Bunny had Ulcer after dental U/D post 35 - pseudomonas aeruginosa

[FireRose]

When Boo went blind she was with her long term partner Joey & he was pretty chill...though not always nice as he'd steal food from her.Later when Joey left we bonded her to a much younger & livelier Eddy.

Things I changed: Put the mattress on the floor as she;d always joined us on the bed. When she first went blind she'd jump from memory, overshot the mattress & I fear hurt her wrists. She seemed fine at the time but had bad arthritis there later. I kept her spaces really tidy (for a rabbit area) so she could run without running into enrichment stuff. She bimbled rather than ran. She would have never passed as a seeing bun but she did fine..

I also mentally sectioned the room to let her be guided by scent...so litter tray in the usual corner, dirty washing hamper in another & lavender at the foot of the bed. Something like that. I couldn't risk feeding tangly or thorny forage, put woolly socks on bed legs etc. Initially we used big dog beds as litter trays but went to just puppy pads on lino ...but that was more down to arthritis

Hoping for a good outcome for her. Remember scent is a biggy for rabbits, they generally manage sight loss ok. My poor Boo was deaf too so I was permanently vigilant for respiratory health, there were no issues but to lose that sense too would have been too much

See that’s one thing I miss so much is her coming for morning snuggles on the bed before breakfast.

I don’t know if we’d be able to get rid of the bed sadly, she does love a cuddle under it with Ozzie though. I am thankful I think she knows her limits as she hasn’t tried to jump our bed / their hideaways since she’s had this eye problem.

I also think if we lowered the bed we’d have far bigger issues with the bedding ring chewed by our little madam too.

We are a one bedroom flat, so don’t have a lot of furniture thankfully and most is up against walls. Her biggest thing atm is the storage heaters (not much I can do about those) and corners on walls.

I’ve thought about removing the baby gate from the doorway to bedroom for her, but she hasn’t had accidents with it yet.

Their space does stay the same though. I’ve put an extra water bottle down’s up against a chair but next to their hay box, just so it’s all within vicinity. I’ve taken balls/willow sticks out to the sides so Ozzie can still chew/play but she’s not rolling her ankle so to speak on them.

That is a brilliant idea for socks on legs, I don’t know whether Willow would chew those, but we have a few tables that they normally lie under so perhaps that would be a good idea to soften those up for her so thank you I’ll mention it to my partner and see what they say.

The bed could do the same with too.

We have the pet remedy down the hallway, with a night light so I am hoping that makes a difference for her smell wise.

I know this sounds SO stupid but I’ll ask anyway,

I’ve been leaving the bedroom lamp on just to give her a bit more “light” cause obviously we are not sure how affected she is, the vets say it’s mostly her peripheral that’s gone atm.
Would that make a difference? Can I turn the lamp of or is it easier for her to have the extra light and I need to get a sleep mask?

The hallway has a night light that goes on when movement is nearby, and then living room since she’s had arthritis we’ve been leaving a low lamp on for her anyway.

 

[FireRose]

Sending vibes for Willow to heal quickly. I'm glad you at least have a starting point for treatment, and hopefully she can keep both her eyes. I don't know how easy it is for rabbits to get those, so please take this with a grain of salt, but I'm wondering if it's an environmental factor that gave her the infection...it seems very strange to me that she got sick so quickly after her procedure. I'm NOT saying it's the vet's fault, not at all, I don't know your vet, don't know how they operate so please don't hear me say that! But maybe there's a clue in what happened that day and the days after that as to why she got the infection and ulcers.

I've heard of lots of animals that get on just fine being blind. Even birds. I'm not very sure about rabbits, but animals are crazy good at adapting to losing their sense of hearing or sight. I think j&b has a lot of good advice there.

Please don’t worry it’s crossed our minds anyway.

Apparently when bunnies have dentals they obviously have a mask/air and we’ve been told since a small amount of air can escape and cause the ulcers…..

Okay I get that, but this has now gone from ulcers to whatever this is now happening with her eyes.

I still say this is an allergic reaction to the chloramphenical drops, because her eyes went so red with it. I’ll attach photos.

We stopped for a while because I just couldn’t bare to see her squinting so much with them, and she got better(ish) vet wouldn’t have it and told us to keep giving them.

So on the 11th she was fine (I’ve photos) we had another appointment that weekend as was told to keep up the drops, now we are where we are.

