EC success rates

[jTsqueek]

Good morning,
My hear is breaking and I need some advice. We suspect that my bun Pepper has EC. She has the head tilt, nystagmus,urine incontinent,refusing food and fluids,she's very wobbly. We started panacur yesterday - the head tilt was a new symptom, prior to that we thought it was teeth related stasis,so had been treating with clopamon,syringe feeding etc

My question is, how successful is treatment for EC? Do I continue putting my baby through stressful syringe feeding,butt baths- so that she doesn't get urine scald from the incontinence, multiple visits to the vet? With the hopes that the panacur starts working?

 

[InspectorMorse]

I assume that your Rabbit is receiving Veterinary Care ? Was EC confirmed by PCR blood testing ? Middle ear disease can cause similar symptoms to EC and it’s important to try to ascertain what condition you are dealing with in order to give the correct treatment.

With both EC and Otitis Media/ Interna the road to recovery can take months and months of on going intensive care. Some Rabbits can tolerate all the hands on care needed, others find it all far too stressful. Quality of life always needs to be considered when it comes to how long to persevere with treatment.

As well as Panacur a non steroidal anti inflammatory is also needed. It is inflammation within the CNS that causes the clinical symptoms. The fact that your Rabbit has nystagmus indicates that either EC or a bacterial infection has reached the brain. So the dizziness and loss of balance is likely to be profound and can involve lots of rolling. There are other medications that a Rabbit savvy Vet can prescribe which can help reduce the severity of the symptoms and to insure gut motility is maintained. A reduced appetite can lead to secondary gut stasis. If your Rabbit’s symptoms are due to a bacterial middle/inner ear infection then antibiotic cover is needed. That is why it is important to try to establish exactly what condition you are dealing with.

It is impossible to give you a specific answer to your ‘success rates’ question. Each case is unique. The following links might be useful to read. I emphasise the importance to always have the input from a Rabbit Savvy Vet

WARNING-GRAPHIC IMAGES ON THIS LINK
https://www.vettimes.co.uk/app/uplo...phalitozoon-cuniculi-infection-in-rabbits.pdf

http://www.medirabbit.com/EN/Neurology/head_tilt.htm

https://www.dovepress.com/encephali...-manageme-peer-reviewed-fulltext-article-VMRR

WARNING GRAPHIC IMAGES ON THIS LINK
https://www.vettimes.co.uk/app/uplo...itis-externa-media-and-interna-in-rabbits.pdf

http://www.disabledrabbits.com/head-tilt.html

 

[Shimmer]

Jane has given you lots of information.

If it is EC, then the treatment will work. You may need to do several 28 cycles of Panacur (to reduce the spores) and an anti-inflammatory such as Metacam (to reduce the severity of the damage which causes the symptoms), but you shoud notice an improvement in the first cycle. It can be a rollercoaster with more severe cases getting slightly better one week, then much worse again. Just stick with it. Most cases resolve, maybe with some symptoms like a head tilt remaining. Rabbits learn to cope really well.

If there is no definitive diagnosis, a vet will often suggest Panacur, anti-inflammatory and antibiotic to cover a range of conditions. It's just time consuming to keep up with the meds, feeding and cleaning. There are lots of things that can help, like nappy creams to reduce urine scald and using puppy pads to keep the floor drier. If she's mobile, she may be able to feed herself to some extent, so put food where she can reach it. Hay or grass is still important, but a recovery food can be left on a heavy saucer if she will lap it up. Water also needs to be accessible - so where she can reach it without risk of it tipping out.

If she's outside, I would think about bringing her in so you can keep an eye on her and she doesn't get cold due to immobility. The floor needs to be easy to clean as EC spores are spread in urine, so reinfection occurs when surfaces can't be adequately disinfected. Bleach, steam or products such as Virkon S all kill EC spores.

There's lots of help and support groups available, and some of us on here have had EC bunnies, and some have had bunnies with ear infections so can offer more specific advice if needed.

 

[jTsqueek]

I assume that your Rabbit is receiving Veterinary Care ? Was EC confirmed by PCR blood testing ? Middle ear disease can cause similar symptoms to EC and it’s important to try to ascertain what condition you are dealing with in order to give the correct treatment.

With both EC and Otitis Media/ Interna the road to recovery can take months and months of on going intensive care. Some Rabbits can tolerate all the hands on care needed, others find it all far too stressful. Quality of life always needs to be considered when it comes to how long to persevere with treatment.

