Using a dog crate to bond?

Hi

I'm going to attempt bonding my rabbits together (male and female). Is it ok to use a large dog crate and leave them in it for a few days before adding a small pen? Eventually they'll be in a large pen and crate/free range depending on how destructive they prove to be haha. They're used to quite a bit of space so I'm worried it's too cruel to use the crate for the bond? I'd also be removing toys and anything they could get territorial over so don't want them to be incredibly bored and depressed [emoji51]

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I have used a dog crate to bond before - they are an easy option for a neutral space, and easy to extend as the bond develops.

A lot of people use dog crates for bonding successfully. I would always put the male in first.

Hi, I’ve just recently bonded my male and female pair but I didn’t use a dog crate, and to be completely honest I wouldn’t recommend it if they are going to be housed in it 24/7 for however many days it takes to bond. I don’t think that it would be fair to confine them to such a small space, especially with a new rabbit, when they are used to a much larger space. Also, the confinement and lack of stimulation may also lead to frustration which could be taken out on the other bunny. Rabbits need lots of space to express their energy. As well as this, rabbits should be given the opportunity to have a safe space (eg: hidey-house) to go to in the event that they become scared; a small dog cage used when bonding would not allow this (you should be able to see the bunnies at all times when bonding). Not to mention that you would have to consider whether or not the crate provides easy access in the event that one bunny attacks the other as delayed intervention to break up the fight could lead to serious injury. I’m not saying don’t use the crate at all, and I would actually recommend using it in the early stages of bonding (if easily accessible due to the reasons I mentioned above) as it is a neutral small space which may prove useful for bonding. However, I definitely wouldn’t advice leaving them in it for anything more than a few hours at a time like I said without any extension to the area (eg: x-pen added etc once fighting is minimal/non-existent). Hope your bond works out well!

I think a dog crate is fine for space for early bonding but I find a puppy pen much better as you can intervene much more easily if there are any issues. I have used both :thumb:

I would have used the dog crate if I wasn't so confident when I brought Lopsy and Chibbs home, but I agree with Zoobec it's hard to intervene!

Thanks everyone. Now rethinking the dog crate idea because of the access issue. Didn't really consider that. If I use a pen instead would it be ok to take down their current set up and put a bonding pen up in its place? Or will that mean it's not neutral enough? I'd put matts down instead of the carpet that's there now and no litter tray/toys etc. Or is it better to set it up in a completely different area of the flat? Just trying to find some space! Maybe I'll get one of those pop up pet pens, has anyone tried those for bonding?

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Nic. said:

Thanks everyone. Now rethinking the dog crate idea because of the access issue. Didn't really consider that. If I use a pen instead would it be ok to take down their current set up and put a bonding pen up in its place? Or will that mean it's not neutral enough? I'd put matts down instead of the carpet that's there now and no litter tray/toys etc. Or is it better to set it up in a completely different area of the flat? Just trying to find some space! Maybe I'll get one of those pop up pet pens, has anyone tried those for bonding?

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I think you’ve made the right decision; an x-pen would definitely be a better option. As for setting it up in the same place, I wouldn't recommend it, but I’m not saying it couldn’t work either if the area is cleaned properly (although you probably won’t be able to remove all scents from the area). Also I guess it would depend on how observant your bunny is about their surroundings as many rabbits will be able to tell if it is their area even without their usual toys/litter tray etc. I personally would set them up in a different place altogether if you can as it should hopefully reduce the amount of territorial behaviour and make it easier for the bond to form initially. However, once you feel the bond is strong enough then you may want to move the pen into the original bunny’s set up (still with neutral blankets and other items etc) in order to gradually introduce the new area where they will be living, but only do this once you feel the bond is secure enough. Hope it helps!

mismatchbunnies said:

I think you’ve made the right decision; an x-pen would definitely be a better option. As for setting it up in the same place, I wouldn't recommend it, but I’m not saying it couldn’t work either if the area is cleaned properly (although you probably won’t be able to remove all scents from the area). Also I guess it would depend on how observant your bunny is about their surroundings as many rabbits will be able to tell if it is their area even without their usual toys/litter tray etc. I personally would set them up in a different place altogether if you can as it should hopefully reduce the amount of territorial behaviour and make it easier for the bond to form initially. However, once you feel the bond is strong enough then you may want to move the pen into the original bunny’s set up (still with neutral blankets and other items etc) in order to gradually introduce the new area where they will be living, but only do this once you feel the bond is secure enough. Hope it helps!

