Help please - sick rabbit, vet cannot resolve

[Jack's-Jane]

Thanks MightMax.

Update: Exotics vet thought it could be a number of things and has recommended a suite of tests including bloods and x-ray on Tuesday next week. He was quite concerned and identified that actually the skin condition is all over him, you just can't see it because of the fur. Tom is likely to lose all of his fur at some point it seems now.

Sebacious Adentitis (which a poster had already suggested above) is suspected and apparently treatments are very limited or experiemental.

Vet recommended Metacam as a pain killer, so he had a dose oral of that yesterday lunch time.

Tom didn't eat too well last night and was refusing the handfuls of grass that I normally give him to boost him up and keep his gut moving. He wasn't eating that well this morning either, only taking food if I put it right under his nose. Metacam has a side effect of lethargy and loss of appetite, so we have stopped that just in case.

He is now looking a bit perkier and will eat cabbage but not much else seems to interest him for some reason. He even pushed the bowl of hard feed and museli away, showing he didn't want it.

Exotic vet is not there today as bank holiday but another vet has suggested Recovery fluid via syringe to give him a boost of vitamins etc.

Has anyone tried "Recovery". It is called "Recovery Liquid Feed".

I feared it may be but hoped my suggestion was wrong. It still may be of course.

Re the Recovery Food, there are a few brands available, all providing similar nutrients. Syringe feeding can help to keep a sick Rabbit's GI tract moving. Gut stasis can develop as a secondary condition when a Bun is unwell.

 

[MightyMax]

Thanks MightMax.

Update: Exotics vet thought it could be a number of things and has recommended a suite of tests including bloods and x-ray on Tuesday next week. He was quite concerned and identified that actually the skin condition is all over him, you just can't see it because of the fur. Tom is likely to lose all of his fur at some point it seems now.

Sebacious Adentitis (which a poster had already suggested above) is suspected and apparently treatments are very limited or experiemental.

Vet recommended Metacam as a pain killer, so he had a dose oral of that yesterday lunch time.

Tom didn't eat too well last night and was refusing the handfuls of grass that I normally give him to boost him up and keep his gut moving. He wasn't eating that well this morning either, only taking food if I put it right under his nose. Metacam has a side effect of lethargy and loss of appetite, so we have stopped that just in case.

He is now looking a bit perkier and will eat cabbage but not much else seems to interest him for some reason. He even pushed the bowl of hard feed and museli away, showing he didn't want it.

Exotic vet is not there today as bank holiday but another vet has suggested Recovery fluid via syringe to give him a boost of vitamins etc.

Has anyone tried "Recovery". It is called "Recovery Liquid Feed".

You're welcome

I am so glad you've sought expert help for Tom.


I am guessing your vet means this food?

https://www.petplanet.co.uk/product.asp?dept_id=442&pf_id=59390

What Recovery food is, is simply a ground up feed that can be mixed with water - and baby food - and made palatable for rabbits. It contains lots of essential nutrients.

I've also used the rabbit's regular pellets and mashed them up (sometimes blended) with Ella's Kitchen Baby food -(https://www.ellaskitchen.co.uk) fruit or veg varieties. You can also combine it with apple, orange or pineapple juice.

Loads of vibes for Tom

 

[ToffTom]

Quick update:
Saturday morning Tom was still pretty lethargic and not interested in food and bad diarrhoea, so we took him to our regular vet. They gave him injections of metacam and a Ranitidine gut protector and gave us oral Ranitidine. We brought him home and I noticed he was licking up any loose muck he could find in the travel box so I put a bowl of food in front of him and to our amazement he started eating it ! He also seemed more alert so one of teh jabs must have worked.

Since then we've been having to kep his bum clean (just paper toweling it because he has so much bare chapped skin in there from his skin condition) but he has been eating better and better since. Last night he started taking grass again and this morning to our disbelief he was waiting at the hutch door and when we opened it he barreled out! He hasn't hopped out of the hutch for weeks. I say barreled as he still has rear leg / balance problems so he ended up on his side on the floor outside but picked himself up and hopped off. He seems OK on flat surfaces but falls if he tried to do a big jump.