I thought it could be an environment factor in our home, but nothings changed, nothing new has come in (not even new laundry powder cause I’m sensitive) plus our other bunny is fine.

We are currently raising concerns with the vet and it is currently under talks as to what has gone so wrong here.

So this is the 13th (please ignore my partners medication paraphernalia and Willow’s lol)

So this was after I’d given the “wetness” a clean up, she’s on Remend at this point, and although squinting still has ulcer but redness is reducing, and no white spots AT ALL!

(This was when I was like enough enough with the chloramphenical drops)

Then the later pictures are when the eye started going so it went from a small white blob to full on covered in like 12ish hours (crazy)

We really aren’t sure what’s happened. The white is clearing on her right eye, sadly the left still not so much.

We are back at the vets Friday.

I feel so sorry for Ozzie, he’s normally such a livewire, but he’s lost his earring friend (they both normally race for breakfast etc)

He’s younger than her, but she still keeps him on his toes and he just looks lost. Obviously giving him extra fusses but we aren’t Willow.

 

[FireRose]

It is good to read she saw the specialist. I am pleased to read/see that Willow's right eye is doing much better. The white in the center is healing and getting smaller. I would not try to remove the goop. I hope her left eye will soon be responding to treatment.
Sending you and Willow lots of positive vibes.

Thank you so much Bunny Momma, especially replying to my first pretty much non coherent rant, this came on SO quick (the white infection)

I just didn’t know where to turn at the time.

She’s doing okay, the left eye gloop has started to gather in the middle it seems, the right is deffo coming away more easily (we aren’t touching it but vets and willow is when cleaning)

I’m just cleaning around the eye to help ease the wetness, I dunno if her tear ducts are inflamed or if it’s the drops, but I think they may need flushing once she’s better if they don’t dry up. It’s hard to tell where the wetness is coming from right now.

I can’t imagine having so many drops a day her face would be dry, but it’s hard to gauge atm what’s “normal” for what’s wrong and what’s another issue rearing its head.

Still flopping though bless her (please ignore poo’s her toilet habits have gone haywire lol)

 

[bunny momma]

Your initial post was fine. You love Willow and did not know why this happened and you needed advice and support. Having a sick bunny can be very stressful.

When my bunnies got GA's, the vet often put an ointment in their eyes before the procedure. I think it protects eyes.

It sounds promising that her left eye is starting to shed some of the damaged cells. Sending vibes the swelling reduces soon.

 

[Zoobec]

I don’t have any experience of any of this so I can‘t advise, but you are doing everything you can for Willow. Sending lots of vibes for her, and hugs for you xx

 

[Cinnabun14]

It sounds like you're really diligent about your buns, maybe it isn't an environmental factor after all (at least not in your house). I don't know very much about rabbit health, I was just throwing some possible things out there. Hopefully, the vet will have more answers. Sorry if I came across a bit accusatory or meddlesome, I was just trying to see if there was anything that happened on that day to cause this

I'm glad Willow's eyes are getting better, however slowly it is. The fact that it's starting to show some improvement is really great, and I hope it continues to do so for her!

Ah, poor Ozzie. It hard to watch a friend go through sickness, no matter what species you are.

Sending more vibes for Willow and Ozzie. And for you too, I can't imagine this is easy.

 

[InspectorMorse]

I have not read all the details in this thread, poor health makes it impossible for me to follow long threads. But if the initial problem came on immediately after the dental ask the vet what eye lubricant was used during the procedure. Some Rabbits can have a severe reaction to the preservative in some brands of lubricant, especially lacrilube. Then inflammation caused by an allergic reaction can become infected.
Chloramphenicol drops/ointment can sting ALOT but my gut feeling is the primary allergen was more likely to be the eye lubricant used during the GA.

Also, there was this issue in Canada last year

Refresh Lacri-Lube eye ointment recalled due to possible risk of infection - Canada.ca

AbbVie Corporation of Canada is recalling all lots of Refresh Lacri-Lube eye ointment because some tubes may leak, which could lead to contamination with bacteria and other microbes and the risk of infection. Seniors and those with a weakened immune system may be at a higher risk. Refresh...

recalls-rappels.canada.ca

I can’t find any details of a similar problem in the UK, but there was back in about 2015

I don’t know if your Rabbit is now under the care of a Veterinary Opthalmologist, but if not I would strongly recommend requesting a referral. If the eye problem occurred as a result of an ‘adverse event’ during the Dental then I would expect the cost of treating the consequences should be met by the surgery where the procedure took place.

