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Barrie is matty: u/d p12 sore hock :(

keletkezes

Wise Old Thumper
Wednesday night, there's a couple of matty clumps of black fur on the windowsill. I note them, give Barrie a quick bum check (just with my hand) but he's dry and clean, a little matty around the middle bits of his legs (ankle-knee) but nothing I'm concerned about, a one off wee incident isn't to worry about, or he could be 'wet' from the rain because Aboleth had that. Thursday evening, a couple more, his legs are definitely still matty and arguably worse, still dry, but like he's had wet on him all night, but under him he's not matty. This morning, more smaller fur pulls and he looks more uncomfortable. No worse than yesterday, but *he's* changed. Still eating fine, body condition fine, but fur on his back feels less good, a teeny tiny bit rougher. Still glossy as heck. Booked in for the vet tomorrow morning as vet said if he was eating etc. not worth squeezing him in today (they're rammed), but to call back if there's any worsening obviously. He grunted at me when I tried to have a look so I've left him to it as I don't want to stress him out, he finds me stressful enough as it is (he still runs away from me when i go in their house).

He doesn't smell of wee, or smell of anything except normal rabbitiness. It's almost like it's not wee but I can't think what it might be otherwise. He's pooing fine, eating fine, but fussing when resting now: pulling hay across litter trays, digging in them to get comfy, he even had his head on the back of Chibbs' neck this morning, cute but unusual. There's the usual amount of wee everywhere but I can't get him to wee for me on command :lol: I assume he's drinking because he still feels normal and the normal amount of water has gone down. He has no poo stuck to him, no excess caecos, nothing like that. He is moulting, this is adding to the mattiness, and I wonder if it's like Aboleth's matty bum skirt issue but further under? From what I can see of his skin it's OK, the wet hasn't soaked down that far yet if that makes sense? I'm just at a loss to explain it, and I'd rather someone with more confidence and expertise took a look, because he's 2.8kg of wriggly muscle (could be worse, could be Lopsy's superpowered back feet :roll:) and the OH is RUBBISH at restraining and my hands aren't big enough :)

We don't know how old he is: he's a car park stray :( We can say for certainty 'relatively old' because he sleeps SO MUCH :lol: I've put him at 7 or 8. IIRC he was neutered when he was picked up by the rescue, but he's definitely been neutered well over a year either way. His legs seem too short for his body and he's never been able to run 'properly', like baby rabbits' legs are too short for their bodies rather than any serious issue. He does run at a decent speed now though, when we first let them out on the lawn he was running slower than ill old man Lopsy :lol: He stretches fine, he's so long he can reach half his face through the top of the shorter run we have so getting food off the top is easier for him :) His last vaccs were, uhm, October I think? Before we got him anyway :)

Should I take a clump of pulled-out fur with me? Poos (although they're normal for him)? Anything else you can think I might want to try and check etc.?
 
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I think your instinct to get him medically examined is a good one. I don't have any advice but shimmers suggestion seems reasonable - though as the collectors you may have a different opinion. Really hoping your little man is ok, loads of get better vibes
 
Take a urine sample?
Yes, good idea. Not easy but I'll keep an eye out and a syringe handy. He'll go alone in the carrier (Chibbs will just bully him otherwise) and I usually get them in an hour at least before the appointment, so MIGHT have a chance for one then at the latest.

I think your instinct to get him medically examined is a good one. I don't have any advice but shimmers suggestion seems reasonable - though as the collectors you may have a different opinion. Really hoping your little man is ok, loads of get better vibes
Thanks :) Yeah, you're right, it's not an easy call but I'd totally forgotten it was even remotely possible XD

I keep making sure he's eating. Trying to get him to eat 'wet' foods but nothing too wet, so forage rather than hay. He's enjoying the grass (and so is Chibbs :roll:).
 
We got home with loads of forage as usual (although mostly grass as it's the 'safest' forage), and you wouldn't know he was looking a bit down all day. We came through the gate, he was doing head binkies on the windowsill with excitement and then he was outside and mowing his way through the lot. I'm much less likely to worry about him not eating overnight now XD

I also forgot to mention this was BOUND to happen as we're both way end of next week :lol: Bloomin older rabbits :roll :lol:
 
Sending vibes. Perhaps he is pulling fur where he has discomfort, like arthritis or a bug bite, though a. vet check and urine test are a good idea.
 
We're back :) Nothing obvious, obviously XD Wee sample expressed which was a bit more concentrated than usual, but nothing to be worried about. I've seen his and Chibbs' wee like that before, and it's not usually like that all the time. Could be related to the little :censored: trying to spray me in the run this morning :lol: He DID NOT like being in the carrier, he was quite upset about it and thumped a bit, then had a strop around. Full MOT NOA except a hook on one molar, but not causing any issues for now but just for note. Body condition perfect, although the scales said his weight was a lot lower than I would've expected, but I'm putting that down to scales rather than Barrie.

Being an older rabbit, and given his down-ness yesterday (also totally not evident this morning), we've been advised to try and help him clean his lower legs (urine scald prevention) and given some metacam in case there's a low-grade cystitic infection. Vet is very much of the opinion that pain relief is paramount in, especially older, rabbits :) No follow up booked as he's not actively unwell right now but if he's still a bit off in a week to go back :) Vet's main suggestion? Boys are lazy at cleaning themselves where it doesn't matter quite so much and we DEFINITELY saw that in older Lopsy :lol:

So, cleaning his legs: that'll be fun :roll: I don't want to get them wet if I can avoid it, so a very slightly damp cloth/similar was my best plan, maybe a gentle brush as well. I think his moult might be making it worse TBH.
 
