How Mad is your Rabbit?

[Schtoffen]

Hello Chaps,

Hope all your buns are happy and healthy and full of joy. :thumb:

Just wondered if anyone had any ideas what might have got into my girl...

As any of you who have read my posts before will know my Belgian Hare X 'Little' is mad. Madder than an ordinary rabbit even. But in the last month or so her behavior has gone from really bad to totally appalling:evil:. She seems to go out of her way to do everything she ought not to... from knocking things over to climbing/gnawing on stuff... stealing and running away with anything I show an interest in, be it my supper or a book or my phone... I know this sounds anthropomorphic (however you spell it!!) but she also seems to recently want to make as much mess as she can, even dragging all her litter out her box which she's never done before.:roll:

I don't really mind or anything, I just don't want her to be unhappy. Big only passed away in April, so maybe it's a delayed reaction? Teddy lives with us now but they're still not bonded.

The other weird thing is most of the time when I get home from work she just wakes up, stretches/yawns and comes to say hello.... but every now and again she'll go TOTALLY loopy, tearing around like mad, falling over stuff, running into walls, smacking her feet the whole time in a complete blind panic as if she's terrified of me. It's actually quite distressing to watch.

I'm actually starting to wonder if the time she got loose and ate all those power cables actually damaged her brain? Then again she wasn't completely right to being with...

Does anyone else's bun go in cycles of weird behaviour? I'd put it down to hormones but she was 'done' ages ago.

Hmmmm...anyway, any sensible advice would be appreciated. To make you smile, a picture of Teddy with his moult-line making him look jolly cross.

 

[Pebblesetc]

She sounds like she might be frustrated and lonely. Have you tried bonding her and Teddy? The presence of another bunny that she can't interact with might be exacerbating her frustration and confusing her.

 

[Schtoffen]

She sounds like she might be frustrated and lonely. Have you tried bonding her and Teddy? The presence of another bunny that she can't interact with might be exacerbating her frustration and confusing her.

I did try but I'm still in limbo about trying some more. She's SO horrible to him it's unreal. She basically acts aggressive towards him and then when he nips her on the nose (not in a very aggressive way more an 'I'm in charge' nip) she goes completely mad and attacks him really really viciously, drawing blood.

 

[Pebblesetc]

I did try but I'm still in limbo about trying some more. She's SO horrible to him it's unreal. She basically acts aggressive towards him and then when he nips her on the nose (not in a very aggressive way more an 'I'm in charge' nip) she goes completely mad and attacks him really really viciously, drawing blood.

It might be worth seeing if you can find someone who does bonding near you. They'd both be on completely neutral ground and might be less grouchy.

In the mean time, try filling a big cardboard box with loads of scrunched up newspaper. Scatter in some of her pellets and let her go wild. Shredding boxes like that are a really good outlet for frustrated bunnies. I wouldn't have a carpet or any books left if I hadn't given a box of newspapers to Buckley! x

 

[Schtoffen]

It might be worth seeing if you can find someone who does bonding near you. They'd both be on completely neutral ground and might be less grouchy.

In the mean time, try filling a big cardboard box with loads of scrunched up newspaper. Scatter in some of her pellets and let her go wild. Shredding boxes like that are a really good outlet for frustrated bunnies. I wouldn't have a carpet or any books left if I hadn't given a box of newspapers to Buckley! x

Hahah thanks that's a good idea Yes someone near me on here has offered I'm just terrified I know it's silly and I have to let them shake down together but she really is just barking mad and I don't trust her not to seriously hurt him.

 

[Pebblesetc]

Hahah thanks that's a good idea Yes someone near me on here has offered I'm just terrified I know it's silly and I have to let them shake down together but she really is just barking mad and I don't trust her not to seriously hurt him.

If the person who has offered is an experienced bonder I'd say go for it. Rabbits can pick up on our stress when they're being bonded and that can affect the process. An experienced bonder will be able to tell when a fight is about to break out and will be much calmer about the whole situation. I've not even attempted to do a bond myself because I know I'd just freak out if they looked at each other funny and then Buckley would freak out because I'm freaking out and he takes cues from me on a lot of things.

If it doesn't work out with someone else doing it, it doesn't work out but at least you can say you've tried. **hugs** These bunnies are a worry aren't they!