Today Tom went back to the exotics vet with the intention that he would have a general anaesthetic to do bloods, a biopsy and x-ray. We've been worrying about whether he was well enough for the general. Luckily the vet questioned this too so decided to do the bloods under a local and take some skin flakes from loosened hair to send for analysis. He is still eating well but his weight has dropped from 2.0kg to 1.3kg, which is quite alarming.

We're putting as much food that he likes under his nose as possible. Our other rabbit, Toffer, will probaby be like a balloon from getting extra food but Tom is eating and eating so hoping he will put weight back on and we've turned some sort of a corner with him. He is still pretty unwell but the diarrhoea is much reduced and he is hopping and eating so looks more hopeful than last week when we thought we were losing him.

 

[Omi]

This is good news I'm so pleased for him and you.

 

[MightyMax]

Quick update:
Saturday morning Tom was still pretty lethargic and not interested in food and bad diarrhoea, so we took him to our regular vet. They gave him injections of metacam and a Ranitidine gut protector and gave us oral Ranitidine. We brought him home and I noticed he was licking up any loose muck he could find in the travel box so I put a bowl of food in front of him and to our amazement he started eating it ! He also seemed more alert so one of teh jabs must have worked.

Since then we've been having to kep his bum clean (just paper toweling it because he has so much bare chapped skin in there from his skin condition) but he has been eating better and better since. Last night he started taking grass again and this morning to our disbelief he was waiting at the hutch door and when we opened it he barreled out! He hasn't hopped out of the hutch for weeks. I say barreled as he still has rear leg / balance problems so he ended up on his side on the floor outside but picked himself up and hopped off. He seems OK on flat surfaces but falls if he tried to do a big jump.

Today Tom went back to the exotics vet with the intention that he would have a general anaesthetic to do bloods, a biopsy and x-ray. We've been worrying about whether he was well enough for the general. Luckily the vet questioned this too so decided to do the bloods under a local and take some skin flakes from loosened hair to send for analysis. He is still eating well but his weight has dropped from 2.0kg to 1.3kg, which is quite alarming.

We're putting as much food that he likes under his nose as possible. Our other rabbit, Toffer, will probaby be like a balloon from getting extra food but Tom is eating and eating so hoping he will put weight back on and we've turned some sort of a corner with him. He is still pretty unwell but the diarrhoea is much reduced and he is hopping and eating so looks more hopeful than last week when we thought we were losing him.

You are caring for him so brilliantly - you couldn't be doing more, and your vet sounds really good

I'm so glad Tom's been having a better time of it. I can feel from your post his enthusiasm and love of his life. Poor lad - he doesn't know there's anything wrong and is making the best of each day, as it comes.

I'm sorry to hear about his weight loss, but hopefully this will now pick up and also boost his immune system. I know this thing where the second rabbit eats so much because the food is there - you paint a lovely picture of Toffer

Love and hugs to little Tom, the fighter bun

 

[Jack's-Jane]

Quick update:
Saturday morning Tom was still pretty lethargic and not interested in food and bad diarrhoea, so we took him to our regular vet. They gave him injections of metacam and a Ranitidine gut protector and gave us oral Ranitidine. We brought him home and I noticed he was licking up any loose muck he could find in the travel box so I put a bowl of food in front of him and to our amazement he started eating it ! He also seemed more alert so one of teh jabs must have worked.

Since then we've been having to kep his bum clean (just paper toweling it because he has so much bare chapped skin in there from his skin condition) but he has been eating better and better since. Last night he started taking grass again and this morning to our disbelief he was waiting at the hutch door and when we opened it he barreled out! He hasn't hopped out of the hutch for weeks. I say barreled as he still has rear leg / balance problems so he ended up on his side on the floor outside but picked himself up and hopped off. He seems OK on flat surfaces but falls if he tried to do a big jump.

Today Tom went back to the exotics vet with the intention that he would have a general anaesthetic to do bloods, a biopsy and x-ray. We've been worrying about whether he was well enough for the general. Luckily the vet questioned this too so decided to do the bloods under a local and take some skin flakes from loosened hair to send for analysis. He is still eating well but his weight has dropped from 2.0kg to 1.3kg, which is quite alarming.

We're putting as much food that he likes under his nose as possible. Our other rabbit, Toffer, will probaby be like a balloon from getting extra food but Tom is eating and eating so hoping he will put weight back on and we've turned some sort of a corner with him. He is still pretty unwell but the diarrhoea is much reduced and he is hopping and eating so looks more hopeful than last week when we thought we were losing him.

