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Need your opinions please

P

Pete-lionhead

New Kit
Hi all. Hopefully this isn’t a too long of a post but I’ve been having problems with Pete for the past month or so.

We got him 5 months or so ago from a family who didn’t want him anymore and his hutch was tiny. We got him home and a few weeks later he developed the common symptoms of snuffles which we treated with antibiotics and it cleared up. Then about a month ago he started the same symptoms again so we got him back in and the vet told us his teeth might be the cause so we got him in for x rays and his teeth doing (which weren’t even that bad the vet later told us) his x rays showed up something very small in his nasal passage. all this time during his check ups etc they checked his eyes weren’t blocked which they wasnt. I took him back as we weren’t getting anywhere and his snuffling and his left eye was getting worse. Now he’s on Baytril and Loxicom and his last visit which was a week ago his left eye duct was blocked. He’s been on Baytril now for 17ish days and his eyes are still crusty (both now, not just his left) I’m just at a dead end as to wonder what it is?

Sorry for bad grammar and possible spelling errors
 
Pete-lionhead said:
Hi all. Hopefully this isn’t a too long of a post but I’ve been having problems with Pete for the past month or so.

We got him 5 months or so ago from a family who didn’t want him anymore and his hutch was tiny. We got him home and a few weeks later he developed the common symptoms of snuffles which we treated with antibiotics and it cleared up. Then about a month ago he started the same symptoms again so we got him back in and the vet told us his teeth might be the cause so we got him in for x rays and his teeth doing (which weren’t even that bad the vet later told us) his x rays showed up something very small in his nasal passage. all this time during his check ups etc they checked his eyes weren’t blocked which they wasnt. I took him back as we weren’t getting anywhere and his snuffling and his left eye was getting worse. Now he’s on Baytril and Loxicom and his last visit which was a week ago his left eye duct was blocked. He’s been on Baytril now for 17ish days and his eyes are still crusty (both now, not just his left) I’m just at a dead end as to wonder what it is?

Sorry for bad grammar and possible spelling errors
Click to expand...

Has the Vet taken a deep nasal swab to check the specific bacteria involved? A DNS needs to be done under GA, maybe it was done during the Dental ?? There are many other antibiotics that can be tried if Baytril is ineffective. The choice of antibiotic treatment is best based on culture and sensitivity results from a swab.

Is your Rabbit having a topical eye treatment such as Isathal or Tiacil ?
 
As Jane says, there are other treatment options if Baytril isn't working - and after 17 days, I would be looking for signs of improvement in the condition. You have done the 'obvious' treatments so far - time for another vet visit and some different antibiotics, I think.

Did you find out what the small object in the nasal passage is? It may be a source of infection - sometimes bits of hay, etc can get stuck there.
 
Yes he’s had a swab taken and it was pastrella or however it’s spelt and Baytril was sensitive to it. There wasn’t any diagnosis of what the small findings were but the vet said she could only see it very faintly on one X-ray but couldn’t see it on any others. She said it could be something stuck in there or worst case a tumour but she said given his symptoms it could just be a foreign object and that when she did the flush it should of come out. He’s in on Thursday for a check up on his eyes so hopefully we will get a better idea of what it is or if it’s still stuck. I don’t like the idea of another GA for X-rays as I know with him being an older bun (around 8) it’s very risky.
 
InspectorMorse said:
Has the Vet taken a deep nasal swab to check the specific bacteria involved? A DNS needs to be done under GA, maybe it was done during the Dental ?? There are many other antibiotics that can be tried if Baytril is ineffective. The choice of antibiotic treatment is best based on culture and sensitivity results from a swab.

Is your Rabbit having a topical eye treatment such as Isathal or Tiacil ?
Click to expand...

He has been on isathal then went onto a watery one which I can’t remember the name of. That didn’t seem very effective either
 
Sounds as though an endoscopic examination of his nasal passages may be needed. I know that you said that the crowns of his teeth were not too bad, but did the Vet comment on the tooth roots ? Could tooth root elongation be what was seen on the X-ray ? If the tooth roots become elongated they can press on the nasolacrimal duct causing a gunky eye. Elongated tooth roots can also penetrate the nasal passages causing sneezing, discharge and infection.

Zamrmau.jpg
 
InspectorMorse said:
Sounds as though an endoscopic examination of his nasal passages may be needed. I know that you said that the crowns of his teeth were not too bad, but did the Vet comment on the tooth roots ? Could tooth root elongation be what was seen on the X-ray ? If the tooth roots become elongated they can press on the nasolacrimal duct causing a gunky eye. Elongated tooth roots can also penetrate the nasal passages causing sneezing, discharge and infection.

Zamrmau.jpg
Click to expand...