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This is what I did, set up the pen in a room where no bun had been before, then expanded the space gradually and then moved them into the cleaned and neutralised bunny room where Frosty had lived previously, in the bonding pen set up in the room, before finally giving them the whole room and gradually more furniture.

Thank you for the advice everyone. I've started the bond in a pen in my bedroom. To start off with my boy (white) was obsessively grooming my girl but he doesn't do it on demand. She seems a bit annoyed by him and has bitten him (lightly) and tried to chase him away a couple of times. They're now sitting apart pretending eachother don't exist haha. I tried 2 hours last night but I was anxious about leaving them together over night and it's been about 90 minutes today. Might have to split up again tomorrow evening as I'll have to leave the house then but I'll see how it goes. This is very nerve wrecking! Managed to bond a trio in the past but think I just have been lucky as I just placed them in the bath tub for half an hour and then put them all back in one pen haha

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They seem very relaxed in that photo - do they eat the hay together or some pellets?

tonibun said:

They seem very relaxed in that photo - do they eat the hay together or some pellets?

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They ate some readigrass together. My girl is being quite territorial and will bite my boy if he tries to come to what she has decided is her side of the pen. Had to put in an extra water bowl as she wouldn't let him drink either. She pulled some fur from his nose and now he has a little bald patch. He now seems quite frightened of her, should I abandon the bonding for today and keep doing sessions do you think? Or persevere? He seems happy to let her be in charge but I don't think she realises she's won the dominance battle and will bite/chase him every now and again

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Persevering for now and it slow progress I think.

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Is the space neutral to the female and is the male the rabbit who had stasis for a month?

tonibun said:

Is the space neutral to the female and is the male the rabbit who had stasis for a month?

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yes space is neutral for both and yes it was my boy with stasis. Fully recovered now after a dental but they've both been unwell with infections, she just handled it alot better. Feel like it's very up and down so far today. My girl will attack my boy (chasing him/biting/fur pulling) and then be fine for hours and lie/eat next to him and ask to be groomed. He's pretty much ignoring her now, he's stopped grooming her & following her around the pen which he was doing at first. He never retaliates if she tries to bite him but I've been stopping that as soon as I see it incase it leads to a big fight. In general he doesn't seem very stressed, he's been lying down & eating hay all day etc. Seems a bit upset whenever she has a go at him but that has only happened about 3 times in 6 hours. Can't decide whether to leave them together over night. I'll be in the same room but worried I won't wake up quick enough!

Frosty used to chase and fur pull his brother Snowflake during bonding but eventually they worked it out. I kept them together in a pen in my bedroom (bonded 4 the boys and 2 bonded sisters).

Here is bonding thread http://forums.rabbitrehome.org.uk/s...now-a-quad-More-pics!&highlight=Bonding+begun

Looking OK so far, good luck and best wishes for it continuing in the right direction

Do I see another rabbit in the photo? Could he be disturbing the 2 you are bonding?

tonibun said:

Do I see another rabbit in the photo? Could he be disturbing the 2 you are bonding?

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No, there's only 2. Think that's my slipper haha. I separated them again over night as Mary started chasing Fred right as I was about to go to sleep but I'll put them back in the bonding pen today. Sure they'll get there eventually, I did see some progress as the day went on

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Your bonding sounds like it’s going fairly well in my opinion, especially considering how little time they’ve been together. The only thing I’d say is remember to never end a bonding session on a bad note. For example, if one bunny bites the other, don’t immediately separate them as them the bunny who bit the other one could see separating them from the other as a reward and it may reinforce it to bite again. Always end a bonding session on a good note (eg: putting the bunnies next to each other and stroking them or giving them both a treat as this helps them associate the other bunny with good things). Also, if a serious fight ever does break out, consider a small amount of stress bonding (eg: short car journey) as this encourages the bunnies to find comfort in one another and can reduce fighting by finding common ground. Hope it helps!