I hope your Rabbit will make a full recovery.

 

[FireRose]

Hello all,

I am so glad to have this forum to come to and read other people’s results, It’s not as busy as it once was but still being around other bunny owners is always nice.

She’s still doing okay - still no vision I don’t think or if it is, it’s very very limited.

Her right eye is deffo healing quicker/better than the left as this is still bulging a fair bit and still has lots of white “mucus” or whatever it is on her eye though it does seem to have puckered in the middle now so fingers crossed .

We have managed to drop the gut stimulant and recovery food the last few days, so this seem positive in that despite how much pain she must be in, food is still an interest and at least is one less thing for me to be worrying about.

I am sure Willow is sick of me harassing her every few hours now lol.

This was her right eye and left eye yesterday, as you can see it’s coming away nicely on the right and you can see her eye now as opposed to it being a thick white cover.

Obviously we still don’t know the long term damage.

I got one of those “bumper” beds for her, because she is starting to squeeze in between places, I am guessing it’s so she feels something either side of her.

Not being able to see it, she’s not sure on it but she managed to rest her bum on it yesterday, she’s also rested her dewlap on it but that’s been about it so far

 

[FireRose]

I don’t have any experience of any of this so I can‘t advise, but you are doing everything you can for Willow. Sending lots of vibes for her, and hugs for you xx

Thank you - this means so much.

I am so sleep deprived from the stress/worry but she is now eating by herself, and recovery/gut stimulant has dropped off at the moment from her daily routine of medicines.

 

[FireRose]

It sounds like you're really diligent about your buns, maybe it isn't an environmental factor after all (at least not in your house). I don't know very much about rabbit health, I was just throwing some possible things out there. Hopefully, the vet will have more answers. Sorry if I came across a bit accusatory or meddlesome, I was just trying to see if there was anything that happened on that day to cause this

I'm glad Willow's eyes are getting better, however slowly it is. The fact that it's starting to show some improvement is really great, and I hope it continues to do so for her!

Ah, poor Ozzie. It hard to watch a friend go through sickness, no matter what species you are.

Sending more vibes for Willow and Ozzie. And for you too, I can't imagine this is easy.

You didn’t come across as anything <3

Honestly, we have queried things with the vets for this to of happened, there is currently an investigation with that so we are waiting to hear back on the outcome.

I don’t think we’ve done anything different in house, but again it could be anything. It’s so strange just HOW quick this happened.

Please don’t feel I took offence because I deffo haven’t and I appreciate any and all feedback for help with this because even the vets are flummoxed!!

Ozzie bless him is going between jealousy because I think he feels being whisked away to the kitchen worktop every 3 hours she MUST be getting treats.

To ohhh More basil for me at breakfast/dinner because willow isn’t scoffing as quick as she use too lol.

I am SO thankful I am currently unemployed, my bank is empty but at least I’ve been able to be home with them both lol.

 

[FireRose]

I have not read all the details in this thread, poor health makes it impossible for me to follow long threads. But if the initial problem came on immediately after the dental ask the vet what eye lubricant was used during the procedure. Some Rabbits can have a severe reaction to the preservative in some brands of lubricant, especially lacrilube. Then inflammation caused by an allergic reaction can become infected.
Chloramphenicol drops/ointment can sting ALOT but my gut feeling is the primary allergen was more likely to be the eye lubricant used during the GA.

Also, there was this issue in Canada last year

Refresh Lacri-Lube eye ointment recalled due to possible risk of infection - Canada.ca

AbbVie Corporation of Canada is recalling all lots of Refresh Lacri-Lube eye ointment because some tubes may leak, which could lead to contamination with bacteria and other microbes and the risk of infection. Seniors and those with a weakened immune system may be at a higher risk. Refresh...

recalls-rappels.canada.ca

I can’t find any details of a similar problem in the UK, but there was back in about 2015

I don’t know if your Rabbit is now under the care of a Veterinary Opthalmologist, but if not I would strongly recommend requesting a referral. If the eye problem occurred as a result of an ‘adverse event’ during the Dental then I would expect the cost of treating the consequences should be met by the surgery where the procedure took place.

