Boo's dental thread updated 24/6

[joey&boo]

For those of you unfamiliar with Boo's health issue. She went to the vets in Nov with a few vague symptoms (occassional sneeze, occassional quacking sound, pawed at cheek when eating twice). The key difference I guess with Boo is that she didn't have demonstrate any signs of being a dental bun - she acts completely normally & continues to eat anything & everything offered (weight maintained). On a hunch that something wasn't right she had GA, bloods & skull radiographs. Findings were 2 missing teeth (premolars) & her opposing mandible tooth had grown up & caused an ulcer. The missing teeth still had quite deep sockets. No signs of infection evident. Apart from the missing 2 teeth & the spurrred one that has nothing to grind on, her mouth & teeth look really healthy, no signs of dental disease you would normally see.

Her next GA was planned for 7 weeks later. Her tooth was burred, no soft tissue damage.

My question (WWYD) is really about how long should we leave it before her next tooth burr, given she doesn't have any of the usual ways of telling me she needs one. At the vet she doesn't help either, while most rabbit have a good chew on the ottoscope, Boo sits quietly on the table with it in her mouth, my vet isn't able to see much at all during consult.

[Jack's-Jane]

For those of you unfamiliar with Boo's health issue. She went to the vets in Nov with a few vague symptoms (occassional sneeze, occassional quacking sound, pawed at cheek when eating twice). The key difference I guess with Boo is that she didn't have demonstrate any signs of being a dental bun - she acts completely normally & continues to eat anything & everything offered (weight maintained). On a hunch that something wasn't right she had GA, bloods & skull radiographs. Findings were 2 missing teeth (premolars) & her opposing mandible tooth had grown up & caused an ulcer. The missing teeth still had quite deep sockets. No signs of infection evident. Apart from the missing 2 teeth & the spurrred one that has nothing to grind on, her mouth & teeth look really healthy, no signs of dental disease you would normally see.

Her next GA was planned for 7 weeks later. Her tooth was burred, no soft tissue damage.

My question (WWYD) is really about how long should we leave it before her next tooth burr, given she doesn't have any of the usual ways of telling me she needs one. At the vet she doesn't help either, while most rabbit have a good chew on the ottoscope, Boo sits quietly on the table with it in her mouth, my vet isn't able to see much at all during consult.

Do you monitor her weight regularly (a couple of times a week) at home ? This can sometimes help to establish if the Rabbit is actually eating less than may be apparent. A Dental Rabbit in need of a Dental may take longer to chew food so they may well look to be eating a lot of the time, but in fact they are not ingesting as much Also, it gives the opportunity for any Rabbit(s) they live with to scoff more than their fair share. So unless we sit and monitor the Dental Rabbit 24/7 it can be difficult to establish if/when the amount of food they ingest is reducing. Hence my suggestion of regular weigh-ins.

Poo size/quantity can also be an indicator as this can become smaller/less. Some Dental Rabbits will start to drink more water when a tooth burr is needed.

[joey&boo]

Do you monitor her weight regularly (a couple of times a week) at home ? This can sometimes help to establish if the Rabbit is actually eating less than may be apparent. A Dental Rabbit in need of a Dental may take longer to chew food so they may well look to be eating a lot of the time, but in fact they are not ingesting as much Also, it gives the opportunity for any Rabbit(s) they live with to scoff more than their fair share. So unless we sit and monitor the Dental Rabbit 24/7 it can be difficult to establish if/when the amount of food they ingest is reducing. Hence my suggestion of regular weigh-ins.

Poo size/quantity can also be an indicator as this can become smaller/less. Some Dental Rabbits will start to drink more water when a tooth burr is needed.

Thanks for your reply Jane. She does poo well & even before the dental revealing the big ulcer they didn't change (they share the lounge with me & she leaves regular presents for me so its easy to keep an eye on). Whereas weighing would be useful for most rabbits Boo does maintain her weight through all this. All three were in for vaccinations last Monday & all three have the exact same weight they always do (I'm pretty impressed with the consiistency of this over 3 years)

[Bunny Buddy]

Erin's scenario was similar. It was 12 weeks between dentals so I would have a fairly good idea just by watching patterns. The eye on the affected side started to be weepy when the tooth was starting to bother her, she'd also leave some pellets. Harder to monitor this when they are bonded of course. I say "was" "were" as Heather managed to get the tooth out a fortnight ago and *touch wood* if it doesn't grow back (and it appears to be out completely) then this should be the end of the saga. You'll probably find a pattern to monitor with Boo but for a while Frances thought that the tooth had stopped growing and no more dentals would be required .. then she ended up with a huge spike an the start of an ulcer.. so we went back to regular checks. At least they could see hers easily as it was at the front of her mouth.

[joey&boo]

She does drink loads - always has though (thats the reason I wanted bloods before her 1st GA, all values fine). I didn't notice it escalate

[Bunny Buddy]

She does drink loads - always has though (thats the reason I wanted bloods before her 1st GA, all values fine). I didn't notice it escalate

She's really not helping you with clues, is she?!

[joey&boo]

Erin's scenario was similar. It was 12 weeks between dentals so I would have a fairly good idea just by watching patterns. The eye on the affected side started to be weepy when the tooth was starting to bother her, she'd also leave some pellets. Harder to monitor this when they are bonded of course. I say "was" "were" as Heather managed to get the tooth out a fortnight ago and *touch wood* if it doesn't grow back (and it appears to be out completely) then this should be the end of the saga. You'll probably find a pattern to monitor with Boo but for a while Frances thought that the tooth had stopped growing and no more dentals would be required .. then she ended up with a huge spike an the start of an ulcer.. so we went back to regular checks. At least they could see hers easily as it was at the front of her mouth.

Clever Heather I hope it doesn't come back . At least Erin gave you some clues. Hopefully I'll get more confident in time. Obviously I don't want her having more GAs than necessary but I don't want her in pain either

[joey&boo]

She's really not helping you with clues, is she?!

No, not at all. Its nice having a "brave" rabbit that copes so well but its not helpful in helping her.

[Jack's-Jane]

Given all of the above I'd be minded to hold off on another GA and 'wait and see'. You may find that as before, you will pick up on the subtle symptoms she exhibited before, the symptoms that are 'Boo specific' !!

That said, if your trusted Vet advises that another GA Dental is done after 7 weeks I would go with a qualified opinion

[Omi]

Is she now approaching the 7 weeks since the last dental stage? I would struggle to make a confident decision in Boo's case

As much as I would hate the thought that she looks as though she will need frequent dentals, I would bear in mind a few facts. Boo requires a dental because of the missing teeth, which means that she has no means of wearing the tooth down, even if she eats mountains of hay. This is a constant and I can't see this changing. Boo gives none of the usual clues that she needs a dental e.g. feeling pain, signs of eating less, weight change etc. This, I think, might change if the time between dentals is extended allowing the spur to grow longer and actually bother Boo. In my view this must happen at some stage and it's only because you are vigilent that Boo hasn't reached this stage.

So it seems as though you are left with the choice of doing regular dentals around the 7 weeks time or trying slowly to extend the time between dentals to result in fewer GAs overall, obviously keeping a very close watch on her. I think the observation of the vet who did the previous dental would help here in establishing just how much spur had to be removed.

So your question is what would I do. I think I would first of all try to get the same vet to do a dental on Boo with the same gap in between and ask her to try to compare the two in respect of spur growth. If it is considered to be relatively minimal on both occasions, I would gradually try to extend the gap and also try to get the same vet each time.

I agree it's not an easy decision though.