Big bunny little bunny, way too much food?

I've got two rabbits, one's a recent addition to the family [Twinkle] who's nearly twice the size of my first rabbit [Ghibli] who's been with me for 3 years now.

She's really destructive, energetic, and hungry. He's small, happy most of time, and shouldn't eat too much greens co's he gets problems!

I've had to started putting both of them in a pen at night, even though it's mostly due to her destructive nature.

Unfortunately Ghibli's getting more and more upset at being locked up when he's had the free run of the living room for three years. If I leave Ghibli out at night and simply put her in the pen she goes back to destroying sofas instead of cardboard boxes.

Then there's feeding! If I feed them separately Ghibli gets jealous when she gets more, and tries to steel her food! I end up having to move him on, and he gets even more sulky! If I feed them together she either eats all or most of the food, or he pushes her out of the way and eats it all and ends up with a very dirty fluffy bottom.

Although it's never come to any kind of actual aggression, she does seem to get annoyed with him at veggy time, but doesn't seem at all to be in charge in the traditional female bunny sense.


Does anyone have any suggestions on how I can deal with this. I'm used to having to deal with one rabbit at a time

Sorry if I've rambled a bit, and thanks in advance for the help...


Barry

Hi there! Is your new rabbit spayed as if not this would calm her down a lot and she wouldn't be so destructive. Maybe a way round the food problem is to hide it in the hay so they have to search for it. As long as they have plenty of hay or Readigrass it shouldn't be a problem.

tonibun said:

Hi there! Is your new rabbit spayed as if not this would calm her down a lot and she wouldn't be so destructive. Maybe a way round the food problem is to hide it in the hay so they have to search for it. As long as they have plenty of hay or Readigrass it shouldn't be a problem.

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He's neutered, and she's spayed. I've double checked through both the animal sanctuary, and through Pet Plan who have access to the origional vet records for her.

Unfortunately Ghibli's a long haired rabbit, with a delicate digestive system, while she's big, boisterous, and energetic, and twice his size so eat's a lot more.

If Ghibli eats too much green veg he gets a dodgy stomach, and stops eating the cecotropes [faeces] and they get stuck in the long hair arround his bum.

I've always managed Ghibli's diet carefully, but since Twinkle's arrival its got harder to make sure he's not eating too much. She's a lot bigger than he is, but isn't dominant in the relationship, probably because of the way she's been treated.

Ironically the biggest problem is precisely because their close, but Twinkle's not comfortable arround people yet. She's been through several homes, and been rejected from all of them.

I always knew that this wasn't going to be easy! Ghibli took more than three months to settle in, but I think Twinkle's been through a lot more, and it's probably going to take a lot more time for Twinkle to settle in.

The problem is that I don't want to keep upsetting Ghibli by keeping him locked up at night! He's spent all his adult life with total freedom. I want the same for Twinkle, but she's just to destructive at the moment, but locking Ghibli up is clearly upsetting him. He's getting more and more withdrawn.

I need to find a way to give Ghibli back the life he had, manage his diet, without taking him away from Twinkle. I also need to make Twinkle less destructive, but it's almost like she's trying to push as hard as she can to see if I'm also going to send her back. She deliberately chooses things like crutches to destroy, but she a really really nice rabbit. I think she's just scared and it's all she knows!

You might try swapping veggies for forage - dandelion, thistle, blackberry, apple leaves etc. they are generally better tolerated but bunnies consider them just as tasty. For dry food, I would consider just hand feeding as they need so little of that and it will help bonding with you. Another option would be to let your original bun have an extra run about whilst the other bun eats her greens. That way she gets the food and he gets the exercise.

What proportions do you feed of the different foods for each? It might be diet changes will help behaviour ones How big is she? Even a biggish bun should be able to maintain weight on mainly hay, so it maybe cutting back on other foods will mean she needs to eat more hay, which in turn keeps her busier and with less time for destroying things!

