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Sneezing update

M

mismatchbunnies

Warren Scout
Re my last post.

My male (not the bunny who has been sneezing with no discharge on and off for the last week) has just sneezed with a small amount of white discharge, so I’m assuming he has got snuffles. We are going to take them both to the vet tomorrow morning providing there isn’t some miracle that it was just a one off and neither sneeze again - unlikely I know. It is also a bank holiday as well as covid which will make this difficult and expensive, so in the unlikely event that neither of them show any more signs then I will likely get them checked later in the week anyways.

Do you think her sneezing was the start of snuffles and she’s passed it onto him (he was already vulnerable and he’s had it before)? But so far today she hasn’t sneezed at all. I’ve heard some rabbits can recover from mild cases of snuffles on their own but I don’t know if this is fact. On the other hand, I think it’s likely she’s already exposed if it was him who got it first (and her sneezing occasionally is something else) as she grooms him constantly and they obviously live in the same space. However, last time the male had it, the female never got it so I don’t know.

Both are acting completely normal and eating fine apart from the male sneezing a few times.

Also, if/when I do go, should I take them to the vets in separate carriers to reduce risk of transmission? They have done this before, but my female is especially anxious so I don’t know if being in the same carrier would help this.

All advice/help appreciated.
 
mismatchbunnies said:
Re my last post.

My male (not the bunny who has been sneezing with no discharge on and off for the last week) has just sneezed with a small amount of white discharge, so I’m assuming he has got snuffles. We are going to take them both to the vet tomorrow morning providing there isn’t some miracle that it was just a one off and neither sneeze again - unlikely I know. It is also a bank holiday as well as covid which will make this difficult and expensive, so in the unlikely event that neither of them show any more signs then I will likely get them checked later in the week anyways.

Do you think her sneezing was the start of snuffles and she’s passed it onto him (he was already vulnerable and he’s had it before)? But so far today she hasn’t sneezed at all. I’ve heard some rabbits can recover from mild cases of snuffles on their own but I don’t know if this is fact. On the other hand, I think it’s likely she’s already exposed if it was him who got it first (and her sneezing occasionally is something else) as she grooms him constantly and they obviously live in the same space. However, last time the male had it, the female never got it so I don’t know.

Both are acting completely normal and eating fine apart from the male sneezing a few times.

Also, if/when I do go, should I take them to the vets in separate carriers to reduce risk of transmission? They have done this before, but my female is especially anxious so I don’t know if being in the same carrier would help this.

All advice/help appreciated.
Click to expand...

Rabbits can be asymptomatic carriers of the various bacteria that cause the symptoms of 'Snuffles'. It is not alway Pasteurella, but that is usually the prime suspect. Abx treatment may resolve clinical symptoms, but may not totally eradicate the bacteria. The symptoms can re-occur, especially at times at stress or concurrent illness. There is no point in separating the Rabbits now, any disease transmission will already have occurred and the stress of separation may cause stress and exacerbate the problem.

Some additional information here :

https://rabbitwelfare.co.uk/rabbit-health/illness/rabbit-snuffles/

https://www.veterinarywebinars.com/...oads/2016/03/Study_Notes_Ear_Nose_Rabbits.pdf

http://www.medirabbit.com/EN/Respiratory/respira_main.htm

https://www.lbah.com/rabbit/pasteurella-rabbit/
 
Jack's-Jane said:
Rabbits can be asymptomatic carriers of the various bacteria that cause the symptoms of 'Snuffles'. It is not alway Pasteurella, but that is usually the prime suspect. Abx treatment may resolve clinical symptoms, but may not totally eradicate the bacteria. The symptoms can re-occur, especially at times at stress or concurrent illness. There is no point in separating the Rabbits now, any disease transmission will already have occurred and the stress of separation may cause stress and exacerbate the problem.

Some additional information here :

https://rabbitwelfare.co.uk/rabbit-health/illness/rabbit-snuffles/

https://www.veterinarywebinars.com/...oads/2016/03/Study_Notes_Ear_Nose_Rabbits.pdf

http://www.medirabbit.com/EN/Respiratory/respira_main.htm

https://www.lbah.com/rabbit/pasteurella-rabbit/
Click to expand...

Thanks for the help again. Neither rabbits have sneezed since (touch wood). The discharge was white but it was also tiny (3 tiny dots not much bigger than a needle in width). It wasn’t even a quarter of the amount that he had last time he had snuffles. Is it possible he had something stuck in his nose? But if so why would it be white? He was in he litter tray when it happened and was eating hay (can be fairly dusty despite shaking it). I really don’t know what to think.
 
mismatchbunnies said:
Thanks for the help again. Neither rabbits have sneezed since (touch wood). The discharge was white but it was also tiny (3 tiny dots not much bigger than a needle in width). It wasn’t even a quarter of the amount that he had last time he had snuffles. Is it possible he had something stuck in his nose? But if so why would it be white? He was in he litter tray when it happened and was eating hay (can be fairly dusty despite shaking it). I really don’t know what to think.
Click to expand...