I hope that he will stabalise now and not have any more diarrhoea. Do you know when the results of the blood tests will be back ? I expect the Vet will be looking at Tom's liver function in particular.

 

[cpayne]

That's brilliant news. Hopefully he's turned a corner now and he'll get fatter in no time!

 

[TheThreeB's]

All the best to you. It sounds like you are doing everything you can and it must be a relief to have seen some improvements x

 

[ToffTom]

Thanks everyone. Yes we are feeling more positive about Tom. Just wish he could get his balance back. Would be lovely to see him run and jump properly again. Still he is still here at least, so we should be thankful and not rush things. I should correct the name of our other rabbit: it is Toffee not Toffer ha ha, sorry my mistake. Although Toffer sounds quite good too. She is a brown/white/black lop-eared rabbit. She is a bit bigger than Tom but they love each other to bits and love snugging up to each other. Toffee will usually eat faster than Tom and pinch food from him, sometimes from nearly out of his mouth but she knew he was very ill I think as she was lifting food out of the bowl and putting it down in front of him ! They are more clever and sensitive than we give credit for.

Sadly, Tom didn't burst out of the hutch this morning. He seemed pretty tired today. Still eating well though. Toffee actually seemed to be off her food this morning. Initial thoughts were oh no, I hope she hasn't gone down with this condition but then realised that she was actually probably still stuffed from eating some of the second batch of cereal I put in last night for Tom !

Expecting blood test results back next Tuesday. The vet that saw Tom yesterday didn't seem to think it was Sebatious Adenitis, more like maybe EC or rabbit syphalis (sorry for spellings) or maybe a combination of things. Thymoma wasn't mentioned this time. I thought they go head tilt with EC - Tom not doing that. Good news though was that he felt confident about being able to treat several of the things that it could be.


Expecting results back in a week.

 

[Jack's-Jane]

Thanks everyone. Yes we are feeling more positive about Tom. Just wish he could get his balance back. Would be lovely to see him run and jump properly again. Still he is still here at least, so we should be thankful and not rush things. I should correct the name of our other rabbit: it is Toffee not Toffer ha ha, sorry my mistake. Although Toffer sounds quite good too. She is a brown/white/black lop-eared rabbit. She is a bit bigger than Tom but they love each other to bits and love snugging up to each other. Toffee will usually eat faster than Tom and pinch food from him, sometimes from nearly out of his mouth but she knew he was very ill I think as she was lifting food out of the bowl and putting it down in front of him ! They are more clever and sensitive than we give credit for.

Sadly, Tom didn't burst out of the hutch this morning. He seemed pretty tired today. Still eating well though. Toffee actually seemed to be off her food this morning. Initial thoughts were oh no, I hope she hasn't gone down with this condition but then realised that she was actually probably still stuffed from eating some of the second batch of cereal I put in last night for Tom !

Expecting blood test results back next Tuesday. The vet that saw Tom yesterday didn't seem to think it was Sebatious Adenitis, more like maybe EC or rabbit syphalis (sorry for spellings) or maybe a combination of things. Thymoma wasn't mentioned this time. I thought they go head tilt with EC - Tom not doing that. Good news though was that he felt confident about being able to treat several of the things that it could be.


Expecting results back in a week.

Hopefully the blood test results will give the Vet some insight into the best course of action to try to help Tom. I am sure that the not knowing what is wrong must be very stressful for you x

 

[MightyMax]

Thanks everyone. Yes we are feeling more positive about Tom. Just wish he could get his balance back. Would be lovely to see him run and jump properly again. Still he is still here at least, so we should be thankful and not rush things. I should correct the name of our other rabbit: it is Toffee not Toffer ha ha, sorry my mistake. Although Toffer sounds quite good too. She is a brown/white/black lop-eared rabbit. She is a bit bigger than Tom but they love each other to bits and love snugging up to each other. Toffee will usually eat faster than Tom and pinch food from him, sometimes from nearly out of his mouth but she knew he was very ill I think as she was lifting food out of the bowl and putting it down in front of him ! They are more clever and sensitive than we give credit for.