I hope your Rabbit will make a full recovery.

Hey,

I will ask what brand it is that they used, that is very interesting they have said they used ointment so perhaps it is that.

I just thought it could be the chloramphenicol drops because her eyes went so so red, then when we stopped it calmed down, but we was told to continue with it despite telling them I really don’t think it’s wise!

They were fine till they wasn’t. Which is always the case I suppose.

We have been referred to an ophthalmologist thankfully, they said the first consultation was free/covered.

We are now in conversation about the rest of the appointments + medication Because I don’t think we should be covering this

There was delay in treatment/reaction from the dental as next day I had rung. Said her eyes were ever so weepy/wet. I was basically told the vet wasn’t concerned ring back Monday if still the same (which they was)

And then there was so much hassle, but it wasn’t until the Wednesday we got the drops. But the vet had only seen photos (not willow)

I think there’s been a lot of balls dropped here and errors made, but we shall see if anything comes from the investigation. Normally they just shut down ranks with this type of things and I won’t be surprised if we are removed from their books. But we shall see

 

[FireRose]

So meds wise we are currently on:

Metacam twice daily (she is on this anyway for arthritis)
Exocin eye drops
Fibrin (which they get from spinning down dogs blood - pretty cool)
Marbocyl antibiotics
And also an eye drops that dilates the pupils (sorry can’t remember the name of that of the top of my head)


We are back at the ophthalmology vets on Friday. And need to also chase up swab results with her.

All in all Willow is sick of being harassed every 2-3 hours with one drop or another,

Ozzie is getting jealous, but then is happy he gets extra fuss/treats because bunny guilt IS real lol.

It’s nice her eye is clearing. Still don’t know about her vision but guess we will know more on Friday.

Then hopefully I can relax and stress less soon too.

Sadly Christmas is cancelled this year for how much she’s costing us - her insurance is at the point we have to cover 20% of all bills, however we are currently funding fibreplex stocks like anyone’s business to keep her stomach nice and working because of the antibiotics/stress.

Hopefully there will be light at the end of the tunnel soon!

 

[bunny momma]

I am pleased to read about and see photos of Willow’s improvement. It is great that she is feeling well enough to eat on her own.
Once she gets used to it her snuggle/bumper bed it will probably be her favorite spot, I would not be surprised if Ozzie joins her in the bumper bed.
Sending more vibes that Willow makes a full recovery.
I hope you can get some help with the treatment costs too.

 

[Cinnabun14]

Thank you, I just re read my post and was a little embarrassed at how forward I was!

I'm glad she's getting better, and I hope a happy ending to this entire situations comes quickly for you all

 

[FireRose]

So we have a diagnosis!!

It pseudomonas aeruginosa

Apparently this is EVERYWHERE in our environment, rabbits are normally pretty resistant to it, but it could just be where she had the dental she wasn’t 100% she then got the ulcer so the weakness was there.

She’s on the right treatment for it - YAY and has been since we’ve been seeing the ophthalmologist so that’s fantastic.

Though it doesn’t really answer my question on “how” because if this is environmental surely Ozzie would’ve had it too?

So I can only conclude this has happened because of the dental or at the vets…..

We had an appointment again on Friday, she “scraped” the eyeball to try get the plaque off the eye, not much came off. But her right eye is looking so much better.

The blood vessels have joined the white bit now too, which means willows body will now start absorbing the infection and her body will do the work and hopefully heal herself. Basically we are now keeping everything crossed for willows eyes to go PINK!!

Yup pink eye means she’s healing and her blood vessels are working well.

We are still not sure if she’s lost her vision, they put some drops in to dilate her pupils, and although they didn’t dilate they were trying too and did a tiny bit, so if we can get those to start dilating it means her vision isn’t lost.

We have been advised we can drop the pain relief if we feel like it because she won’t be in pain…Now this is a tough one for us because

1 - I don’t want to go backwards with her not eating blah blah

2 - She’s on metacam for an early diagnosis of arthritis in her shoulder, now at the moment because it’s a low dose (0.8mlntwice daily) willow is 2.8KG our vet currently has us doing one/two weeks on with as long as possible being off, because at the moment this is working.
She had a kidney function test back in September of last year (was due this year but she’s been unwell with her eye so obviously it’s low priority)

So I don’t know if we drop this now or continue to keep her comfortable, keep her moving, keep her eating blah blah then go back to the vets with regards to the pain when these eye issues are over.