Personally I would want to try to get both Rabbits examined by a Vet if the sneezing is an ongoing issue given that one Rabbit does have a past history of having a RTI. Without an examination it's really impossible to say if the sneezing is or is not related to active infection or some other cause. I would call the Vet tomorrow, ie after the Bank Holiday, explain the exact situation as you have on here and seek their advice. In the current Covid 19 situation the Vet may say just 'watch and wait' or he/she may agree that you bring both Rabbits in to be examined. As I said, personally I'd be pushing hard for the latter. Good luck :)
 
I’ve just got off the phone from the vets (after waiting 4 hours for the vet to actually give me a call back). I explained the situation and she seemed very dismissive and quite rude (I understand they are under a lot of pressure and challenging circumstances). After explaining about two sentence’s worth of what’s been going on she said she could prescribe baytril to be picked up tomorrow without examining them, despite the bunnies having limited symptoms (especially in comparison to last time). My male rabbit has been sneezing and some white discharge (seemingly more clear case of snuffles) as opposed to my female who has been sneezing without/very little discharge for about a week - I only see a little damp on her nose occasionally and it doesn’t seem white. Therefore, I’m not 100% convinced it is snuffles and so I asked if we could be seen by a vet for an examination. Not to mention it doesn’t seem to have got worse and they are both acting and eating normally otherwise. Anyways we’ve got an appointment booked for tomorrow morning so I hope that’ll give us some answers.
 
tonibun said:
Is it Timothy Hay?
Click to expand...

Sorry I forgot to reply to this. Yes it is Small Pet Select 2nd Cutting which we have found to be fairly dusty (especially nearer to the bottom of the box which is what we are using currently), so it is a possibility that this could cause the problems, but wouldn’t it have shown sooner? We have had this hay since January now and have gotten to the bottom of the box once before. Either way we have just ordered a 5kg box of Timothy hay from HayBox in the hope it is less dusty (as the website claims), so we’ll see if that helps and if we can switch.
 
mismatchbunnies said:
I’ve just got off the phone from the vets (after waiting 4 hours for the vet to actually give me a call back). I explained the situation and she seemed very dismissive and quite rude (I understand they are under a lot of pressure and challenging circumstances). After explaining about two sentence’s worth of what’s been going on she said she could prescribe baytril to be picked up tomorrow without examining them, despite the bunnies having limited symptoms (especially in comparison to last time). My male rabbit has been sneezing and some white discharge (seemingly more clear case of snuffles) as opposed to my female who has been sneezing without/very little discharge for about a week - I only see a little damp on her nose occasionally and it doesn’t seem white. Therefore, I’m not 100% convinced it is snuffles and so I asked if we could be seen by a vet for an examination. Not to mention it doesn’t seem to have got worse and they are both acting and eating normally otherwise. Anyways we’ve got an appointment booked for tomorrow morning so I hope that’ll give us some answers.
Click to expand...

I am glad that the Rabbits will both be examined rather than just having abx thrown at an undiagnosed problem. That could do more harm than good.
 
Jack's-Jane said:
I am glad that the Rabbits will both be examined rather than just having abx thrown at an undiagnosed problem. That could do more harm than good.
Click to expand...

Yes I agree as my female is stasis prone and I know antibiotics can mess with the gut bacteria leading to stasis. Do you know of any good probiotics? I’m going to ask the vet tomorrow, if they do want to put her on antibiotics to hopefully prevent stasis.

Also do you know how to tell if snuffles has spread/developed (if that’s what it is). Obviously sneezing more and more discharge, struggle breathing etc, but anything else I should know of? The male is possibly sneezing slightly more than yesterday, but the female hasn’t sneezed once (yet - usually happens later in the day for some reason) but I’m so paranoid now.
 
mismatchbunnies said:
Yes I agree as my female is stasis prone and I know antibiotics can mess with the gut bacteria leading to stasis. Do you know of any good probiotics? I’m going to ask the vet tomorrow, if they do want to put her on antibiotics to hopefully prevent stasis.

Also do you know how to tell if snuffles has spread/developed (if that’s what it is). Obviously sneezing more and more discharge, struggle breathing etc, but anything else I should know of? The male is possibly sneezing slightly more than yesterday, but the female hasn’t sneezed once (yet - usually happens later in the day for some reason) but I’m so paranoid now.
Click to expand...