It was strange as after the X-rays and the dental they said “it could be his tooth roots pushing through” but I was kind of confused as they’ve done x rays etc and still seemed none the wiser about the issue. I’m starting to lose trust in vets as I just seem to be going around in circles. Can they put a little camera up his nose without being under GA to find out?
 
Pete-lionhead said:
It was strange as after the X-rays and the dental they said “it could be his tooth roots pushing through” but I was kind of confused as they’ve done x rays etc and still seemed none the wiser about the issue. I’m starting to lose trust in vets as I just seem to be going around in circles. Can they put a little camera up his nose without being under GA to find out?
Click to expand...

To carry out an endoscopic examination (camera up the nose) a GA is needed. Could you ask to be referred to an Exotics Specialist ?
 
I agree with IP's suggestion about seeking a referral to an exotics specialist to try and get to the bottom of it. In my experience, the specialists tend to do thorough investigations right off the bat and get to the root cause a lot quicker. In the long run, it would save Peter having to go backwards and forwards to the vet and he'll be put on the right treatment plan a lot sooner.

My own initial thoughts are that Peter may need to be put on a more heavy duty antibiotic, such as injectable penicillin which is very effective.
 
InspectorMorse said:
To carry out an endoscopic examination (camera up the nose) a GA is needed. Could you ask to be referred to an Exotics Specialist ?
Click to expand...

These are an exotics specialist vets. I’ll have to have a good in-depth chat about it all tonight with them as we’ve been back and fourth now and a lot of money spent and we are still non the wiser and need a definite diagnosis to be able to get Pete right
 
Scrappy's Little Helper said:
I agree with IP's suggestion about seeking a referral to an exotics specialist to try and get to the bottom of it. In my experience, the specialists tend to do thorough investigations right off the bat and get to the root cause a lot quicker. In the long run, it would save Peter having to go backwards and forwards to the vet and he'll be put on the right treatment plan a lot sooner.

My own initial thoughts are that Peter may need to be put on a more heavy duty antibiotic, such as injectable penicillin which is very effective.
Click to expand...

Yes I’ve been reading about the injections. Maybe I’ll bring it up with them tonight and see but I’m just concerned as to what has caused this flare up. It’s just strange how his tear ducts have been fine throughout all this but it’s just been the last week it’s been blocked up. It just gets me worried
 
Pete-lionhead said:
Yes I’ve been reading about the injections. Maybe I’ll bring it up with them tonight and see but I’m just concerned as to what has caused this flare up. It’s just strange how his tear ducts have been fine throughout all this but it’s just been the last week it’s been blocked up. It just gets me worried
Click to expand...

One of my bunnies suffered with recurrent blocked tear ducts which was caused by tooth roots (as confirmed by a CT scan). The infection was really bad. They tried baytril and then another antibiotic which I've forgotten the name of (it began with an S!). Neither of them even touched the infection.

In the end she was given a tear duct flush (apparently a lot of gunk came out!) and a two week course of penicillin. That did a fantastic job of clearing up the infection.

The infection did recur occassionally but we had this system where as soon as her eye started to look weepy, I'd whip her up the vet and we'd start treatment again. The infection never got as bad as it did the first time.

Her first flush was done under GA but they can be done conscious with a local anaesthetic, depending on how calm the rabbit is.

Good luck with your appointment. I was in a similar position with my bun as you are with Pete. It's really worrying when the infection seems to be getting worse and you feel you're no closer to finding a solution.
 
Scrappy's Little Helper said:
One of my bunnies suffered with recurrent blocked tear ducts which was caused by tooth roots (as confirmed by a CT scan). The infection was really bad. They tried baytril and then another antibiotic which I've forgotten the name of (it began with an S!). Neither of them even touched the infection.

In the end she was given a tear duct flush (apparently a lot of gunk came out!) and a two week course of penicillin. That did a fantastic job of clearing up the infection.

The infection did recur occassionally but we had this system where as soon as her eye started to look weepy, I'd whip her up the vet and we'd start treatment again. The infection never got as bad as it did the first time.

Her first flush was done under GA but they can be done conscious with a local anaesthetic, depending on how calm the rabbit is.

Good luck with your appointment. I was in a similar position with my bun as you are with Pete. It's really worrying when the infection seems to be getting worse and you feel you're no closer to finding a solution.
Click to expand...

Sounds exactly like what’s been going on with Pete as in they flushed loads of gunk out during his GA but ever since then it seems to have fully closed with I’m wondering could be caused by inflammation maybe? They also caught his eye during the flush and caused an ulcer to appear on his eye which they made me pay for to get right!! It wasn’t the spending money on him part that annoyed me but it just seemed very cheeky to charge me for their mistakes?!
 
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