 

[Vegan_Bunny]

It sounds like she is bored and lonely, as someone else has mentioned. Fiver was like this before I bonded him with his first wife. I don't think Little is mad or crazy, she is just a little more energetic than most buns. She sounds almost identical to Fiver tbh. He is very "high strung" and get very aggressive and destructive when he is bored. He is bonded now and is still "difficult". If he doesn't get out of the bedroom (he free ranges in there) every few days he will start to attack me or Xena (his wife) and start "escaping" and chewing everything he shouldn't. :roll:

I think bonding her and enriching her environment will do her good, but be prepared for her to always be destructive and "naughty". :lol: I know she was bonded to another bun that recently passed (I think I'm right about that) and so she will probably have some behavioural changes whilst she adjusts to this. If bonding her with Teddy doesn't work would you be in a position to try her with another bun?

 

[Schtoffen]

It sounds like she is bored and lonely, as someone else has mentioned. Fiver was like this before I bonded him with his first wife. I don't think Little is mad or crazy, she is just a little more energetic than most buns. She sounds almost identical to Fiver tbh. He is very "high strung" and get very aggressive and destructive when he is bored. He is bonded now and is still "difficult". If he doesn't get out of the bedroom (he free ranges in there) every few days he will start to attack me or Xena (his wife) and start "escaping" and chewing everything he shouldn't. :roll:

I think bonding her and enriching her environment will do her good, but be prepared for her to always be destructive and "naughty". :lol: I know she was bonded to another bun that recently passed (I think I'm right about that) and so she will probably have some behavioural changes whilst she adjusts to this. If bonding her with Teddy doesn't work would you be in a position to try her with another bun?

Thanks for your response.

That's a good question about another bun. I don't know to be honest. Teddy is about as good a bonding buddy as you could want really, although he very obviously wants to be in charge. I've watched the bonding process really carefully with previous buns and it does seem to be her behaviour that's causing the issues... Teddy seems to want to bond.

The problem is, I really love Teddy now he's coming out of his shell. The idea of giving him back to the RSPCA keeps crossing my mind but what if no one adopts him?

I wonder if maybe the problem was after Big passed she 'bonded', as much as they can, with me and my OH (following us around, sleeping on our bed etc).

Could it be possible she doesn't want another bun around? Or do buns always want a partner?

Hmm....I also wonder how I could enrich her environment. She ignores all her toys and can't figure out her treat ball (she always drowns it! Teddy can work it). The only thing she likes in cardboard and paper... but I'm concerned about her having these as she actually eats them, she'd eat a whole cardboard box if I let her.

Hmmm...any fun bunny toys ideas? Thanks a lot for your advise by the way, it makes everything seem a bit less dreadful!

 

[Pebblesetc]

Thanks for your response.

That's a good question about another bun. I don't know to be honest. Teddy is about as good a bonding buddy as you could want really, although he very obviously wants to be in charge. I've watched the bonding process really carefully with previous buns and it does seem to be her behaviour that's causing the issues... Teddy seems to want to bond.

The problem is, I really love Teddy now he's coming out of his shell. The idea of giving him back to the RSPCA keeps crossing my mind but what if no one adopts him?

I wonder if maybe the problem was after Big passed she 'bonded', as much as they can, with me and my OH (following us around, sleeping on our bed etc).

Could it be possible she doesn't want another bun around? Or do buns always want a partner?

Hmm....I also wonder how I could enrich her environment. She ignores all her toys and can't figure out her treat ball (she always drowns it! Teddy can work it). The only thing she likes in cardboard and paper... but I'm concerned about her having these as she actually eats them, she'd eat a whole cardboard box if I let her.

Hmmm...any fun bunny toys ideas? Thanks a lot for your advise by the way, it makes everything seem a bit less dreadful!

Yellow pages and phone books are good fun bunny toys. They can vent their frustration by ripping and shredding them. Or give her a huge storage box of hay to dig around in

 

[Vegan_Bunny]

Thanks for your response.

That's a good question about another bun. I don't know to be honest. Teddy is about as good a bonding buddy as you could want really, although he very obviously wants to be in charge. I've watched the bonding process really carefully with previous buns and it does seem to be her behaviour that's causing the issues... Teddy seems to want to bond.

The problem is, I really love Teddy now he's coming out of his shell. The idea of giving him back to the RSPCA keeps crossing my mind but what if no one adopts him?