There is much debate as to how useful probiotics are as the naturally acidic environment is likely to kill off probiotics before they reach the part of the GO tract where they are needed-ie the cecum.

http://www.medirabbit.com/EN/GI_diseases/Probiotics/probiotics.htm

That said, giving a Probiotic wont do any harm. Most Vets suggest Fibreplex :

https://www.animeddirect.co.uk/protexin-fibreplex-for-rabbits-15ml-syringe.html

As for signs of 'Snuffles' progressing- symptoms such as unexplained weightloss-ie Rabbit is not eating less but losing weight, Increased respiratory rate/effort, mouth breathing/elevating the head and stretching the neck, choking episodes, spontaneous abscesses (abscesses appearing without any history of injury), ear infections/head tilt.
 
Last edited:
Jack's-Jane said:
There is much debate as to how useful probiotics are as the naturally acidic environment is likely to kill off probiotics before they reach the part of the GO tract where they are needed-ie the cecum.

http://www.medirabbit.com/EN/GI_diseases/Probiotics/probiotics.htm

That said, giving a Probiotic wont do any harm. Most Vets suggest Fibreplex :

https://www.animeddirect.co.uk/protexin-fibreplex-for-rabbits-15ml-syringe.html

As for signs of 'Snuffles' progressing- symptoms such as unexplained weightloss-ie Rabbit is not eating less but losing weight, Increased respiratory rate/effort, mouth breathing/elevating the head and stretching the neck, choking episodes, spontaneous abscesses (abscesses appearing without any history of injury), ear infections/head tilt.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the help. I will ask the vet tomorrow. As for the signs of progression, I don’t think that they have shown any of these signs other than scratching ears more (male is a lop and so is prone to wax buildup anyways) so I will mention that tomorrow also to make sure they check both rabbits’ ears. From what I can see, their ears look clear even though I obviously can’t see the whole ear canal.
 
mismatchbunnies said:
Sorry I forgot to reply to this. Yes it is Small Pet Select 2nd Cutting which we have found to be fairly dusty (especially nearer to the bottom of the box which is what we are using currently), so it is a possibility that this could cause the problems, but wouldn’t it have shown sooner? We have had this hay since January now and have gotten to the bottom of the box once before. Either way we have just ordered a 5kg box of Timothy hay from HayBox in the hope it is less dusty (as the website claims), so we’ll see if that helps and if we can switch.
Click to expand...

Quite a few rabbits are allergic to Timothy hay.
 
Over my decades of owning bunnies I've had my fair share of snotty & sneezy bunnies. My first experience was a one eyed bunny who was permanently snotty when not on baytril (which she always responded well too). Skull xrays showed half her face / skull had been damaged (she was rescued from abusive home but the most loving rabbit ever) so she was unusual as her tubes weren't connected & nothing could drain properly. We'd have lulls when it wasn't so bad but it was a lifelong issue.

Mousey started sneezing sporadically (like your bunnies she is in the heart of my home so I don't miss much) - perhaps weekly. She produced thick snot (on the carpet - no nostril or paw evidence). I saw the vet twice but her airways were always good & no clinical signs of infection so nothing prescibed. It stopped after a month or so but she has, over the subsequent 4 years done it a further twice (I think)

Boo sneezes a little but she is a dental bun so to be expected. She never produces snot.

Rudey is the most interesting case of all my bunnies IMO. I adopted him as he was bereaved (& I fell in love) - his previous mum didn't want him lonely. His partner had died of a RTI. When he arrived he was very snotty & you could hear him sounding congested. You could see it was really hard work for him to sneeze. The vet put him on baytril & bisolvon which kind of did the trick - big improvement but not completely sorted. He did have several episodes where he was really snotty but he was never prescribed antbiotics again (was in kidney failure & had really bad reaction to prev antibiotics). He was at the vets all the time for other stuff so it was reviewed. Anyway, the bit I found interesting was that for Rudeys last few months his snottiness went completely. I really would have expected it to get worse given the physical & therefore mental stress he would have been under.

Sorry my experiences turned in to an essay. Wishing your bunnies well
 
joey&boo said:
Over my decades of owning bunnies I've had my fair share of snotty & sneezy bunnies. My first experience was a one eyed bunny who was permanently snotty when not on baytril (which she always responded well too). Skull xrays showed half her face / skull had been damaged (she was rescued from abusive home but the most loving rabbit ever) so she was unusual as her tubes weren't connected & nothing could drain properly. We'd have lulls when it wasn't so bad but it was a lifelong issue.

