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Thread: Head tilt returned badly after going away. Starting to get scared..

  1. #11

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    Hey all, sorry for a late reply. Thank you all so much for your replies. Shimmer and Jane, thank you so much for the advice, positive experience and link. They've all been very helpful. I've been looking at the information in the link you sent Jane, it's very informative and very helpful. Thank you. And thank you Shimmer for sharing your experience, it's nice to know there's still hope.
    Harley is booked in with the exotics specialist again tomorrow. Sadly there's been no improvement at the moment.
    It's a very hard situation because in his pen he's managing okay. He has the odd stumble but he's generally quite happy and playful. He was binkying as best he could a lot yesterday, the poor boy. He's such a fighter. Had a few head flicks and small binky-attempts today too.
    What's hard is giving him his meds, he rolls uncontrolably now and his whole body is twisted almost to the point of breaking. It's terrifying and heartbreaking to see. He gets into an unending cycle and the only thing you can do is try to intercept a roll and stabilize him. It's absolutely awful.
    I'm terrified of him breaking a leg or his back with his own force as he twists so badly. Weirdly he only does this out of his pen, once he's back in he may roll once but finds it relatively easy to right himself after that.
    The only way to give him meds is to 'burrito' him with a towel but even that is hard the way he twists and rolls.
    Seeing him like that makes you second guess yourself, but then for the rest of the day he's happy and playful and eats well (though the last two days he's not been as greedy as usual which is concerning). It's so confusing and so, so hard to do what's right for him.
    I don't want to be selfish, I don't want him to suffer if there's no hope of recovery. But he still seems to be fighting, I don't want to give up on him. He's so young.
    It's an impossible position and trying to know what the right thing is is so hard.
    I'm almost 100% certain they will do (or book him in for) an x-ray tomorrow and even that is terrifying, not just because of the sedative anymore but I seem to be the only one who can somewhat 'control' his twisting. I'm scared the vets/nurses won't fully understand just how out of control he can get when he's picked up. He could so easily break his own back. I'm so terrified of something happening to him.

    Sorry to ramble on. It's been a difficult day and he had a bad fall earlier as he launched himself from my Mum's arms. It's the hardest thing imaginable to see him like that.
    He's the sweetest boy with such a strong personality. He's one of the toughest bunnies I've known. I just wish I could do something to help him when he rolls as he gets so distressed

  2. #12
    Wise Old Thumper Jack's-Jane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ~ILoveMyBunny~ View Post
    Hey all, sorry for a late reply. Thank you all so much for your replies. Shimmer and Jane, thank you so much for the advice, positive experience and link. They've all been very helpful. I've been looking at the information in the link you sent Jane, it's very informative and very helpful. Thank you. And thank you Shimmer for sharing your experience, it's nice to know there's still hope.
    Harley is booked in with the exotics specialist again tomorrow. Sadly there's been no improvement at the moment.
    It's a very hard situation because in his pen he's managing okay. He has the odd stumble but he's generally quite happy and playful. He was binkying as best he could a lot yesterday, the poor boy. He's such a fighter. Had a few head flicks and small binky-attempts today too.
    What's hard is giving him his meds, he rolls uncontrolably now and his whole body is twisted almost to the point of breaking. It's terrifying and heartbreaking to see. He gets into an unending cycle and the only thing you can do is try to intercept a roll and stabilize him. It's absolutely awful.
    I'm terrified of him breaking a leg or his back with his own force as he twists so badly. Weirdly he only does this out of his pen, once he's back in he may roll once but finds it relatively easy to right himself after that.
    The only way to give him meds is to 'burrito' him with a towel but even that is hard the way he twists and rolls.
    Seeing him like that makes you second guess yourself, but then for the rest of the day he's happy and playful and eats well (though the last two days he's not been as greedy as usual which is concerning). It's so confusing and so, so hard to do what's right for him.
    I don't want to be selfish, I don't want him to suffer if there's no hope of recovery. But he still seems to be fighting, I don't want to give up on him. He's so young.
    It's an impossible position and trying to know what the right thing is is so hard.
    I'm almost 100% certain they will do (or book him in for) an x-ray tomorrow and even that is terrifying, not just because of the sedative anymore but I seem to be the only one who can somewhat 'control' his twisting. I'm scared the vets/nurses won't fully understand just how out of control he can get when he's picked up. He could so easily break his own back. I'm so terrified of something happening to him.

    Sorry to ramble on. It's been a difficult day and he had a bad fall earlier as he launched himself from my Mum's arms. It's the hardest thing imaginable to see him like that.
    He's the sweetest boy with such a strong personality. He's one of the toughest bunnies I've known. I just wish I could do something to help him when he rolls as he gets so distressed
    Firstly, he is still in the very early days of his illness. The rolling episodes can continue for WEEKS. They are almost always worse when Bunny is out of his usual environment or stressed in any way (by being picked up for example). Sometimes it helps if you cover Bunny's eyes as you carry him. BUT the episodes can eventually fully resolve. There is no guarantee and not all Rabbits have the psychological strength to cope -eg they will stop eating.

