Growths under skin and fur pulling/ Good news

I am getting increasingly concerned about Eddie I have spoken to the vet but they just don't seem interested.

A few months back he developed a small growth under his skin. it wasn't one big lump but felt more like a bunch of grapes. The vet felt it was something very suspicious but due to his other health problems wouldn't remove it. This has now spread very rapidly. It hasn't grown in one place but is spreading all over his body He has little lumps everywhere under his skin, some are the size of small peas others smaller.

Does anyone know what this could be?

The other problem he has is, in recent weeks he has started pulling his own fur out and now has a considerable sized bald patch I have treated him for mites and he is regularly treated for fleas as he is not vaccinated. This fur pulling started just after we lost Erin so it could be a reaction to that, both him and Elly have not been the same since she went.
I was also wondering if it could be related to his medication :? The idea always was to try to reduce down the amount of medication he was on as he was responding so well, unfortunately he stopped some of his meds the same day Erin died. I asked the vet if we could keep him on them for a couple more weeks because of this but she refused to suppy me with any more meds so I had no choice but to stop them. Could the fur pulling be a reaction to reducing his antibiotics?
Thirdly I was wondering if it could be related to the growths under his skin :? Maybe they are irritating him or sore?

Eddie seems perfectly well in himself and is eating well. He is not as lively as before, neither is Elly but I put that down to loosing Erin However he can certainly run around quick enough if he wants to, either away from me at med time, or towards me at feeding time :lol:

Any thoughts would really be appreciated

Maybe you could ask the vet whether they would consider doing a fine needle aspirate to find out what type of cells the lumps are comprised of. Whilst it does not also give diagnosic results (the cells found are not always representative of the whole lesion), it is not too invasive.
If the lump prove to contain pus, bacterial culture may be useful as well xx

Sorry Liz i have no idea but i am going to mention it to C tomorrow when i go to the vets with Lionel, i really hope the lovely Eddie is ok please give him a cuddle from me xx

Katie-arc said:

Sorry Liz i have no idea but i am going to mention it to C tomorrow when i go to the vets with Lionel, i really hope the lovely Eddie is ok please give him a cuddle from me xx

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Thank you so much Katie I would really appreciate that.

When the vet last saw it it was still one "bunch of grapes", but it has since spread over his body. It is under the skin, not attached to the underneath of his skin but when you move the skin you can feel they are actually attached to his body. There are far to many to count and some are pin ****** in size so there would be no way to remove them :?

I have never felt anything similar in the past.

Hope that explains it a little better :?

Thank you Lilbun i will ask the vet about that procedure :wave:

I have absolutely no idea what this could be Liz, sorry but sending healing <<vibes>> to Eddie. Hope you find out what's causing it.

Thinking about it a bit more it seems unlikely that they would be pus filled as he has been on so many antibiotics.

I'm wondering if they are just related to the literally hundreds of injection's he has had for nearly the past year. Because lumps were forming I had to keep moving where I put the needle in, so maybe thats why it has appeared to spread :? But then when the vet saw it she didn;t think it was related to the injections :?

Hugo's There said:

Thinking about it a bit more it seems unlikely that they would be pus filled as he has been on so many antibiotics.

I'm wondering if they are just related to the literally hundreds of injection's he has had for nearly the past year. Because lumps were forming I had to keep moving where I put the needle in, so maybe thats why it has appeared to spread :? But then when the vet saw it she didn;t think it was related to the injections :?

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What meds is he on Liz as i think i would be benifical to mention those? x

Katie-arc said:

What meds is he on Liz as i think i would be benifical to mention those? x

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He's on metacam and septrin plus a couple of herbal meds, echinacea and ginseng prescribed by the vet. Up until 2 weeks ago he was also on metronidazole orally and ceprorex injections

A local reaction to the injections is possible. Are all of the lumps where he has had injections in the past?
Just in case my last post was confusing, an F.N.A. isn't just for finding pus but for identify what type of cells are in a lesion, be they normal or abnormal

I wonder if they are some sort of keloid scarring? As in dense fibrous tissue from as you say needle sites? Or small pockets of granulation tissue? :?
The only other thing that springs to mind is a parasite of some kind?
I hope someone's vet comes up with something! Must be a worry and will be peace of mind atleast to find out a potential explanation. Poor bun

p.s. I agree with lilbun re. a needle biopsy. Might be helpful if they can get a good enough sample?

Would Keloid scarring grow? I swear they are getting bigger since the injections stopped, but maybe I am feeling them too much :? But is does sound like a possibility.

Don't worry I realise the FNA wasn't just for pus, I was just thinking out loud that it would be a miracle if it was pus the amount of antibiotics the poor boy was on :wave:

Hugo's There said:

Would Keloid scarring grow?