Sorry I missed this previously.

It's good news that the vet couldn't really find anything wrong, although it's always good to have a reason for things. Perhaps some boys are lazier about cleaning when they get older, but I've not experienced it with any of mine. I think his moult could definitely be making the problem worse.

Good luck with your bunny leg-cleaning duties :) I hope it's just a one-off and he's soon back to normal and stays that way.
 
I have not seen evidence of less cleaning by boys without a cause.
Clipping fur would be good to keep skin as urine free as possible. It can be a two person job. Sending vibes it will not be a long term isdue.
My Raven has daily medicam, though it can be a concern to use long term at higher dosrs in some bunnies.
Did you get abx too?
 
Did you get abx too?
No, low-level infections that aren't causing any proper symptoms shouldn't be treated with abx really, as it probably contributes to resistance. We've got no way of trimming his fur really, plus as an outside rabbit I wouldn't want to.

Lopsy got that smear down his front paws that came and went. We never found a better cause for it than he CBAed to clean it :S But his back legs were always immaculate. He did pull matts out of his back feet (we had no chance of getting those out/off without sedation) but Barrie doesn't have matty feet :roll: I've left him to 'calm down' (he seems fine) and we'll pick up on whatever he needs cleaning wise from tomorrow. I did get a lovely picture of him and Chibbs but it's not uploaded anywhere yet.
 
Update: we think he got matty because he started moulting! He's much better now, still a bit top-matty in places but no change of spirits etc. :) We're trying to de-fluff him as much as possible but he runs off and hides. Still, better than nothing.

One thing I did notice yesterday: he has a sore hock. It's not bothering him, it's currently a pink spot on his hock, no signs of ulceration, bleeding etc., and he runs around fine. Didn't get a good enough look at his other foot. I'm going to remove the carpet from their windowsill: he spends at least 20hrs a day sleeping up there I'm sure :lol: (might be a slight exaggeration ;P) Dunno if I'll replace it with something: it's just MDF.

But do I need to do anything else to help him? Put more hay in litter trays I guess? The litter trays (all three of them :eyeroll:) are paper pellets and hay on top, but they like to remove the hay from the littlest one. Would the paper pellets be a problem for him? Their other areas are lino (playhouse floor), concrete (run 1) and grass/dirt (run 2) 24/7, plus plastic runaround type tubes. When they get let out to mow the grass it's grass/dirt on the lawn and a wooden hutch for hiding in etc.

Any suggestions?
 
Update: we think he got matty because he started moulting! He's much better now, still a bit top-matty in places but no change of spirits etc. :) We're trying to de-fluff him as much as possible but he runs off and hides. Still, better than nothing.

One thing I did notice yesterday: he has a sore hock. It's not bothering him, it's currently a pink spot on his hock, no signs of ulceration, bleeding etc., and he runs around fine. Didn't get a good enough look at his other foot. I'm going to remove the carpet from their windowsill: he spends at least 20hrs a day sleeping up there I'm sure :lol: (might be a slight exaggeration ;P) Dunno if I'll replace it with something: it's just MDF.

But do I need to do anything else to help him? Put more hay in litter trays I guess? The litter trays (all three of them :eyeroll:) are paper pellets and hay on top, but they like to remove the hay from the littlest one. Would the paper pellets be a problem for him? Their other areas are lino (playhouse floor), concrete (run 1) and grass/dirt (run 2) 24/7, plus plastic runaround type tubes. When they get let out to mow the grass it's grass/dirt on the lawn and a wooden hutch for hiding in etc.

Any suggestions?

Removing the carpet will help, or cover it with an old sheet or duvet cover to make the surface less abrasive. His toe nails need to be kept short.

Sore hocks can be a secondary symptom of arthritis in the spine/ hips. So determining if there is a primary cause and treating it is important. What to treat the sore hocks with depends on the extent of the problem. Derbymed SCP Spray can be helpful https://www.vetuk.co.uk/veterinary-...re-c-141_169/derbymed-scp-spray-200ml-p-41660

Shredded paper rather than paper pellet litter might be a better option, but shredded paper litter trays need changing at least once a day. Not sure if this is the case with paper pellet litter as I have never used that. I mean for my Rabbits of course :lol:

Lino can sometimes be a problem, textured stable matts provide a better less slippery contact surface.
 
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Shredded paper rather than paper pellet litter might be a better option, but shredded paper litter trays need changing at least once a day. Not sure if this is the case with paper pellet litter as I have never used that. I mean for my Rabbits of course :lol:
Does that mean you HAVE used shredded paper?! (I'm thinking about the other thread ;P) :lol:

I'll get him in for an appointment when I'm back from being in Essex, so w/c 4th July. The carpet's a bit ropey after being used as a bed and dug at for 7yrs anyway, so we'll just take it off and see how they cope jumping on/off. Might go back to putting steps in. I'll keep the paper pellets for now, as Matt'll be looking after them next week and he likes change as much as Chibbs does :lol: But I'll drop how much I use and put loads more hay in, should have enough to do that (running out of the cheap stuff, now have to go to Essex for it :roll:). Given Barrie's sleeping pattern, he's definitely old, possibly older than Chibbs, and he's longer than his legs were built for (he's all over the place poor lad XD), so spinal arthritis is a very distinct possibility. I expect, if nothing else, we'll get metacam for him again and if that helps then I don't really mind :D His nails aren't long, as in I can't see them protruding through his furry bits, but they might be 'too' long for sore hocks. I shall have a look, and traumatise the poor lad in the process!
 
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