I wonder if maybe the problem was after Big passed she 'bonded', as much as they can, with me and my OH (following us around, sleeping on our bed etc).

Could it be possible she doesn't want another bun around? Or do buns always want a partner?

Hmm....I also wonder how I could enrich her environment. She ignores all her toys and can't figure out her treat ball (she always drowns it! Teddy can work it). The only thing she likes in cardboard and paper... but I'm concerned about her having these as she actually eats them, she'd eat a whole cardboard box if I let her.

Hmmm...any fun bunny toys ideas? Thanks a lot for your advise by the way, it makes everything seem a bit less dreadful!

Ah yes, I've recently stopped giving my two cardboard after a bout of stasis that I was convinced was caused by Fiver eating a box. Have you tried loo roll tubes stuffed with hay? I don't mind mine having the odd one of these, as long as they aren't eating tons of cardboard and their guts are healthy, there shouldn't be a problem.
You could also try giving her full loo rolls or kitchen roles to shred, obviously watch her to make sure she doesn't eat any!

Fiver is very intelligent and loves his puzzle ball, if she can't figure it out then maybe try another puzzle feeder? I used to have an "egg" that was very easy for a bun to get the food out of. All they needed to do was push it, it was also quite large and I think Little might find it more difficult to plonk in her water bowl. :lol:
Has she got lots of tunnels and hidey holes etc? What about sea grass and willow balls? Mine won't touch these but most bunnies love destroying them and they are edible.

It is difficult about Teddy, but I would definitely be thinking about their welfare. You have to think about Teddy as well as Little, he will need a friend too, so if they don't bond you could end up needing to adopt a further two bunnies.
Not all rabbits like other bunnies, but Little has been bonded before and she will definitely be feeling lonely. Her behaviour shows that, unfortunately.

Definitely try sending them off to be bonded. If Little is anything like Fiver, she will be quite territorial, completely neutral ground will definitely help matters.

 

[Schtoffen]

Thanks for your detailed response, I really appreciate it.

I am thinking of Ted's welfare; but I also genuinely don't want to ship him off again now as he's living with a human for the first time in his short, terrifying life and he's just started to open up and be happier.

Last night we put them in their new run in the garden (neither have been in the garden before) with one set of bars diving them (they usually have two with a gap between, it's that bad!). There was a lot of squaring up but no bites which I guess is a plus.

I hate bonding. #

I did laugh at the idea of little with a loo roll as she'd eat the entire thing then start on the kitchen roll.... :roll:

They hay thingies are a good idea though; I'll try that. She seemed happier for her garden trip last night, she did some mega binkies when she got in. Ted was just chillin'; he's always chillin'

 

[Schtoffen]

Ah yes, I've recently stopped giving my two cardboard after a bout of stasis that I was convinced was caused by Fiver eating a box. Have you tried loo roll tubes stuffed with hay? I don't mind mine having the odd one of these, as long as they aren't eating tons of cardboard and their guts are healthy, there shouldn't be a problem.
You could also try giving her full loo rolls or kitchen roles to shred, obviously watch her to make sure she doesn't eat any!

Fiver is very intelligent and loves his puzzle ball, if she can't figure it out then maybe try another puzzle feeder? I used to have an "egg" that was very easy for a bun to get the food out of. All they needed to do was push it, it was also quite large and I think Little might find it more difficult to plonk in her water bowl. :lol:
Has she got lots of tunnels and hidey holes etc? What about sea grass and willow balls? Mine won't touch these but most bunnies love destroying them and they are edible.

It is difficult about Teddy, but I would definitely be thinking about their welfare. You have to think about Teddy as well as Little, he will need a friend too, so if they don't bond you could end up needing to adopt a further two bunnies.
Not all rabbits like other bunnies, but Little has been bonded before and she will definitely be feeling lonely. Her behaviour shows that, unfortunately.

Definitely try sending them off to be bonded. If Little is anything like Fiver, she will be quite territorial, completely neutral ground will definitely help matters.

And Yes, Little is v.territorial; she even thinks my bed is hers the little so and so :roll:

 

[natsusakura]

:lol:

Little is exactly like Freddie my Belgian hare X
I say I'd love to steal her but now I'm not so sure I could cope with two mad bunnies :lol:

I'm getting Freddie bonded into a quad hopefully tomorrow.
As he has been chewing my doors non stop.
He also does the whole omg who the hell are you RUN AWAYYYYYYY thing :lol:

He was going crazy doing so many 2 foot in the air binkiess earlier and bunny 500's.