Mousey started sneezing sporadically (like your bunnies she is in the heart of my home so I don't miss much) - perhaps weekly. She produced thick snot (on the carpet - no nostril or paw evidence). I saw the vet twice but her airways were always good & no clinical signs of infection so nothing prescibed. It stopped after a month or so but she has, over the subsequent 4 years done it a further twice (I think)

Boo sneezes a little but she is a dental bun so to be expected. She never produces snot.

Rudey is the most interesting case of all my bunnies IMO. I adopted him as he was bereaved (& I fell in love) - his previous mum didn't want him lonely. His partner had died of a RTI. When he arrived he was very snotty & you could hear him sounding congested. You could see it was really hard work for him to sneeze. The vet put him on baytril & bisolvon which kind of did the trick - big improvement but not completely sorted. He did have several episodes where he was really snotty but he was never prescribed antbiotics again (was in kidney failure & had really bad reaction to prev antibiotics). He was at the vets all the time for other stuff so it was reviewed. Anyway, the bit I found interesting was that for Rudeys last few months his snottiness went completely. I really would have expected it to get worse given the physical & therefore mental stress he would have been under.

Sorry my experiences turned in to an essay. Wishing your bunnies well
Click to expand...

This is really interesting, thank you for sharing! Yes my rabbits are everything to me so I can always tell when something is up. My rabbit of 13 years never experienced a case of snuffles at all and now my two two year old buns seem to have had it all - stasis, snuffles, potential dental problems in the future. Just luck I guess, but I wouldn’t change them of course.
 
Just a little update (at almost 2am haha). Over the afternoon/evening male bunny seemed to get worse (sneezing a lot more) so we ended up taking both bunnies to the emergency vet. Both were checked and nothing major was picked up (both lungs sounded clear, gut movement, no teeth issues supposedly even though the female had small spurs last time?! Don’t know how that happened unless he missed it). But anyways, the vet thought the male was indeed a case of snuffles, and with what we’d described of the female (despite no/little discharge), he has put them both on baytril to see if it helps and we will possibly go back to get swabs of the discharge to be tested if things don’t improve/it continues. The vet honestly seemed really knowledgable, he was attentive to my concerns about the possibility of either or both bunnies being resistant to baytril, and with the female’s history of GI stasis, he said it would be unlikely to cause problems (hopefully) and I could look into getting a probiotic if it seemed necessary. We will most likely either go back Thursday or Monday to get swabs if the male is still getting discharge, or either buns don’t improve. We’ll just have to take it by ear and see what happens.
 
mismatchbunnies said:
Yes I have heard of this, but I feel like they would have shown signs of being allergic sooner as they are almost 2 and just over 2 years old. I think it could have been the dust though.
Click to expand...
Humans can certainly develop allergies later in life, I don't know about rabbits. Oral Allergy Syndrome is one human late-developer, and it is well-documented that antibiotic allergies occur later in life.

I am watching with interest: Chibbs has just started sneezing in odd bouts with no discharge :roll:
 
mismatchbunnies said:
Just a little update (at almost 2am haha). Over the afternoon/evening male bunny seemed to get worse (sneezing a lot more) so we ended up taking both bunnies to the emergency vet. Both were checked and nothing major was picked up (both lungs sounded clear, gut movement, no teeth issues supposedly even though the female had small spurs last time?! Don’t know how that happened unless he missed it). But anyways, the vet thought the male was indeed a case of snuffles, and with what we’d described of the female (despite no/little discharge), he has put them both on baytril to see if it helps and we will possibly go back to get swabs of the discharge to be tested if things don’t improve/it continues. The vet honestly seemed really knowledgable, he was attentive to my concerns about the possibility of either or both bunnies being resistant to baytril, and with the female’s history of GI stasis, he said it would be unlikely to cause problems (hopefully) and I could look into getting a probiotic if it seemed necessary. We will most likely either go back Thursday or Monday to get swabs if the male is still getting discharge, or either buns don’t improve. We’ll just have to take it by ear and see what happens.
Click to expand...

Just a word of caution re nasal swabs. Unless they are deep nasal swabs (usually requiring the Rabbit to be sedated) they often prove to be unhelpful. The core of infection is often deep within the nares and just a swab of the mucus and/or slightly into the nostril may just come back as 'no bacterial growth'. Also, any results will obviously be effected if the Rabbit(s) are already on abx.

IME Trimethoprim / Sulfamethoxazole (Sulphatrim) is more effective for treating Snuffles than Baytril.

https://www.noahcompendium.co.uk/?id=-460756&fromsearch=true#iosfirsthighlight
 
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