She's around twice his size, but there'll be getting weighed next week when I take them for their shots. I try to keep them both on a small amount of greens, no more than a small handful a day [no pellets - dried corn nibblets as treats - but in small amounts]. She obviously eats more, but I started feeding them separately today, and they where ok! I'm trying to get her to the point where she can jusy live out of confinement all the time. I get the sense that a lot of her destructive impulses are about pushing people away because she's been abandoned so often. Ghibli hasn't been confined for three years, and I know it's been depressing him. We left them out while we went to the shops today, and she was actually OK! It might just be a matter of trust more than anything. I think the question I really need to answer is weather I love my couch more than my rabbit's tomorrow I'll either have a happy pair of rabbits, no couch and a happy pair of rabbits, or a slightly chewed couch and a happy pair of rabbits


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I think you might be assigning a little too much human psychology. What we see as destructive behaviour is often rabbits just shaping their environment to how they want it - just like you might knock out a wall or change the layout of furniture in your living room. It's just naturally their environment would be trees, bushes and soil and no one would complain. So digging a carpet is often about trying to excavate a burrow entrance or carve out a hollow for a comfortable sleeping spot. Gnawing the bottom edge of a sofa or cupboard can be them trying to widen the existing gap so they can fit in the nice burrow like space underneath. Many people find the back of sofas a chew spot too - the back makes a nice low burrow/passage, but rabbits prefer two entrances so they try to build one coming sideways (through the middle of the sofa). Table legs etc. are like tree trunks where rabbits would strip bark. Anything that create too narrow a gap or blocks a path is a potential hazard on an emergency bolt for home and needs removing (there go your cables).

The best response is usually to take those instincts and redirect them in a more appropriate way, so for example providing cardboard boxes they can shape for themselves with however many doors in whatever shape they want. Providing a digging box for digging practice or sculpting a comfortable resting spot, tunnels that are suitable size to run through (preferably with side entrances or suitable materials to chew their own. Large rabbit safe logs/branches are good for chewing at. At the same time you provide the alternatives you 'bunny proof' the inappropriate outlets.

Destructive behaviour can also be linked with boredom, rabbits would normal spend most of the day eating and doing important rabbit stuff, living as a pet is a very relaxed lifestyle so they can end up with too much spare time which gives them time to practice their DIY skills. It's not just space but also exercising their brains eg making them work for food can help.

I would agree with pretty much everything but for the fact that a lot of destruction seems to happen directly after things that she doesn't like. Ghibli [my first rabbit] showing and receiving affection imeadiatley after he's run away from her because she's bitting him [she is definitely neutered, I've checked]. When that happens, and it's a definite trigger, she shows her displeasure by running off into a corner, then later, inevitably does something that would be considered out of proportion. Today she emptied out their lit tray onto a quite substantial area of the livingroom carpet, which I should imagine required some amount of effort on her part. I have to say though that since I first posted this she's actually got better [despite the lit thing this morning]. I've reached the conclusion that she's not going to settle down just because it would be convenient, and she'll do it when she trusts me...

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Has she been a house bunny before? If she is used to being outside then she might feel uncomfortable being indoors and it could tske a while for her to get used to it. The other thing I would say is dried corn is not very good for bunnies, even though the shops sell is as treats. I hope things start to improve for you - don't you feed pellets at all?

No, she definitely was a house bunny. I've massively remodeled their enclosure to make it the fit the length of the room. There only realy shut up when I'm not there co's the new rabbit, Twinkle can be very destructive, and littraly gets into everything. This morning they seem a lot happier, but Ghibli has massive problem with the sound that Puppy pens make, and even the word puppy makes him stamp his feet. I'm fairly certain that puppies may well have played a part in him being rehomed, but given that I don't have any more money he's going to have to live with that! Vet time soon, which means lots of money, and no way I'm buying anything else for them...

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Ive got a couple of bunnies that like to "remodel" my house. Some they do if a dont give them a cardboard box to dig and chew. When they get on the sofa they do dig and chew but i think its to make it comfy. They even do it in the dogs bed. I i block of the entrance to the back of the chair instead of putting their tunnel behind it for them to run through they then chew the wallpaper off my chimney which is at the side of the chair. You have to try to figure out what each behaviour is about. They are funny little furries lol..

I've given them more room, and she's stopped being so destructive, unless you count cardboard boxes. I think she just felt penned in!

