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Sudden respiratory sounds advice please

prettylupin

Wise Old Thumper
Hi chaps,

Poppy has got something wrong with her breathing tonight. :cry:

She's an otherwise healthy 2 1/2yr old spayed doe, bonded, with no history of RTI's, sneezing, discharge or any other problems apart from the odd acute bout of stasis (there has always been a reason). She has been fine all day, no audible respiratory sounds until this evening. We only pick her up once a day as she's a very nervous rescue so usual time my OH this evening did the usual 5 laps of the garden whilst she decides to hop in her box where she lets us pick her up, he brushed her for 5 mins - nothing. Picked her up to turn her round in his lap and she started making respiratory sounds. They sound like they are in the upper respiratory passages - thinking a foreign body here with the acute onset and no other symptoms - squeaky, snorty and just audible breathing sounds. This was an hour ago. At the outset she only made the noises whilst we where holding her as she is clearly breathing faster due to mild stress. Put her down - she's grazing the lawn, hopping around - no audible sounds.
Back in the hutch - sounds fine. Gave them their greens and came back and having eaten them she is lying down audibly breathing now at rest - no contact from us :( i could hear it when I walked in the room. I've given her some metacam to make her feel more comfortable and in case there is any inflammation in the URT, she squeaked a bit through her nose when I offered her the syringe - she takes it voluntarily. She's now at rest again but still snuffly, snorty and still has audible breathing sounds. :cry:
She is not flaring her nostrils and she is not mouth breathing at this time - but she is having problems with some sort of obstructive breathing.

Emergency vet as we all know may not be rabbit savvy and can do nothing more than pain relief (which i've done) and fluids - which she doesn't need as eating normally, or O2 or nebuliser but she doesn't need these yet of course. But we are worried. I guess all we can do is vet first thing tomorrow morning. Hoping one of the more bunny savvy vets on duty. I'm guessing if it is a FB first thing will be a nasolacrimal flush just in case in outer nasal passage? Any ideas if this is more appropriate under a light GA or is a conscious nasolacrimal flush ok? No experience of this - can imagine it will be uncomfortable - perhaps they use a local first? Not sure what else they can do if a FB? Any ideas or experiences greatly received. Very worried about her. It is so acute and sudden I just can't believe it can be snuffles with no other symptoms and such a sudden onset? :?
 
Oooh you sound very knowledgeable anyway, that is a bit worrying but, I think you are probably right not to panic and keep her warm and under observation, I keep seeing lots about 'rabbit savvy' vets - surely if they are qualified it's only like life itself they need to see the illnesses/animals to build their experience, hopefully if they are qualified vets and not sure they would contact a more experienced colleague by phone or email. I have every confidence in my vets that they want to do the best for any animal they see whether they are young or newly qualified, even if you end up teaching them the benefit of your experience thats a good thing for the next person who might be like me and not so confident so have to use the vet. Sincerely hope it's not serious and keeping my fingers crossed for you. x
 
Nope genitals fine and Nino too.

Her ears feel normally warm, she seems normal, except that whatever it is it is distressing her, she's more nervous than usual, and the sound has definitely got worse - especially when we picked her up - she was really noisy. I'm starting to wonder whether or not she has got something, hay perhaps or oat hay seed, stuck up the back of her throat into her nasal passage that way. We're pretty certain it has only just happened in the last hour or two. Still no discharge. She's also doing this wierd head-cocking movement from time to time as if she's trying to dislodge whatever is bothering her. :?
I'm hoping that if it is something stuck it will soften and dislodge itself suddenly but that feels like wishful thinking. I just can't believe she has such a sudden onset respiratory infection out of the blue with no warning symptoms and being fine all day. :?

OH has just reported that she's doing a 'whistling sound' now :? Still no discharge.
 
gosh i've nothing constructive to say, just sending tons of vibes for her, i hope you get to the bottom of it soon xx
 
Thanks everyone :) Really appreciate your support. Jane I know you have a whole host of sick buns at the moment so i'm very grateful for your time.

She is lying quietly at the moment with Nino and her breathing has quietened a little so I think we'll give her a break from the stress of us and just keep an eye on her. If it gets bad again we will do just that thank you Jane :) I was trying in my head to work out if she needed it warm and humid or cool and dry to help her breathing. Medical training would tell me warm and humid for an upper RTI, but dry for a lower obstructive respiratory problem. :?
Rabbits.....I was feeling so proud and relieved the other day that both my buns were happy and well.....never lasts long does it :cry:
 
Hi, I can only say that something which sounds similar happened to us.

There was very sudden onset of a high pitched upper respiratory wheeze while Thumps was in the garden, & head jerking to the left at about 3 min intervals. It's the only time he's eaten hay like a madbun!!
When we got to the vet he'd sorted himself out. The vet thought something may have scratched his throat. About 3 days later he passed a string of 11 poops on a 3" strand of garden twine I don't use! (Thought a bird had dropped it)
Does it fit? Retrospectively we thought the wheeze was caused by the string in the oesophagus. So I can only suggest plenty of hay.
 
Hi, I can only say that something which sounds similar happened to us.