It just sounds as though Little is annoyed that she can see and smell another bun and isn't getting to play with him yet.

Parsley was the exact same as well while we were waiting to get him bonded.

this thread need's more little pics!!!! Even if they will just be a beautiful blur :lol:

 

[Vegan_Bunny]

How are thing progressing? Have you thought about sending them off to a rescue to bond them? This might be better because if you are stressed they may pick up on it (especially Little as she seems very intelligent). Fiver picks up on my moods immediately and will tend to take it out on poor Xena.

Little and Fiver would be a very interesting mix! :lol: He also sees my bed as "his" and Xena usually gets a nice nip if she jumps up, poor girl!

 

[Schtoffen]

Hi natsusakura... yes I swear Little and Freddie are related. They look identical and though I've scoured the internet I've never found another Belgian X that looks like her. If you tell me he was also bought at a P@H towards the end of 2011 I'd be officially freaked out!

Actually Vegan there's been some very small progress. My OH says he's sick of having Little living in the hallway so he wants them bounded. I hide indoors while he puts them in the run with some bars between them. They're getting better at not biting. He even tried once with no bars! :shock:

There were bites apparently but nowhere near as bad as before. He's a lot better at this than I am!

Here's a Little classic:

 

[natsusakura]

Wahhh I love her!!!!
I tried binding Freddie with 3 other buns yesterday and my god, he locks on like he is a breeding rabbit!
Like will not let go and thrust, thrust thrust.
I felt so bad for poor biscuit..
So I had to remove him from the bond and I am now sorting out the trio then I will attempt to introduce Freddie slowly, ill pop him im a pen side by aide and for a bit then see if I can get him bonded into a quad.

If not I think im going to have to adopt a baby bun that will be very submissive to him.

Sounds as though there is progress being made with little
Xxxxx

 

[Tamsin]

The running into wall etc. in panic when you get home sounds like you startled her and she didn't realise it was you. Scamp will bolt like this is I startle him in the middle of night. It's down to rabbits instincts, they are sensitive to sudden movement/noises that could signal predators and they'll bolt for cover rather than wait around to investigate further. Most likely you are making some noise/movement that triggers her potential danger detector and she's not taking time to ID'd you as you. I'd suggest you have some 'it's me signal' eg call out 'honey I'm home' before unlocking the door or whatever action triggers the panic. I click at Scamp before turning the light on/entering his room.

The other thing is to make sure she has somewhere to bolt to. Rabbit's bolt for cover, and if they are in a confined space with a 'tunnel' to disappear into they'll rocket around the room jumping up the walls in panic to get away. It can be something simple like a cardboard box with a couple of entrances. Likewise they need the same when in a run, they don't see mesh as secure it feels like open space.

On bonding, a divider is a good way to get them used to scent, but remember it will become the territory boundary so you'll likely see aggression when they approach each other along it, likewise if you put them in the same space and then lift out the divider, the territory boundary is still there but now there is no barrier stopping physical aggression - it's asking for a fight as they'll want to stop the other rabbit getting in their half. You need a neutral area and don't divide it first.

 

[Schtoffen]

On bonding, a divider is a good way to get them used to scent, but remember it will become the territory boundary so you'll likely see aggression when they approach each other along it, likewise if you put them in the same space and then lift out the divider, the territory boundary is still there but now there is no barrier stopping physical aggression - it's asking for a fight as they'll want to stop the other rabbit getting in their half. You need a neutral area and don't divide it first.

I did think that but the trouble is when Little feels frightened her natural response is to kick off straight away. And she's such a pain to catch to take her outside that she's normally stressed by the time. If I added Teddybun into the mix too I think she'd do her mad wildcat fighting like before. I know, I'm such a coward!!

I do call every time I get home :lol: I think perhaps it's when she's fast asleep and I come through the door and she goes 'ARRRRGGGHHHH WHO ARE YOU???':roll:

 

[Vegan_Bunny]

I heard about how your other bun died...perhaps she remembers this and is terrified of it happening again?

Could you send them to be bonded elsewhere? To a rescue perhaps? I can't remember if I actually suggested this before!