing him great pain, especially when touched.

Anybunny, I took him to the vet on the second day here as I sensed great pain for him, that was when his dreadful teeth condition was discovered. Whilst under anaesthetic for his teeth, he was thoroughly checked over and all else appeared fine. I'm slightly leaning towards thinking that the dreadful pain he must have been in for so long with his poor mouth could still be very much alive in his memory, hence his terror of further pain?
Normally, even the most fearful animals seem to come round to me very quickly, but not this poor chap. I'm taking everybodies thoughts and suggestions and ideas on board because this obviously goes very deep with him, and I owe it to him to find a way, any way of easing his mental pain. So thankyou everyone xx

 

[Mirth]

Poor thing

We got given a breeding pair where the female was acting exactly like that, in the run she got so petrified she ran right into the pen, completely blind panic.

Limiting her space helped, she was put in a rabbit cage with a hidey hole as she was obviously pregnant. She's still nervous and scared and will hide under her wooden sticks, and will try and run. Recently she's not as bad, now she has a small area to run around (much smaller then the other run) and if she's in her cage will press herself against the side and will let us stroke her, but it's clear she's still scared, just not climbing the walls. Donno what she'll be like when she can go back into the pen, hopefully not as bad, but the way she flinches when you stroke her, tells me she's been scruffed as she seems more sensitive near her neck. The boy was nervous but not as bad.

So I think maybe limiting her space for a little while to prevent him from hurting himself might help and get him used to you, then introduce him to more space?

Although with a rat who had the same problem, I had to sit still as any movement would send him running, but he would have the run of the room with his friends, in his cage he would hide away. His friends were friendly as anything so would run all over me, it took a while of just sitting and barely moving before he had the courage to come near me, but not on me. Eventually he started to run on me, and I would talk to him and move slowly. Whenever he'd dart away when I moved, I'd go back, then move my fingers, he'd dart, then come back ect. He never liked being touched or handled and was still jumpy, but he would climb all over me, not panic when I moved slowly and even would climb onto my hand voluntary to be put back into his cage as long as I didn't hold him. Confident friends did help as he was strongly bonded to one of them and would follow him anywhere.

So I think getting him used to just being there without moving for a while and moving your finger slowly to desensitised him with movement like you're doing might help too, and just wait out his panic as long as he doesn't hurt himself.

 

[Tamsin]

It's hard to rule out vision problems because rabbit's other senses are so good. They rely a lot on hearing, scent and whiskers. It's even more difficult in an already cautious rabbits as they'll double check everything rather than race around and knock something that they assume wasn't there, which a more confident rabbit may do.

I would keep her pen set up the same as much as possible, that will make her feel more confident. That said I would also introduce as many hidey holes as practical so she can always find one easily. When returning her after a vet trip or similar, always put her down in the same spot.

Being quiet can avoid startling her, but it can also make it harder for her to locate you and adjust to sounds, I would talk quietly to her so she adjusts to noise and also try a quiet radio station for background noise as that will mask out any loud sounds.

I would have visual/auditory cues to announce yourself, for example I always click at Scamp before opening the gate/turning on the light, and that often stops him mid scuttle back to his tunnel as he realises it's me.

Being around her but not interacting may help, eg sit nearby at meal times, when reading etc. just being company will help her feel more settled. You could also try giving her worn clothing to introduce scent.

 

[Anniebirdy]

Thankyou Tamsin and Mirth. I built him a pen yesterday and put his hutch in the spare bedroom with three of the other buns. He still has plenty of room, but is indeed more confined than he was in my bedroom. Im taking all the advice given on board and paying attention to everything that people are kind enough to suggest. I know he's going to need a lot of time and gentleness and patience, his heart and his spirit are just shattered, poor little lad.
I think tonight I will do what I did with Minky (Nibbles) and sleep on the floor at the side of his pen, what do you think? It's no hardship to me, Ive slept on floors, in aviaries, beside hutches many a time, lol!

 

[Anniebirdy]

Just to add, he can still hide underneath his hutch, can go in and out of it as he pleases, and he has his little 'bedroom partition' which is a typical enclosed part in his hutch. Do you think that's enough for now, or should I frop a blanket over part of his pen as well?

 

[Tamsin]

I'd maybe go for a cardboard box with two holes (entrance and exit) that way he'll feel more enclosed than a blanket over but can still see if he can/wants too.

I think sleeping near by is a great idea if you are willing It's about as unthreatening as you can get and plenty of time for him to adjust to your scent/presence.

 

[Mrs. Bunnykins]

I think an incredible amount of patience and understanding will eventually pay off. That's for you.:thumb:

There are no time limits, just understand that the dear little bunny may never be 100% , just enjoy that in their own way hopefully they are happy. Food, shelter, water and love...................perfect combination.

All being well time will heal.

Best of luck. xxxxxxxxxxxxx

 

[Sherlock]

The nervous buns I've had have responded best to having a two floor hutch so that they had some height if they wanted - so you can be same height (ie head height without having to a huge presence flat on a floor). Plus having some space that they knew was there's and that I'd only go into for cleaning out, thus they knew they were safe. Apart from that having two people sitting outside their space and talking to each other and doing things like having tea and biscuits seems to make a big difference - if they think that you aren't watching them (as in getting ready to hunt) slowly over time they become calmer and calmer.

Once they've calmed down, tricks/techniques that Caroline has outlined in the download PDF on this page are good http://www.rabbitresidence.org.uk/becoming-best-friends-with-your-bunnies.html