EC kidneys effected has anyone found herbs that help?

[Erin96]

Hey there. This year so far has not been great for my 4 year old mini lop. Usually he is mischievous and very friendly but he started to go off his food and look lethargic. GI stasis was treated but no improvement and it turns out he has EC that has hit his kidneys. Of all the swotting up I ever did on rabbits and what illnesses they can get I never gave EC a second thought after he was routinely tested a couple of years ago and showed negative. Chances are he has picked it up off garden greens Now on Panacur and Semintra and paracetamol. I am hoping that although there has been some damage to his kidneys based on urine results that he wont have to be on Semintra long term ( the runny poops have started after only 2 days on it and as it is leaves the body without breaking down it means that rabbits will digest it again in their cecotropes) Wondering if anyone on the forums has used milk thistle non alcoholic tincture and other low calcium herbs and wildflowers that support kidney function, are anti inflammatory and mild analgesics with any success? Thinking of growing some medicinal herbs indoors for him. Obviously still using conventional meds and his Panacur course ends next week while he will be on Semintra for a month before having another urine sample to see if there has been any improvement. Just want to help my little buddy as best I can.

 

[Omi]

Hello and a warm welcome to the forum

I like to feed rabbits a diet which is rich in wild forage, although don't feed anything specific for support in any particular areas. I have read about the benefits of Milk Thistle for liver support. Also I have access to Willow and feed both leaves and twigs, both of which have mild analgesic properties (contains salycylic acid, which is Aspirin).

I think if I were you I would seek the help of a knowledgeable herbalist for rabbits. This is something you could do online and in my view might be more beneficial than being guided by the experiences of others.

 

[Erin96]

Hello and a warm welcome to the forum

I like to feed rabbits a diet which is rich in wild forage, although don't feed anything specific for support in any particular areas. I have read about the benefits of Milk Thistle for liver support. Also I have access to Willow and feed both leaves and twigs, both of which have mild analgesic properties (contains salycylic acid, which is Aspirin).

I think if I were you I would seek the help of a knowledgeable herbalist for rabbits. This is something you could do online and in my view might be more beneficial than being guided by the experiences of others.

Thank you. It is lovely to have found you all.
I will look into finding a pet herbalist and a vet who also has knowledge of herbalism. I have a lovely book called Foraging for Rabbits which lists some safe plants. When it comes to herbs for humans then I am OK but obviously with things like tinctures dosages would be a problem. Think I may go down the route of growing some plants and feeding in moderation perhaps. It is just waiting for growing season to start really. So sad that the garden here is now not a safe space as our vet thinks that likely picked up from where bun gets his fresh greens from. The joys of city living and finding out that cats and rodents can carry EC and have been in the garden. Even worrying about boxes of hay that may have carried it in. Poor rabbits. Prince with a thousand enemies and then some.

 

[Omi]

Thank you. It is lovely to have found you all.
I will look into finding a pet herbalist and a vet who also has knowledge of herbalism. I have a lovely book called Foraging for Rabbits which lists some safe plants. When it comes to herbs for humans then I am OK but obviously with things like tinctures dosages would be a problem. Think I may go down the route of growing some plants and feeding in moderation perhaps. It is just waiting for growing season to start really. So sad that the garden here is now not a safe space as our vet thinks that likely picked up from where bun gets his fresh greens from. The joys of city living and finding out that cats and rodents can carry EC and have been in the garden. Even worrying about boxes of hay that may have carried it in. Poor rabbits. Prince with a thousand enemies and then some.

Is that the Twig's Way book on foraging? It's very good. I use it here.

I'm a bit surprised that your vet considers it likely that the EC came via it being carried by another animal into your garden. Previously I had always read that it's considered that EC is something carried by about half the pet rabbit community, with the likely source from the rabbit's Mother. You've possibly read this article

Rabbits and E. cuniculi (Encephalitozoon cuniculi)

Understand the impact of E. cuniculi (Encephalitozoon cuniculi) on rabbits. Expert advice and resources to safeguard your bunny's health.

rabbitwelfare.co.uk

 

[joey&boo]

I had a bun with EC related kidney disease. He loved his forage ....I'd try & provide him with as large a variety as possible so he could eat what he felt useful or liked. I recall he was mad about sow thistle & geranium. My vet recommended dandelions (fresh) as although high in calcium its diuretic properties were deemed beneficial. Another month & it should start growing properly.

I hope your bun makes good improvement

 

[Erin96]

Is that the Twig's Way book on foraging? It's very good. I use it here.

I'm a bit surprised that your vet considers it likely that the EC came via it being carried by another animal into your garden. Previously I had always read that it's considered that EC is something carried by about half the pet rabbit community, with the likely source from the rabbit's Mother. You've possibly read this article

Rabbits and E. cuniculi (Encephalitozoon cuniculi)

Understand the impact of E. cuniculi (Encephalitozoon cuniculi) on rabbits. Expert advice and resources to safeguard your bunny's health.

rabbitwelfare.co.uk

Yes, it is that book. It is great isn't it. I have the gardening one as well. I was surprised by what the vet said but have since seen it mentioned as being caught from infected wild rabbits and rodents as well as from the rabbits mother. When I found out what he had I looked into it as much as possible ( between boil washing blankets daily, spraying Anigene everywhere and getting bf to Bissel the carpets every 2 weeks ( one more after day 28 bless him). It has stopped me from picking grasses, dandelions and all the other bunny friendly plants I have out there and we have heard the skitter of rodents in the past week or so. When I first rescued him he tested negative so either it was a false negative or he really has picked it up somehow. Yes, I have read and saved that article and saved lots of others too. It has made me really paranoid about finding bits of soil in hay boxes as well. Lack of sleep making me worry too.