So I’m in a quandary with that.

I’ll get some photos today but I think you’ll all be pleased to see how her right eye has cleared so much!!

Sadly her left is still slow to respond, it’s still bulging a bit too which I’m concerned for.

We’ve now been extended to a 10 day appointment (obviously Christmas is on the way too so need to keep this in mind now for vets opening times)

 

[FireRose]

Sending vibes for Willow to heal quickly. I'm glad you at least have a starting point for treatment, and hopefully she can keep both her eyes. I don't know how easy it is for rabbits to get those, so please take this with a grain of salt, but I'm wondering if it's an environmental factor that gave her the infection...it seems very strange to me that she got sick so quickly after her procedure. I'm NOT saying it's the vet's fault, not at all, I don't know your vet, don't know how they operate so please don't hear me say that! But maybe there's a clue in what happened that day and the days after that as to why she got the infection and ulcers.

I've heard of lots of animals that get on just fine being blind. Even birds. I'm not very sure about rabbits, but animals are crazy good at adapting to losing their sense of hearing or sight. I think j&b has a lot of good advice there.

You was right!!

It is environment which environment we don’t know….

Again replying back to your other message you wasn’t forward at all <3

 

[Shimmer]

Metacam - if she has arthritis, etc, I would be inclined to keep going with things as they are if it's working, particularly over the extended holiday period. You really don't need an urgent appointment at this time of year if other things kick in because you stopped the medication (eg gut stasis). I would also get her routine bloods rechecked just to make sure that her liver and kidneys are coping OK - that's a straightforward thing to do now.

I'm not sure why your vet has said to do weeks on, then weeks off from dosing metacam. Arthritis is an ongoing issue and only gets worse over time. It's quite common for rabbits to be on eg metacam for life at that point. Reduced mobility doesn't seem like a good payoff. Any additional pain is stressful and can stop them eating properly (with knock on effects to teeth and guts), or make them more susceptible to other issues. Rabbits also metabolise metacam very quickly, which is why they often end up on much higher daily doses than the equivalent size dog (dog metacam syringes are marked in kg bodyweight).

Monitoring weight weekly is a good way of seeing how a rabbit is doing. Continued weight loss over a couple of weeks should alert you to something being not right.

 

[FireRose]

I think Willow has had enough of all this considering she’s just flicked me off when I’ve placed her down. She was all snuggly under the bed bless her. I know it’s for her own good but I do hate disturbing her so much.

So here’s photo updates of her left + right eye

I’ve also taken a front on photo so the bulging is seen better - they’re not sure what’s causing that yet they said perhaps an abscess so if so the antibiotics should be clearing that also.

Her eyes are less red, less swollen, the third eye lid has also gone back to a nice pink. So I think we are on the way.

Sadly it will be a long road, but once those eye vessels reach the bacteria. Willow’s body will take over and start absorbing it in to her body and heal her eyes.

All in all a LOT better than they were - especially her right eye

I mentioned the wetness because I was concerned that perhaps her tear ducts were blocked. However we’ve been told they’re fine and it’ll be the drops and everything going in - I’m hoping that IS the case. But the wet face does concern me.

I’m bathing that and drying it best I can at intervals during the day.

 

[bunny momma]

I agree with Shimmer and would not stop Medicam before the holidays, and if she has arthritis I would want her on it every day; though you may want to reduce the dose to see if she would still get relief from arthritis pain at a lower dose.
I am pleased the abx is correct for the bacteria they confirmed and her eyes are healing. Though I understand how frustrating it is to not know the reason the bacteria attacked her eyes.
Even though bacteria that is everywhere makes it more difficult to trace it to the vet, IMI they were lax in not following up with her sooner or changing her abx when it got worse.
Sending more vibes that she makes a full recovery.

 

[Cinnabun14]

I'm glad you've finally got a diagnosis, even if it will be a long road to recovery. Here's to hoping the road will be a flat one, not a mountain

Yay for pink eye (never thought I'd be saying that!). I hope the left eye will follow the same path and Willow will get full sight to both eyes back.

Sending big hugs for you and Willow, and some extra vibes for you, because it isn't easy to take care of a sick friend