As well as Panacur a non steroidal anti inflammatory is also needed. It is inflammation within the CNS that causes the clinical symptoms. The fact that your Rabbit has nystagmus indicates that either EC or a bacterial infection has reached the brain. So the dizziness and loss of balance is likely to be profound and can involve lots of rolling. There are other medications that a Rabbit savvy Vet can prescribe which can help reduce the severity of the symptoms and to insure gut motility is maintained. A reduced appetite can lead to secondary gut stasis. If your Rabbit’s symptoms are due to a bacterial middle/inner ear infection then antibiotic cover is needed. That is why it is important to try to establish exactly what condition you are dealing with.

It is impossible to give you a specific answer to your ‘success rates’ question. Each case is unique. The following links might be useful to read. I emphasise the importance to always have the input from a Rabbit Savvy Vet

WARNING-GRAPHIC IMAGES ON THIS LINK
https://www.vettimes.co.uk/app/uplo...phalitozoon-cuniculi-infection-in-rabbits.pdf

http://www.medirabbit.com/EN/Neurology/head_tilt.htm

https://www.dovepress.com/encephali...-manageme-peer-reviewed-fulltext-article-VMRR

WARNING GRAPHIC IMAGES ON THIS LINK
https://www.vettimes.co.uk/app/uplo...itis-externa-media-and-interna-in-rabbits.pdf

http://www.disabledrabbits.com/head-tilt.html

Thank you so much for your reply,
I'm sorry I should have done a better job of giving you the full picture.
Pepper started with lack of appetite a week ago, which I assumed was teeth related (she often gets spurs) ,she was still pooping,weeing etc being her usual self, eating treats but not hay or food. I made an appointment for a dental for her and carried on in the meantime with softened foods etc which for a few days was fine, we were keeping her hydrated, and she was pooping.
Then things changed very quickly, and she was fighting me with the syringe feeds, she stopped pooping and her wee was very concentrated. So straight to the vet we went, and we started her on IM metacam, clopamon and broad spectrum antibiotics. The head tilt only started on Sunday evening (2days ago - which was also after 2 days worth of antibiotics) and has gotten worse each day.
She's very disco-ordinated and circling, but no siezures or rolling that I have seen, she's also very restless and agitated. And will only take small amounts by syringe with a big fight, in between I leave the saucer of food available to her,as well as water, but she's not interested.

So in summary we are day 2 Panacur and day 4 antibiotics, metacam and clopamon.

Testing for EC is not available in my country except post mortem,so we are going on presentation at the moment.

 

[InspectorMorse]

Thank you so much for your reply,
I'm sorry I should have done a better job of giving you the full picture.
Pepper started with lack of appetite a week ago, which I assumed was teeth related (she often gets spurs) ,she was still pooping,weeing etc being her usual self, eating treats but not hay or food. I made an appointment for a dental for her and carried on in the meantime with softened foods etc which for a few days was fine, we were keeping her hydrated, and she was pooping.
Then things changed very quickly, and she was fighting me with the syringe feeds, she stopped pooping and her wee was very concentrated. So straight to the vet we went, and we started her on IM metacam, clopamon and broad spectrum antibiotics. The head tilt only started on Sunday evening (2days ago - which was also after 2 days worth of antibiotics) and has gotten worse each day.
She's very disco-ordinated and circling, but no siezures or rolling that I have seen, she's also very restless and agitated. And will only take small amounts by syringe with a big fight, in between I leave the saucer of food available to her,as well as water, but she's not interested.

So in summary we are day 2 Panacur and day 4 antibiotics, metacam and clopamon.

Testing for EC is not available in my country except post mortem,so we are going on presentation at the moment.

It is extremely early days yet. If it is EC things can seem to get a lot worse before there is any signs of improvement. You are looking at weeks sometimes, not days. If you are unable to get any syringe feeds into her then she really needs hospital admission. It’s very important that she has some input and output, otherwise gut stasis will occur. She probably feels very dizzy and whilst Rabbits cannot vomit the dizziness might make her feel a sensation similar to nausea. So she certainly will not feel like eating. The Vet can prescribe a medication to try to reduce the dizziness, eg Prochlorperazine. A shot of VitB 12 can stimulate the appetite

 

[bunny momma]

I had bunnies who had head tilt from middle ear infection and they recovered, though the head tilt may take time to improve or may remain.
Handling will make bunny feel worse, so move bunny as little as possible when giving meds, syringe feeding or giving care.
It seems you caught this early, so that improves the success rate.
Ask your vet if the antibiotic is appropriate to treat ear infection since it was started before head tilt appeared.
Like already mentioned medicam can help with inflammation.

 

[Floppylop]

My bunny arrived at 10 weeks with e-cunli, he was treated with Panacur and altho he has some eye sight issues he got through it and has done fine