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Not excessively that i'm aware of no. But i'm not certain on that front sorry.
I do wonder if the fur pulling is associated through pain or irritation/itchiness? I hope you can get some answers soon. Perhaps at an outside chance an antihistamine would stop him pulling his fur alongside the pain relief? Really just guessing now, sorry. Hope he feels better soon. :wave:

Eddie is now booked in to have his bottom incisors burred tomorrow. He has been getting his fur caught round his teeth so they have been pulled out of line and are growing too long. I think he will only see a nurse but I will ask about the other problems, if they don't have any answers or he can't see a vet I will get him booked in next week. Just trying to decide who he would be best seeing :?

Hugo's There said:

Just trying to decide who he would be best seeing :?

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Someone who is good, likes rabbits, and is openminded! Poor Eddie, he sounds like he's going through the mill a bit at the moment Hoping he feels better soon. I doubt it is keloid scarring - but I remember my keloid scar on my neck post mole removal and it did get bigger and was red and angry and incredibly itchy! Hoping it is nothing more sinister. Good luck with his burring

Oh no Liz, so sorry to hear that Eddie's lumps and bumps are getting worse

I don't have any bright ideas I'm afraid other than to see if your vet would be prepared to fax Bristol rabbit clinic to see if they have any suggestions on what it might be and what to do next. We have just done this for Santa and they were incredibly helpful. It took a while for them to get back to us but they read through all her case notes and rang up my vet to have a detailed chat about it. It's a free service to vets - your vet has to fax in the first instance, and then they reply when they are able. In essence it gives you an opportunity to tap into some real bunny expertise (it was Richard Saunders who dealt with Santa's notes) without the stress of having to travel a long way to a referral. Of course there's only so much they can do from notes, but I don't think there's anything to lose by giving it a go if you can get your vet to agree.

The fax number is 0117 928 9593 - make sure they put on it that it's a query for the rabbit clinic, to make sure it doesn't just get given to any of the vets who don't specialise in rabbits. http://www.langfordvets.co.uk/rabbit_disease.htm

All the best, I really hope the little lad is ok xx

Thanks Alison :wave:

I just don't know which vet would be the best to see. The one who took a real interest in Eddie before I have had an arguement with on the phone about him. She refused to give me any more antibiotics for him on the day Erin died and I thought it was the wrong time to stop and wanted to continue for another couple of weeks. I had that arguement at the same time she gave me Erin's pm results so didn't really appreciate it :roll:

The other better vet is often reluctant to do much more than the basics but she has contacted FHB for me a few times before so I think it might be worth giving her a try:?

I will see what happens tomorrow and take it from there

Just to add, Ed seems Ok in himself, especially in the evenings when he gets to snuggle with Timmy, his new best friend ( poor Elwood )

Good news, Eddie has had a very thorough check up today and overall the vet was really pleased in his condition considering we have stopped most of his meds

She thinks the fur pulling was stress related It has definately reduced since Ed started spending time with Timmy in the evening. She also thinks the lumps are more than likely related to the injections and that because he has become so bald I can feel them a lot more easily now which is why they feel bigger or there seems to be more of them.

But she has had a good feel so that next time she sees him she can feel if there has been any change and then we can take things further if we need to.

His incisors are now completely out of line due to getting fur caught round them so he will probably need to go back about once a month for a burr and then he can have a good check up on a regular basis too. His molars were checked and they were fine

It is so lovely to have some good news for a change, Eddie is just so

Hugo's There said:

Good news, Eddie has had a very thorough check up today and overall the vet was really pleased in his condition considering we have stopped most of his meds

She thinks the fur pulling was stress related It has definately reduced since Ed started spending time with Timmy in the evening. She also thinks the lumps are more than likely related to the injections and that because he has become so bald I can feel them a lot more easily now which is why they feel bigger or there seems to be more of them.

But she has had a good feel so that next time she sees him she can feel if there has been any change and then we can take things further if we need to.

His incisors are now completely out of line due to getting fur caught round them so he will probably need to go back about once a month for a burr and then he can have a good check up on a regular basis too. His molars were checked and they were fine

It is so lovely to have some good news for a change, Eddie is just so

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That's great news! Scarring around injection sites would definitely be the best outcome. Hooray for Eddie and his new buddy Timmy!!

By the way, I wonder if your vet can, provided no other underlying condition causing Eddie's bite to be altered or underlying malocclusion, burr his incisors with a bevel edge to a point that they will be able to wear themselves? It might take a couple of goes. I only say this as this is what our vet managed to do with Nino's incisors a couple of years ago and they've not needed doing since, before this he was having them burred every 4 wks and even at the RSPCA before we got him. It took Mackie a couple of goes but each time he worked out where they were wearing and managed to get the burr just right and the bite corrected itself - very unusual and very lucky, but figured it would be worth a go for Eddie. (Nino has a twisted jaw probably from an early fall as a baby.....it may have only been possible to correct his bite due to his fairly young age when we accquired him so that his jaw could grow and muscles reallign themselves - but just thought i'd mention it in case it was helpful)

I'm glad it sounds like positive news for Eddie