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Bunny moving head up and down (not eye movement)

In last consultation vet looked at eyes teeth and ears and listened to guts and all were normal. We are now on day 3 of medication and she's happy as Larry eating and climbing. The head bobbing started on the Monday and we went to the vet on Friday. It started after I had been away over night. She has no balance issues. It's really strange as everything else is totally normal. The vet said she wanted to see her back on wed or Thurs if no improvement I think there could be slight improvement but hard to measure as she's totally normal aside from the Bob. I'm reluctant to put her through sedation to go through an x-ray as she seems happy and normal and this could stress her out and also be costly
 
bunny mummy 1 said:
I've noticed it happens more when she doesn't recognise where she's going or there is something unusual on the floor
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From what you've said here I would guess it may be connected with her eyesight. However, the video seemed to indicate either neurological or ear infection.
 
Bunny update: back to the vet yesterday. Didn't tell us much. Gave us another weeks antibiotics and stemetil and said if no improvement by early next week then they want to X-ray the skull and test for EC. Vet won't treat for EC without test as it suppresses immune system and if it's not EC can make other things worse
 
bunny mummy 1 said:
Bunny update: back to the vet yesterday. Didn't tell us much. Gave us another weeks antibiotics and stemetil and said if no improvement by early next week then they want to X-ray the skull and test for EC. Vet won't treat for EC without test as it suppresses immune system and if it's not EC can make other things worse
Click to expand...


OK understood. I think another week on abx may not show massive improvement, but hope you're happy with what your vet's doing.
 
bunny mummy 1 said:
Bunny update: back to the vet yesterday. Didn't tell us much. Gave us another weeks antibiotics and stemetil and said if no improvement by early next week then they want to X-ray the skull and test for EC. Vet won't treat for EC without test as it suppresses immune system and if it's not EC can make other things worse
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Did the Vet make any mention of the possibility of the symptoms being associated with a loss of vision, as I mentioned in an earlier post ?

Jack's-Jane said:
If you do not see any improvement over the next few days then I would take her back to the Vet. Did the Vet actually examine her eyes at the last consultation, you do not mention it in your post about the consultation ?

There are certain conditions that can have an effect on a Rabbit's eyesight. Vertical head bobbing can indicate a degree of loss of vision.

https://www.vin.com/apputil/content...34757&id=5328324&ind=432&objTypeID=17&print=1

https://books.google.co.uk/books?id...TMAc#v=onepage&q=rabbit ophthalmology&f=false

http://wildpro.twycrosszoo.org/S/00dis/Parasitic/Encephalitozoonosis.htm
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Jack's-Jane said:
Did the Vet make any mention of the possibility of the symptoms being associated with a loss of vision, as I mentioned in an earlier post ?
Click to expand...

No the vet looked in her eyes and said they looked normal nothing she could see. Someone Elsey mentioned treating for EC and this is something I'm tempted to do although the vet didn't want to without a £120 test to see if she has EC and a £95 x-ray of her head. I personally feel it's a waste of money but from the outside their is nothing physically won't with her so don't know what other options I have
 
bunny mummy 1 said:
No the vet looked in her eyes and said they looked normal nothing she could see. Someone Elsey mentioned treating for EC and this is something I'm tempted to do although the vet didn't want to without a £120 test to see if she has EC and a £95 x-ray of her head. I personally feel it's a waste of money but from the outside their is nothing physically won't with her so don't know what other options I have
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Change your vet? Second opinion? :)

I think treating with Panacur could be a precaution that some vets might find worthwhile.

Regard the eyes ... it's really really difficult to establish blindness in a rabbit, let alone impaired vision. As I mentioned to you (having seen your videos) I could suspect a visual problem, but the bobbing to me would indicate something other/as well as that.
 
bunny mummy 1 said:
No the vet looked in her eyes and said they looked normal nothing she could see. Someone Elsey mentioned treating for EC and this is something I'm tempted to do although the vet didn't want to without a £120 test to see if she has EC and a £95 x-ray of her head. I personally feel it's a waste of money but from the outside their is nothing physically won't with her so don't know what other options I have
Click to expand...

Perhaps you could seek a second opinion from another Vet. Are you anywhere near here :

http://ashleigh-veterinary-centre.com/

If so, Aidan Rafferty is great

To be honest I do not think that giving Panacur will bring about a 'cure' to the head bobbing. But some Vets may decide to prescribe it to cover for other potential damage that EC can do, should EC be involved.
 
Hi:wave: I'm so sorry That Bailey is head bobbing.
I agree fully with MM that we must be 101% sure that there is no type of infection going on here. I also completely trust her experience to comment on your video.

I just want to add that head bobbing isn't always caused by various infections or poor eyesight. (REW rabbits are classic)
My very nervous snuffles rabbit, Benjie, used to head bob to something new, or even a shadow when his snuffles flared up - lost his sense of smell (Smell is the major way they recognise things - predators & indeed us as individuals)
There was nothing wrong with his eyesight. He was trying to get more binocular vision than is the norm for rabbits to compensate for his loss of smell.
At the bottom of the list your rabbit might be doing head bobbing to compensate for some loss of hearing after the middle ear infection.

I cannot emphasise enough how important it is to be sure that there isn't a recurrence of the original infections.
If transporting him is a big stress out - some people use lavender to calm rabbits down during transport.