There was very sudden onset of a high pitched upper respiratory wheeze while Thumps was in the garden, & head jerking to the left at about 3 min intervals. It's the only time he's eaten hay like a madbun!!
When we got to the vet he'd sorted himself out. The vet thought something may have scratched his throat. About 3 days later he passed a string of 11 poops on a 3" strand of garden twine I don't use! (Thought a bird had dropped it)
Does it fit? Retrospectively we thought the wheeze was caused by the string in the oesophagus. So I can only suggest plenty of hay.

Thank you Judy - I was waiting for you to come online :) I feel so lucky to have had some objective opinions from everyone tonight - it is hard to think straight when it is your own bun.
Thumps's episode does sound similar doesn't it - I really hope this is the case.

She is still eating yes - well she wolfed down her greens and OH has seen her in the tray munching a bit. I might go and fetch the Oat hay and some more leafy greens for her now (although am paranoid it is one of those scratchy oat hay seeds that has done this :?) or it could have been something she ate in the garden before she was picked up for her brush - lots of fallen leaves we are trying to keep on top of. I know I could be completely wrong - but if she'd sniffed something up her nose I too would expect sneezing and discharge as Jane has said. I'm certain it's something that has gone up backwards from her throat - the head cocking and lack of nasal discharge makes me think this over anything else. It seems quieter again now, still interested in food, just more nervous - as she always gets when poorly and no doubt fed up with us checking on her every 5 mins! :roll::oops:

I've just put a boiling kettle into a large ceramic bowl beside the hutch (on the other side) with some drops of olbas oil in - my god it's strong - I took a whiff and nearly passed out! :lol: Hoping that will help. Nino is most confused and spent ages with his nose against the wire smelling the steam - wrong bunny!!!:roll: She is fortunately sat beside the wire and is hopefully breathing some of it in. I hate this anxiety - I wish I knew what was wrong and what more i can do? Any suggestions? Do you agree she can wait til the morning to see the vet?

ETA sorry for the rambling folks! Worried bunny mum :oops:
 
With Thumper the head jerking was when he tried to swallow his saliva, but he was managing hay OK.
I don't know about seeing a non rabbit vet, & in honesty don't know the "full differential diagnosis" here. Perhaps see what a more experienced member thinks, or just phone up to discuss the case with a vet/vet nurse. I'd definitely see a vet tomorrow to examine the throat & upper airways. If there's a scratch she'll need AB's.
Everything crossed for Poppy.
ETA please forgive me - I'm mainly concerned for others who know 1ST. aid. We can't o a Heimlich maneuver on buns to get a foreign body out of the oesophagus cos they can't burp.
 
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Just been watching her closely - she tucking into apple leaves and oat hay, slower than usual but interested in food. The head jerking is pretty definitely when she swallows as far as I can tell - i'm sure it is when swallowing only :?
 
we had this too once - when Thistle - little nethie got a piece of hay lodged sideways inside her mouth. She did exactly the same head jerking movements and a bit of wheeze - tough not as much as this sounds.

Can you check inside her mouth? If not perhaps even a non-rabbit savvy emergency vet could?

Trouble is if it is something on back of mouth she might accidentally get it down the wrong way or cross jammed.
 
Hi. I'm sorry to hear Poppy is poorly.
It does sound likely that she has aspirated something when she was turned over. My concern would be that a foreign body could lead to a secondary pneumonia.
I think I would want to get her seen by a vet sooner rather that later.
I hope she's ok xx
 
Thanks Parsnipbun and Lilbun,
It's tricky, she's eating loads - a huge handful of apple leaves and lots of hay, no probs. I'm pretty sure if it was something stuck across the back of her throat it will have shifted with all of that? The head cocking during swallowing seems to have stopped.

I have spoken to the emergency vets just now. They agree with me that she is probably best left to rest at this point in time rather than the stress of a car ride for 30 mins - the emergency vets are outsourced and are in Portsmouth. They weren't sure if there was much more they could do than I've done already other than look in her mouth. If it is up in her nasopharynx/oropharynx i'm not sure if they could do anything without a GA? I don't think they would do that tonight. They said all they would do is admit her and give her abx and listen to her chest. Problem is that admitted she would be SO stressed - her breathing is much calmer when she is resting quietly in her hutch in familiar surroundings. Interestingly, when she sits upright the breathing sound stops - but it comes back when she lies down. What does that tell you?
We are monitoring her for now, any deterioration we will go to the emergency vets... they are happy to see her anytime tonight if needed. They were very good last time when she had her bloat/stasis.

I am worried - we are in two minds as what to do? If there's nothing to see in her mouth they can't look up her nose tonight so it would be stress for nothing. She's eating loads so I can't see it being in her mouth. Arrghh... I don't know what the best thing to do is....I do worry about an aspiration pneumonia :?

ETA sorry she wasn't turned over, just to clarify, just turned around in his lap - wierd :?
 
Not sure what else to suggest really. Would you be able to keep an eye on her in shifts throughout tonight so you don't miss any deterioration? without stressing her unduly of course xx
 
Not sure what else to suggest really. Would you be able to keep an eye on her in shifts throughout tonight so you don't miss any deterioration? without stressing her unduly of course xx

Yes that's the plan. Thanks :)

She seems a lot better. Just sat beside her and couldn't hear anything. :? It seems more on and off now. Thanks lilbun x
 
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