    For some cases it is 'right' to keep going with aggressive treatment for the many weeks it can take to see some improvement, for others it is 'right' to let them go very early on.

    Can you take a video of him during a 'good' episode when he's in his pen, moving about, eating etc. The Vet will only get part of the picture from seeing him at the surgery as he will be stressed and far more likely to roll etc. Also, explain fully to the Vet that anyone who handles him needs to be mindful of the fact that it'll set him in a spin and that he will need the utmost care when being picked up.

    As you are seeing an Exotics Vet hopefully he/she will be well aware of the additional precautions that will be needed whilst Harley is with them, personally I would expect a VN/ Nursing Assistant to be with him at all times

    Sending millions of vibes for him today xx


    Links to information about various health problems that can affect Rabbits :
    http://forums.rabbitrehome.org.uk/sh...ealth-Problems
    NB- If you think your Rabbit is unwell it is essential to seek immediate veterinary attention.

  3. #13
    Alpha Buck Orenoko's Avatar
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    Agree with everything Jack's-Jane said, head tilt can be a long road to recovery and sometimes they get worse before they get better. Definitely try to get a video of him when he's at his best as it's helpful for the vet to see, my boy used to literally play dead at the vets so I has to prove what he was really like as they initially thought he was like that all the time. With his meds, have you tried mixing them with some baby food and giving them that way? Some rabbits like it and it can be a much less painful experience for everyone if you can persuade him to take it that way. Sending lots of vibes for you and Harley, I know how traumatic it can be seeing a bun when they're in the grips of head tilt and can't stop rolling, it can get better or be controlled with the right treatment xx

    Sent from my G3121 using Tapatalk
    Mum to Lilac, an extremely spoiled mini lop

  4. #14

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    Thank you both, I read your replies on the way to the vet this morning and it was encouraging as the last day or so has been challenging. I certainly did not want to give up on Harley buts seeing him like that was making me second guess myself.
    Unfortunately I wasn't able to get video before hand as I read the replies too late but I will keep that in mind for next time if there's no improvement. It's a brilliant idea.
    The vet was as always amazing, he's done an x-ray which isn't showing any problems and a blood test. The bloods should take about 10 days to come back so we may have a 'confirmation' (as far as is possible) that it's (likely) EC then and a recheck in two weeks.
    Harley's doing amazing considering all he's been through. While in the queue to pay I saw him munching on a fibafirst (having not long come around from sedation!) and that gave me a lot of hope because I can see how determinted this little bun is. He's such a fighter.
    I'd brought some treats up with me which he had on the way home (dandelion, grass, a blackberry etc - he had all except the flower of the dandelion!)
    He's continued to eat since he got in, mostly hay but he took a blueberry from me too.
    If anyone's going to be able to beat this then it's him. He's such a strong boy.
    I guess it's just a matter of waiting now and continuing meds.
    Does anyone have any tips with rolling or am I already doing everything I can to stop it? I burrito him tight but he still rolls when I release him or before I can even wrap it. He doesn't roll in his pen and gets around fairly okay in there.
    I feel so fortunate that we have such amazing vets and such amazing exotics specialists. They're truly wonderful and I have full confidence they're doing everything possible for him. I can't imagine where we'd be now if not for them - as well as the support and help of everyone on here!

    Edit: Oh, regarding mixing with baby food yes, I've done it with banana and apple puree. He knows.
    They always know

  5. #15
    Wise Old Thumper Jack's-Jane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ~ILoveMyBunny~ View Post
    Thank you both, I read your replies on the way to the vet this morning and it was encouraging as the last day or so has been challenging. I certainly did not want to give up on Harley buts seeing him like that was making me second guess myself.
    Unfortunately I wasn't able to get video before hand as I read the replies too late but I will keep that in mind for next time if there's no improvement. It's a brilliant idea.
    The vet was as always amazing, he's done an x-ray which isn't showing any problems and a blood test. The bloods should take about 10 days to come back so we may have a 'confirmation' (as far as is possible) that it's (likely) EC then and a recheck in two weeks.
    Harley's doing amazing considering all he's been through. While in the queue to pay I saw him munching on a fibafirst (having not long come around from sedation!) and that gave me a lot of hope because I can see how determinted this little bun is. He's such a fighter.
    I'd brought some treats up with me which he had on the way home (dandelion, grass, a blackberry etc - he had all except the flower of the dandelion!)
    He's continued to eat since he got in, mostly hay but he took a blueberry from me too.
    If anyone's going to be able to beat this then it's him. He's such a strong boy.
    I guess it's just a matter of waiting now and continuing meds.
    Does anyone have any tips with rolling or am I already doing everything I can to stop it? I burrito him tight but he still rolls when I release him or before I can even wrap it. He doesn't roll in his pen and gets around fairly okay in there.
    I feel so fortunate that we have such amazing vets and such amazing exotics specialists. They're truly wonderful and I have full confidence they're doing everything possible for him. I can't imagine where we'd be now if not for them - as well as the support and help of everyone on here!