There is however another problem that I'd like some advice on!

When I give Ghibli affection she seems to get annoyed. They haven't been bonded for that long, and he comes up to me [like he's always done] especially in the morning to get a little nose stroke, or just to say hello, and every time he does, litterally the moment after Twinkle will do something like pee on the cushion in middle of the room where I sit to watch TV! She a lot better, in that it used to be destroying a couch, but I don't know what to do about this? Should I just be leaving them to their own devices? I want Ghibli to have a friend, and I like Twinkle! She's a lively happy rabbit and she's been really good for him, but Ghibli's been my friend for three years. I don't want to just abandon him, and I certainly don't want to turn him away when he's comming to me, but it definitely seems to annoy her. What should I do? Bonding rabbits is a bit of a mystery to me, and they didn't really tell me what I was supposed to do after I got them home?

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I took them to the vets together yesterday, in a single rabbit carrier, and Twinkle seems a lot more happy with things than she was. I think maybe it's just a question of pacient careful planing and nurturing until they find their own way...

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Can you give them both head rubs/affection at the same time? Maybe she is feeling left out.

I actually started doing exactly that, and I think your right. I have definitely mistaken her energy for confidence, but these are things you learn about an animal in the same way you learn that your friend isn't as confident as he or she makes out. I started enticing them both over with treats, then tried to give them both affection at the same time, but it didn't really work out. I'm not sure if she feels pressure because Ghibli has an existing relationship with me or not, but she definitely prefers to pick the time and place for affection, and it's invariably when he's off exploring something, or chasing one of his favourite toys. I'm a lot more hopeful that we can build a good relationship, but I think she's always going to see Ghibli as my rabbit, or me as his person. I do love Ghibli very much, but at this point I'd move heaven and earth to make sure she was happy [well, I've pretty much already let her eat my couch ], and I think she now understands that this is her permanent home. The pour thinng's been rehomed more than once, and that just shouldn't ever happen, but when I first got her I kind of understood why. Luckily I prefer rabbits to couches anyway

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It sounds like Twinkle wants to be top bunny, maybe she is the dominant one? in which case the dominant rabbit should always come first. Maybe for a while you can treat her as such, I am sure your other bun won't mind, as he's already got 3 years relationship with you under his belt. Perhaps she's always been an "only" bunny so isn't used to the attention going on another bunny?

I keep trying to give her attention, but she invariably runs away. I've even done the laying on my stomach thing, but she just takes the treats and runs away, though she did climb on my back once. She hasn't done since though [I've tried it with her a couple of times]. Ghibli would never climb on anyone's back he's way too independent! I've tried to get him to climb on me for three years, but I'll keep trying! She does let me get close to her, but only when she wants it. She even lets me stroke her when she's laying sprawled out, but like I said it's always on her terms, and if she doesn't want attention she lets you know!

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You might be right about her being dominant though, time will tell. In my experience animal alway find there own balance regardless of what people do

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The more I try to treat Twinkle as the top bunny, the more forceful Ghibli resists, and the more forcefully Twinkle respondes.

I think your absolutely right about Twinkle wanting to be top bunny, but unfortunately I think Ghibli also sees everything as his, including me!

He definitely loves Twinkle! [or at least he's fond of her] as he always snuggles up to her when I shut them in for the night. By the morning however he's sitting on the cushion I sit on to watch TV and play with the rabbit's [traditionally to play with him].

The problem's compounded by Twinkle bitting Ghibli all the time, which he definitely doesn't like as he runs away, but she ends up chasing him arround the room until he hides, but he still comes back to her.

The problem is that when I do try to give Twinkle attention and affection she just runs away, but she's always comming up to me and bumping me on the leg.

The minute Ghibli comes for affection, however, she either heads him off and puts herself between me and him, or just get's destructive and starts chewing their hutch.

What do I do? Do I have to stop being affectionate with Ghibli? I've had him for three year, and he's really important to me, but I need to find a solution to this that involves both rabbits getting what they need, and Ghibli still being my friend.

Please help?

Barry

Of course this is on a really bad day! Some days they seem to get along fine!



That's Twinkle BTW



And that's what there like now
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