Bonding - to continue or call it a day

[Trufflesmum]

I would appreciate your thoughts. I have had a trio for years but have recently used a professional bonder to add two more rabbits this year (separately). I have concerns about how it is going but the bonder has suggested it is all down to spring fever.
The five have been together about 4 weeks now. They have their shed and part of the outside.
Rabbit number 5 is a dominant rabbit and has a history of failed bonds, however she seems to have formed good relationships with rabbit numbers 2 and 3. There is still a lot of fur pulling and chasing which I know isn’t unusual but rabbit number 4 seems to be the main target and number 5 the instigator. number 4 is 8 years old and a real sweety. She’s keen to be friends and puts her head down to get affection off the others however I’ve noticed a change in her personality and she seems very nervous and on edge, sometimes reluctant to come for her food.
I don’t know if she’s benefitting from this bond and I’m worried when I keep finding chunks of her fur. How do I decide to continue or take her out? Thank you

 

[bunny momma]

Am I correct #4 and 5 are the new bunnies?
Where does #1stand?
Was #5 added to the trio before #4?
I cannot help with this, yet others may want these things clarified.
Sending positive vibes for #4.

 

[InspectorMorse]

What are the genders of each Rabbit ?
Bowing the head to ask to be groomed can be indicative of wanting to be considered superior, not to be friends as such. Hence the head bowing can cause the chasing if the Rabbit being asked to do the grooming does not want to do it and show submission.

Have you got a camera set up so you can have a better idea of the dynamics of the bond if you are only seeing snippets of it and finding ‘chunks of fur’. You’d need to see how they are behaving on a continuous basis, not just when you are there.

if Rabbit 4 is now getting very stressed to the point of becoming reluctant to eat then you do need to be extra vigilant re her gut motility. Stress can trigger gut stasis.

 

[Trufflesmum]

Am I correct #4 and 5 are the new bunnies?
Where does #1stand?
Was #5 added to the trio before #4?
I cannot help with this, yet others may want these things clarified.
Sending positive vibes for #4.

Yes correct in that they are the new bunnies. 5 was added last.

 

[Trufflesmum]

What are the genders of each Rabbit ?
Bowing the head to ask to be groomed can be indicative of wanting to be considered superior, not to be friends as such. Hence the head bowing can cause the chasing if the Rabbit being asked to do the grooming does not want to do it and show submission.

Have you got a camera set up so you can have a better idea of the dynamics of the bond if you are only seeing snippets of it and finding ‘chunks of fur’. You’d need to see how they are behaving on a continuous basis, not just when you are there.

if Rabbit 4 is now getting very stressed to the point of becoming reluctant to eat then you do need to be extra vigilant re her gut motility. Stress can trigger gut stasis.

Number 2 is the only male who seems to be adored by all the others.
Didn’t realise that about head bowing. She looks like she is at the bottom of the pecking order but will try to observe if that behaviour prompts the chasing.
Unfortunately i haven’t got a camera but will look into this. Hopefully not too expensive.
Yes re possible stasis, I am keeping a close eye. I am scatter feeding but need to put the food close to her for her to eat.
Thank you for replying

 

[Trufflesmum]

Yes correct in that they are the new bunnies. 5 was added last.

Sorry I didn’t answer about number one. She is an older bunny 8/9. She does get chased but not nearly as often as 4. She isn’t easily phased by things so doesn’t seem to affected by it all. Number 1 has a very strong bond with 2 and 3. She hasn’t shown any aggression towards the newcomers.

 

[InspectorMorse]

I think a camera would be a very useful investment as it is the only way you will get a true picture of what is going on.

Does most of the chasing occur around feeding times? If the group associates seeing you as being indicative of the provision of food it will trigger displays of dominance. It is normal behaviour. What would be concerning is if the chasing goes on most of the time. That would not be a situation that I would be happy with. It would mean that the chasing has become bullying behaviour. That would necessitate considering dividing the group into two separate more compatible combinations.