 

[Erin96]

I had a bun with EC related kidney disease. He loved his forage ....I'd try & provide him with as large a variety as possible so he could eat what he felt useful or liked. I recall he was mad about sow thistle & geranium. My vet recommended dandelions (fresh) as although high in calcium its diuretic properties were deemed beneficial. Another month & it should start growing properly.

I hope your bun makes good improvement

Oh bless him and thank you. I hope it kept him as well as he could be. I will be ordering some more wildflower seeds and even some dandelion ones ( the fat leaved variety) from Chiltern Seeds and have also found a nursery called Celtic Wildflowers which I am browsing and cross referencing so I can grow a tasty variety of things for him. How well did your bun do with EC kidneys? I know there is at least one bun at Parsleys Warren who has had kidney damage from it a few years ago and is still getting by. I honestly only ever thought it effected balance until this all happened.

 

[Omi]

This is also a very good site for wildflower seed and plugs.

British Wildflowers | Seeds. Bulbs & Plants | Naturescape

Buy British Wildflowers online. We sell seeds, plants and bulbs with competitive prices & delivery across the UK. Browse our wildflower catalogue today

www.naturescape.co.uk

 

[Erin96]

This is also a very good site for wildflower seed and plugs.

British Wildflowers | Seeds. Bulbs & Plants | Naturescape

Buy British Wildflowers online. We sell seeds, plants and bulbs with competitive prices & delivery across the UK. Browse our wildflower catalogue today

www.naturescape.co.uk

Oooh now this is looking very interesting. Thank you for that I shall have a browse through the wildflowers.

 

[joey&boo]

Oh bless him and thank you. I hope it kept him as well as he could be. I will be ordering some more wildflower seeds and even some dandelion ones ( the fat leaved variety) from Chiltern Seeds and have also found a nursery called Celtic Wildflowers which I am browsing and cross referencing so I can grow a tasty variety of things for him. How well did your bun do with EC kidneys? I know there is at least one bun at Parsleys Warren who has had kidney damage from it a few years ago and is still getting by. I honestly only ever thought it effected balance until this all happened.

He was a private adoption (from here actually) & really quite poorly from the outset. Sadly I only had him for 17 months (I think), he was about 6 years when he was PTS. Don't let depress you though, his urea & creatine scores were really high....they didn't get worse for a good 12 months or so. He needed a lot of supportive care. I struggled to keep weight on him but he weirdly had the most shiny coat....on photos he didn't look that poorly at all. Rudey very much favoured fresh foods which was a good thing (clever boy), so loads of forage, fresh herbs, grass & about 6 syringe feeds a day

 

[Erin96]

He was a private adoption (from here actually) & really quite poorly from the outset. Sadly I only had him for 17 months (I think), he was about 6 years when he was PTS. Don't let depress you though, his urea & creatine scores were really high....they didn't get worse for a good 12 months or so. He needed a lot of supportive care. I struggled to keep weight on him but he weirdly had the most shiny coat....on photos he didn't look that poorly at all. Rudey very much favoured fresh foods which was a good thing (clever boy), so loads of forage, fresh herbs, grass & about 6 syringe feeds a day

My wee bun has lost weight and his creatine score was really high as well and I worry his full results are showing kidney inflammation and failure due to the infection. He goes from being really perky and chasing me about some days to subdued on others. I can tell when he is in pain. I expected him to grow old as mini lops are long lived little rabbits and now I feel like I have let him down by not being vigilant enough. Before starting Panacur he was off his food and having to be hand fed but he is eating normally atm. He is my little buddy so I will do whatever I can to keep him strong and comfortable.

 

[joey&boo]

My wee bun has lost weight and his creatine score was really high as well and I worry his full results are showing kidney inflammation and failure due to the infection. He goes from being really perky and chasing me about some days to subdued on others. I can tell when he is in pain. I expected him to grow old as mini lops are long lived little rabbits and now I feel like I have let him down by not being vigilant enough. Before starting Panacur he was off his food and having to be hand fed but he is eating normally atm. He is my little buddy so I will do whatever I can to keep him strong and comfortable.

You've not let him down, your love & care for him really shines through. Its not fair that some buns don't get to live long lives but he has what he needs in you as his loyal caretaker

 

[Erin96]

You've not let him down, your love & care for him really shines through. Its not fair that some buns don't get to live long lives but he has what he needs in you as his loyal caretaker

That means a lot. You are right that it isn't fair when it comes to his longevity. My heart goes out to anyone else who has gone through or is going through this. I am still glad that I found him. He brightens the world up for me and I hope he likes me too lol. He bunny flops next to me so I will take it that he does. My furry little bestie.

 

[Erin96]

Little update on Mr B. He has been on Semintra for almost a month and is losing weight. 30 grams less than when EC was first diagnosed and the muscle loss is apparent. He has been doing OK until this week . Eating and drinking and being his all round adorable self but in the last few days he has started to lose interest in his food and his water and his treats. He feels so thin but the vet thinks that he is doing OK. Bloods next week and another urine test but I fear the worse for him and it is unbearable. Hoping for a miracle but surely he should be gaining weight on the kidney meds as it is meant to halt the muscle wastage caused by the protein loss. Today he was prescribed Gabapentin( is this kidney safe?) and although he is not drinking much at all it wasn't deemed essential to keep him in and on fluids as his skin is still has elasticity. Nothing seems to be enough to keep him stable and it is honestly breaking my heart. If anyone can advise on the effectiveness of Gabapentin for kidney disease it would be appreciated and as the garden here is out or bounds the best shop bought herbs and greens to feed in large amounts that arent going to stress his kidneys even more. I have wildflowers and other beneficial plants potted up but they wont be ready for a month at least and have even bought Timothy and oat grass seeds. Just want him to be around to enjoy them