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Cats and kites

MaxAndMolly

Young Bun
Hi. Advice please on risk from predators.

Our two have been with us for three years now. We try to give them free runs in the garden at least once a day, for as long as we can semi-supervise them. But in the last couple of months we seem to have gained two cats in the neighbourhood who are showing too much interest in them. Both have shown signs of actively stalking them. We’ve had to chase them away a fair few times. Twice we’ve caught one of them sitting on the run / hutch when they’re locked away, just watching them up close. And when they’re out, sadly our two are too tame and trusting to seem that bothered. They go ‘on alert’ a bit. But we’ve found them sitting as little as 8 feet from one of the cats at least twice.

Now, as if the cats weren’t enough, red kites seem to have reached Guildford, and one was swooping over our garden for an hour yesterday. Again, the rabbits seemed unaware, and I had to put them away. (The kite was completely unbothered by our presence, staying close overhead even when we all went out).

We already know that we can’t take risks. However, the rabbits have to continue to have free runs, even if they have to be more closely supervised. So, I guess, the only real question is, in those moments when our backs are turned, how much of a risk does the RU Community think either cats or kites actually are to rabbits? Are they in daily mortal danger, or would it be a rare occurrence for either predator to actually strike? Also, even though we see Max and Molly as horribly tame and unstreetwise, would they prove to be faster to run / better equipped to defend themselves than we assume?

All advice and insights welcome.

Thanks,
Family of Max and Molly
 
Red Kites are little if no trouble to pets, and pretty special to have around!

Because they are known as 'birds of prey', they automatically get cast into the same pot as eagles, which will take lambs, sparrowhawks, that take down small birds and peregrines, who are just brutal! However, if you look at the physical build of the kites, they're not a threat to rabbit sized creatures :) They have small feet, and a weak beak, which means trying to take down a larger small animal would be a complete waste of time and energy for them, hence why they are known as carrion feeders. They thrive around areas with lots of roadkill (generally A-roads), as they just eat what they can find out in the countryside. Our red kite circles our streets everyday, and we've never had a problem. They're not usually very brave either.

Like I said, they're really special, they've had a rough time in the UK and their presence now is amazing! Take some time to observe them, they are beautiful to watch.

As for cats, we've had them come into the garden when rabbits are freeranging, and generally we've scared them off by being there. On more than one occasion, Sonic has scared them off himself :lol: I would say that if you're around, they're fine, but others may have had a different experience.

Hope this helps!
 
Thank you - very helpful.

I do love red kites. And raptors generally. I was just going off them hanging around near the rabbits. So I’m definitely reassured by what you say.

Still bothered by the cats. On balance, I think they probably won’t pounce. But I know if they do, a bite or a scratch and the shock could be enough to be fatal. We’ll just have to supervise more closely, which means they’ll get less free running. (I’ll also get a high powered water pistol for cat deterrence purposes.
 
No problem :) We live near the Yorkshire reintroduction site, so we've had them for years. It's almost as if they come over and say "yep, still alive, we'll try again tomorrow" :lol:

I think a water pistol is a good idea. I do wish cats wouldn't wander into random gardens, but they can't help it!
 
We were told by Harewood House staff (where Kites were re-introduced from) that red Kites are carrion feeders. I would be more worried about other birds of prey, although Kites are probably not totally without risk. I would assume that where conditions are right for one type, they would be OK for other birds of prey to exist.

Cats can definitely be an issue - but it depends on the cat. Many are content to sit and watch rabbits, or just sunbathe on top of a hutch / run. Some will hunt rabbits. All are capable of inflicting nasty wounds with a casual swipe of a paw. I have found the best deterrents to be: a resident cat to see off all visiting ones; a rabbit that doesn't like cats (very funny to watch and very efficient at keeping all cats away); a super-soaker water pistol ready and loaded by the front door.

If you can't supervise the rabbits all the time, they really need to be protected from predators. I have some larger, less formal bunny areas that have a fine nylon mesh (fruit cage type) covering them for when I am around but not constantly watching the garden. It isn't totally cat proof, but gives some security from casual predators, including birds of prey. Otherwise, the rabbits are in a proper weldmesh enclosed run.
 
I (personally) wouldn’t leave a free ranging rabbit outside even for a few seconds, because the threat from cats etc is too great in my opinion. You don’t know what the cat would do if you weren’t there to oversee them.
 
I concur with the above - your buns are more likely to be in danger from the cats than the kites. We have raptors here as well but only in the form of Sparrowhawks and in fact one day one attacked a group of birds directly above (as in about 2ft) the rabbits' heads - the girls didn't even flinch :lol:.

The cats however, I wouldn't trust an inch. We have one particular cat which I think is more interested in the birds but does know about the girls though shows little interest. One day I'd let the girls out, Thumper shot out the shed but Coco remained snuggled in the hay. I fussed Coco for a good minute before popping back out to see where Thumper was. She was frozen - the cat was about 3ft in front of her, hiding underneath a metal shelf in the girls' favourite corner, which my son had made :shock:. Without panicking I got between her and the cat - who was still I think more interested in the birds - and then stamped my foot. The cat shot off over the fence, and the rabbit shot off towards the shed (but didn't go in it because she's dumb). Since then we have moved the shelf as the cat hid under it so the birds couldn't see it. But Thumper wouldn't go back into that corner until Coco came out and went in it, completely oblivious to the fact a cat had just been there. I'm not sure if Ollie (cat) would have gone for the rabbits as I'm fairly sure he's more into birds, but I'll never take that chance.

One day, Connor (17yr old son) found Ollie in the garden, managed to catch up with him and smack him, the cat shot off over the fence which is about 4ft high, but he hadn't reckoned on Connor vaulting the fence after him, chasing him through next door's garden, out the gate and halfway up the grove :lol:. He got such a shock we didn't see him for at least a week :lol:. He now only has to hear the key turn in our back door and he's gone :lol:. Ruddy cat! I don't think he's ever caught one of the birds either but he frightens them all away :(.
 
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Cats are definitely the biggest risk.

I once left the girls alone in the garden while I cleaned their room. I just kept popping my head out each window that looked into the back garden to check for cats.

Just as well I did as about half way through there was a cat who was only 6 or 7 ft away from the buns. Needless to say I tore down the stairs, into the garden hissing at the cat.
Scared the life out of the buns but thankfully also out of the cat who tore off and hasn't been seen since. I now ensure one of us is always with them.

Foxes are also a big concern. They hunt during the day and they will attack even with humans in the garden. So ensure you're fully prepared for anything like that to happen as you'll struggle to forgive yourself.

Me and OH have the belief of quality over quantity, so as long as they girls have a very happy life we can forgive if it's not an incredibly long one.

Sent from my SM-G903F using Tapatalk
 
Thank you for all the advice. We’ll up the cat watching patrols. I have been known to chase the cats down the garden at speed, looking faintly ridiculous. Unfortunately I’m not up to vaulting fences. I have chased them further than they expect. But not enough to stop them coming back.

I’ll just go back to admiring the kite.

Thanks again.
 
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