 

[Omi]

Just to add that four weeks into a bond is quite early. Also a bond with five is going to be more challenging, especially when four of those five are female. Focus not only by who is being chased but also who is the main chaser? Is this always the same bunny? It's also important to determine, as Inspector Morse has said, whether this chasing occurs only at food time.

 

[joey&boo]

If bunny 4 is genuinely submissive I'd say thats a good thing. I Agree a camera is a good investment - I was looking at them recently & was surprised how inexpensive they are. It'd be really useful to know if 4 & 5 particularly share any nice moments. I've never bonded big groups - my trio took way long than any pair.I gave up on my quad as I felt deep down I couldn't trust them - felt they didn't want to be together. With my trio the bossy one would also cuddle, groom & share food with the submiissive one - we just had to wait for the nice behaviours to increase & the chasing to massively subside ....it never stopped completely. It is heartbreaking watching submissive bun having to work so hard for acceptance but sadly I think thats normal. I'd be super vigilant to see she is eating & pooping well & getting some positive interaction from the others. I really hope it works out for everybun

I bet your boy rabbit is very pleased with himself having 4 females

 

[Trufflesmum]

Just to add that four weeks into a bond is quite early. Also a bond with five is going to be more challenging, especially when four of those five are female. Focus not only by who is being chased but also who is the main chaser? Is this always the same bunny? It's also important to determine, as Inspector Morse has said, whether this chasing occurs only at food time.

Number 5 is definitely the main chaser. I don’t think the chasing just happens at food time. I can see activity in the run from my lounge window. There’s quite a lot of activity and chasing at dusk and feeding time is at 4.30. I find fur in the morning that wasn’t there the night before. In contrast It’s been a nice day today and they’ve been chilling in the sunshine together so it’s not all the time but I guess it’s also how each individual tolerates it.

 

[Trufflesmum]

I think a camera would be a very useful investment as it is the only way you will get a true picture of what is going on.

Does most of the chasing occur around feeding times? If the group associates seeing you as being indicative of the provision of food it will trigger displays of dominance. It is normal behaviour. What would be concerning is if the chasing goes on most of the time. That would not be a situation that I would be happy with. It would mean that the chasing has become bullying behaviour. That would necessitate considering dividing the group into two separate more compatible combinations.

Chasing does happen at feeding time but other times too. The camera idea is a good one. Thank you. I’m looking into it. I think without a camera I can’t really answer how much of the time is spent chasing. I think what worries me most is number 4s reaction. She seems much more worried by it.

 

[Trufflesmum]

Number 5 is definitely the main chaser. I don’t think the chasing just happens at food time. I can see activity in the run from my lounge window. There’s quite a lot of activity and chasing at dusk and feeding time is at 4.30. I find fur in the morning that wasn’t there the night before. In contrast It’s been a nice day today and they’ve been chilling in the sunshine together so it’s not all the time but I guess it’s also how each individual tolerates it.

If this doesn’t work and I need to take number 5 out, I think I will have to give up on finding her friends. I have tried really hard and this is bond number 9 or 10! So I have quite an investment in this working for her.

 

[InspectorMorse]

If this doesn’t work and I need to take number 5 out, I think I will have to give up on finding her friends. I have tried really hard and this is bond number 9 or 10! So I have quite an investment in this working for her.

I hope that given a bit more time things will eventually work out.

 

[bunny momma]

If #5 gets along with two bunnies, could you bond #4 and the remaining bunny, #1 ? Ithink another post suggested spliting them into two groups too.

 

[Trufflesmum]

Hi, trouble is bunnies 1,2 and 3 have been bonded for years and have a very close bond so I’m reluctant to separate.

 

[Omi]

I think as long as it is not affecting No 4 too much I would give it some more time. Chasing is fine and is sometimes due to excitement rather than anything else. It sounds as though there hasn't been any actual aggression and that the only bunny to be unhappy at the moment is No 4. I think if you can ensure that she is eating, it would be worthwhile waiting a little while before giving up. Perhaps think of different ways to give them food.

 

[Trufflesmum]

Thank you. That’s good advice.