Sadly, Tom didn't burst out of the hutch this morning. He seemed pretty tired today. Still eating well though. Toffee actually seemed to be off her food this morning. Initial thoughts were oh no, I hope she hasn't gone down with this condition but then realised that she was actually probably still stuffed from eating some of the second batch of cereal I put in last night for Tom !

Expecting blood test results back next Tuesday. The vet that saw Tom yesterday didn't seem to think it was Sebatious Adenitis, more like maybe EC or rabbit syphalis (sorry for spellings) or maybe a combination of things. Thymoma wasn't mentioned this time. I thought they go head tilt with EC - Tom not doing that. Good news though was that he felt confident about being able to treat several of the things that it could be.


Expecting results back in a week.

I hope the blood results will help reach a diagnosis.

If it is rabbit syphilis, then it's an easier one to fix than Sebaceous Adenines:

http://www.medirabbit.com/EN/Skin_diseases/Bacterial/Syph_gen.html

The treatment is injected penicillin

 

[ToffTom]

Thanks, yes Penicillin was mentioned, along with that it is quite risky in rabbits as they don't deal with it very well and there can be complications.

Thanks for the interesting link. That is consistent with some of his symptoms but not the hair loss or loss of balance but as the vet said, he could have multiple problems.

 

[MightyMax]

Thanks, yes Penicillin was mentioned, along with that it is quite risky in rabbits as they don't deal with it very well and there can be complications.

Thanks for the interesting link. That is consistent with some of his symptoms but not the hair loss or loss of balance but as the vet said, he could have multiple problems.

A vet that says injected penicillin is 'quite risky in rabbits as they don't deal with it very well and there can be complications' would have me worried, to be honest.

When one of my rabbits had an abscess, that's what my vet said to me. I went to another vet for treatment as penicillin is widely recognised for abscess, syphilis and many other conditions and it's very safe If it's indicated for a condition, it *does* work very well. There are rarely any complications with injected penicillin.

 

[ToffTom]

A vet that says injected penicillin is 'quite risky in rabbits as they don't deal with it very well and there can be complications' would have me worried, to be honest.

When one of my rabbits had an abscess, that's what my vet said to me. I went to another vet for treatment as penicillin is widely recognised for abscess, syphilis and many other conditions and it's very safe If it's indicated for a condition, it *does* work very well. There are rarely any complications with injected penicillin.

That's a bit of a concern. He said he would use the penicillin but a low dose and we would need to be aware that there could be complications so we'd need to weigh it up at the time. Good to know you have had success with it though. Thanks.

 

[MightyMax]

That's a bit of a concern. He said he would use the penicillin but a low dose and we would need to be aware that there could be complications so we'd need to weigh it up at the time. Good to know you have had success with it though. Thanks.

I'm sorry about this, but saying that he would use a low dose is also worrying If you use an antibiotic - just as with humans - you have to use the appropriate dose for the proper length of time, otherwise the bacteria simply become resistant and stronger, and then the condition becomes worse.

Still, I guess you and your vet will cross that bridge when you come to it. I have looked after hundreds of rabbits over a period of 25 years (my own and many foster/rescue rabbits) and have lost count of how many times I have injected with penicillin. I wouldn't hesitate

 

[ToffTom]

That's good to know. Thanks. I'm thinking we should be using injections instead of orals for Tom. I'm reluctant to do much orally after the Baytril possible reaction and him going lethargic and off food after Metacam.

 

[ToffTom]

We need to put weight on Tom. What's the best food to put weight on a rabbit. He's eating cabbage, carrots, celery leaves, nuggets, cereals and grass but still seems to be off hay unfortunately.

 

[MightyMax]

We need to put weight on Tom. What's the best food to put weight on a rabbit. He's eating cabbage, carrots, celery leaves, nuggets, cereals and grass but still seems to be off hay unfortunately.

A pinch of porridge oats morning and night, high calorie pellets meant for young rabbits, alfalfa hay (unless there's bladder sludge suspected), a few sunflower seeds ....

 

[cpayne]

A pinch of porridge oats morning and night, high calorie pellets meant for young rabbits, alfalfa hay (unless there's bladder sludge suspected), a few sunflower seeds ....

Yes my specialist recommended alfalfa hay, Doughnut loved it and put on weight with it. I gave her a handful a day.

 

[MightyMax]

Yes my specialist recommended alfalfa hay, Doughnut loved it and put on weight with it. I gave her a handful a day.

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