    Edit: Oh, regarding mixing with baby food yes, I've done it with banana and apple puree. He knows.
    They always know
    It sounds as though it is EC then and whilst he may never fully recover there is every chance that the severe symptoms he is currently exhibiting will resolve.

    With regards to his rolling when you have to medicate him. Can you devise a way to do it whilst he is still on the ground in his pen. Avoiding picking him up and removing him from his 'home' may reduce the stress and consequently reduce the rolling.

    This video may give you a few tips

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qfROVhKTMxI


    Links to information about various health problems that can affect Rabbits :
    http://forums.rabbitrehome.org.uk/sh...ealth-Problems
    NB- If you think your Rabbit is unwell it is essential to seek immediate veterinary attention.

  6. #16
    Alpha Buck Orenoko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ~ILoveMyBunny~ View Post
    Thank you both, I read your replies on the way to the vet this morning and it was encouraging as the last day or so has been challenging. I certainly did not want to give up on Harley buts seeing him like that was making me second guess myself.
    Unfortunately I wasn't able to get video before hand as I read the replies too late but I will keep that in mind for next time if there's no improvement. It's a brilliant idea.
    The vet was as always amazing, he's done an x-ray which isn't showing any problems and a blood test. The bloods should take about 10 days to come back so we may have a 'confirmation' (as far as is possible) that it's (likely) EC then and a recheck in two weeks.
    Harley's doing amazing considering all he's been through. While in the queue to pay I saw him munching on a fibafirst (having not long come around from sedation!) and that gave me a lot of hope because I can see how determinted this little bun is. He's such a fighter.
    I'd brought some treats up with me which he had on the way home (dandelion, grass, a blackberry etc - he had all except the flower of the dandelion!)
    He's continued to eat since he got in, mostly hay but he took a blueberry from me too.
    If anyone's going to be able to beat this then it's him. He's such a strong boy.
    I guess it's just a matter of waiting now and continuing meds.
    Does anyone have any tips with rolling or am I already doing everything I can to stop it? I burrito him tight but he still rolls when I release him or before I can even wrap it. He doesn't roll in his pen and gets around fairly okay in there.
    I feel so fortunate that we have such amazing vets and such amazing exotics specialists. They're truly wonderful and I have full confidence they're doing everything possible for him. I can't imagine where we'd be now if not for them - as well as the support and help of everyone on here!

    Edit: Oh, regarding mixing with baby food yes, I've done it with banana and apple puree. He knows.
    They always know
    Sounds like he's determined to fight this! One thing I read when dealing with head tilt was that we humans tend to find it more distressing than the rabbits themselves do. I don't know how true that is but I guess they do live in the present and all he knows is that his world is a little bit wonky right now.

    In terms of trying to avoid the rolling when you put him down, I used to kneel on the floor and put my boy between my knees when I put him down so that he could find his feet safely. I'd also keep both hands on him until I was sure he was ok. Didn't always work as sometimes he would wriggle free and then roll but worth a try. I would avoid carrying him as much as possible, but when I did have to, I'd make sure his upward facing eye was away from me so he had a better idea of where he was (if that makes sense).

    Sent from my G3121 using Tapatalk
    Mum to Lilac, an extremely spoiled mini lop

  7. #17
    Moderator Zoobec's Avatar
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    Iíve not had experience of an EC bunny but you and your vets are doing everything possible for him sending lots of vibes. For mixing meds with food, they always seem to suss it out when mixed with banana but I experimented with baby foods and Iíve found Frosty loves the apple carrot and parsnip Aldi mamia pouch baby food and will eat some medsí mixed in that.

    Binky free at the bridge Boots, you will never be forgotten xxxx

  8. #18
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    Can't add anymore advice, as I've no experience of EC, but just wanted to send lots of vibes for Harley, he certainly is a little fighter bless him xxx
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  9. #19
    Warren Scout Zigzag's Avatar
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    My first bunny had EC, and it was a hard experience, as many others have mentioned. Sending you lots of love, as I know how challenging it is. Youíve got some v good advice on this thread. Iíd also say all your anxieties and worries are very normal x
    Last edited by Zigzag; 13-08-2019 at 10:07 PM.

  10. #20
    Warren Veteran keletkezes's Avatar
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    Some of us have had success with even the dreaded baytril on a fenugreek crunchie, so if the meds will work on those it might be worth a try! Best wishes xx
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