EC was taken so seriously that when 1 ear grew minimally larger than the other & lopped he had a course of panacure in case it was the early sign of EC
He also had the full range of tests for middle ear infection (recognised complication of snuffles) etc when he started head bobbing.
We only concluded the cause of his head bobbing after all Ix were negative - still watched very closely, but there was no further deterioration.
 
Last edited:
thumps_ said:
Hi:wave: I'm so sorry That Bailey is head bobbing.
I agree fully with MM that we must be 101% sure that there is no type of infection going on here. I also completely trust her experience to comment on your video.

I just want to add that head bobbing isn't always caused by various infections or poor eyesight. (REW rabbits are classic)
My very nervous snuffles rabbit, Benjie, used to head bob to something new, or even a shadow when his snuffles flared up - lost his sense of smell (Smell is the major way they recognise things - predators & indeed us as individuals)
There was nothing wrong with his eyesight. He was trying to get more binocular vision than is the norm for rabbits to compensate for his loss of smell.
At the bottom of the list your rabbit might be doing head bobbing to compensate for some loss of hearing after the middle ear infection.

I cannot emphasise enough how important it is to be sure that there isn't a recurrence of the original infections.
If transporting him is a big stress out - some people use lavender to calm rabbits down during transport.

EC was taken so seriously that when 1 ear grew minimally larger than the other & lopped he had a course of panacure in case it was the early sign of EC
He also had the full range of tests for middle ear infection (recognised complication of snuffles) etc when he started head bobbing.
We only concluded the cause of his head bobbing after all Ix were negative - still watched very closely, but there was no further deterioration.
Click to expand...



Thanks Thumps, it's good to have your valuable input :)

Having corresponded with bunnymummy privately I suggested in my above post getting a second opinion, but of course there's always the cost of another vet visit, starting from scratch and wondering where it's all going. There was improvement previously with abx and I hope there will be again - you are right, infection must be eradicated.

However, I found your point about head bobbing to compensate for loss of hearing really interesting, and having seen what the rabbit does, there's that possibility also. Thank you.

I hope the abx help the situation - my concern was that they would be given for long enough.
 
MightyMax said:
Thanks Thumps, it's good to have your valuable input :)

Having corresponded with bunnymummy privately I suggested in my above post getting a second opinion, but of course there's always the cost of another vet visit, starting from scratch and wondering where it's all going. There was improvement previously with abx and I hope there will be again - you are right, infection must be eradicated.

However, I found your point about head bobbing to compensate for loss of hearing really interesting, and having seen what the rabbit does, there's that possibility also. Thank you.

I hope the abx help the situation - my concern was that they would be given for long enough.
Click to expand...


:wave:Hi MM you are absolutely right. Middle ear infections always involve bone. They can go quiescent with a normal course of Abx but erupt again at a later point especially with a slight dip in the immune system.
 
Jack's-Jane said:
Perhaps you could seek a second opinion from another Vet. Are you anywhere near here :

http://ashleigh-veterinary-centre.com/

If so, Aidan Rafferty is great

To be honest I do not think that giving Panacur will bring about a 'cure' to the head bobbing. But some Vets may decide to prescribe it to cover for other potential damage that EC can do, should EC be involved.
Click to expand...

Ashleigh vets is where I went. Leanne is the vet I usually see here
 
thumps_ said:
:wave:Hi MM you are absolutely right. Middle ear infections always involve bone. They can go quiescent with a normal course of Abx but erupt again at a later point especially with a slight dip in the immune system.
Click to expand...

Hi thanks for your advice and agreement with MM.
Today I haven't seen bailey Bob at all. Potentially because I've been in and out and she's been left to enjoy her day with her boys. She is just as happy and cheeky as usual and seems to love the taste of metacam and stemetil. To the point where she comes up to me and begs for it so I don't even need to hold her to medicate those two as she happily hops over and takes it from the syringe. The antibiotic not so much but as it's a relatively out small amount is easy enough to scoop her and give it. I'm really reluctant to start sedating to X-ray (the vet confirmed she will be sedated for the X-ray) as I am seeing improvement. I would like to continue antibiotic and add panacur but it concerns me that the vet is so against panacur without the EC test. I don't think she would give it to me without the test
 
MightyMax said:
You're seeing a good vet, but I do understand all your concerns re X-ray etc ....

I am sorry they won't start the Panacur 'just in case' without a test, though.
Click to expand...

Me too! Not going to lie I'm tempted to just go buy some from pets at home. Bailey does seem much better I haven't seen her Bob at all lately going to let her totally free range tomorrow to check but I feel hopeful. Now just need to make sure I give antibiotics long enough so it's gone. How do you know when it's gone? The infection I mean
 
bunny mummy 1 said:
Me too! Not going to lie I'm tempted to just go buy some from pets at home. Bailey does seem much better I haven't seen her Bob at all lately going to let her totally free range tomorrow to check but I feel hopeful. Now just need to make sure I give antibiotics long enough so it's gone. How do you know when it's gone? The infection I mean
Click to expand...


Very difficult without before and after scans, and probably not 100% conclusive even then.

Some info here:

http://www.veterinarywebinars.com/m...oads/2016/03/Study_Notes_Ear_Nose_Rabbits.pdf
 
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