I picked up my female bunny from the rescue centre this morning and started bonding her with my small netherland dwarf male earlier on today. I have set up a new bonding pen in a completely neutral area. Initially they were nose to nose and then had a small amount of scuffling and since then, not much! My existing bunny seems rather scared of her and has been sitting up on top of a box. Whenever he gets near her she makes a move to chase him away. This afternoon she has claimed 'his' spot on top of the box. She is lying down, strethced out, eating a lot and sleeping. She has used the litter tray and also left droppings over the entire run, he on the other hand doesn't seem to have used it at all. I am worried that he is afraid of her! When he tried to get back on top of the box she chased him off. He then stamped his foot several times. He seems to be cowering in the corner whereas she is as relaxed as can be an making herself at home. On the advice of the rescue we have chosen the speedy method. Can anyone more experienced let me know if they think this is going well please?!! Many thanks.
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Is this bonding going well - I can't tell!
- Thread starter 4paws4
- Start date
Jack's-Jane
Wise Old Thumper
Hello
I think it might be a good idea to remove the box so noBun can try to claim it as their own. Also, I'd provide 2 litter trays and 2 sources of water. Basically give them little to have 'territorial disputes' over. It sounds as though the Doe is showing herself to be dominant at the moment. It would make the bonding easier if the Buck accepts this and becomes a 'yes dear' Husbun !!
Good luck, hold your nerve and hopefully the Bunnies will eventually become a happily bonded pair
MightyMax
Banned
Hi there and welcome to the Forum :wave:
Sorry I haven't time to go into an in-depth answer for you at the moment. Hopefully I can come back later (just taken my sick bunny to the vet!).
In the meantime, have you seen these articles? I put together a list of the most useful stuff I could find. Some of it's contradictory, and it won't suit everyone, but there might be useful snippets in there:
http://rabbit.org/the-most-important-word-in-bonding-is-patience/
http://rabbit.org/introducing-rabbits-in-a-group-situation/
http://www.cottontails-rescue.org.uk/information/bonding-bunnies/ (good for pair bonding)
http://www.fatfluffs.com/info/bonding/
http://www.actionforrabbits.co.uk/bonding.html
http://forums.rabbitrehome.org.uk/s...How-I-do-rabbit-bonding&p=6934868#post6934868
Book in RWAF shop:
https://shop.rabbitwelfare.co.uk/product/bonding-rabbits-by-fiona-campbell/
Mischief and Tinker’s Mum
http://forums.rabbitrehome.org.uk/showthread.php?462466-How-I-bonded-my-trios-videos!
Thanks so much for the links. I have been reading around a bit but, as you say, have seen quite a few different points of view about bonding! Will have a read through these now.
I have now removed the box and installed another litter tray...they were a bit more feisty once I had done that....the female certainly seems to be dominant. On once occasion the male bunny did lie down and let the female sniff his nose etc....but when she tried it again he ran away (she chased) and stamped his foot. Poor chap! I really hope he learns to love her!!
MightyMax
Banned
Thanks so much for the links. I have been reading around a bit but, as you say, have seen quite a few different points of view about bonding! Will have a read through these now.
I have now removed the box and installed another litter tray...they were a bit more feisty once I had done that....the female certainly seems to be dominant. On once occasion the male bunny did lie down and let the female sniff his nose etc....but when she tried it again he ran away (she chased) and stamped his foot. Poor chap! I really hope he learns to love her!!
You're really welcome
Sounds like you're doing great
Hopefully I can help you down the line xxI'm a bit torn whether to leave them together overnight. Obviously I will keep checking in on them until much later on. The rescue seemed to advocate leaving them together once they were in the same pen. There has been no aggression as such, just a bit of chasing etc. Hmmmm.....will see what they are like over the next few hours. They are currently in a run which I could separate down the middle with some aviary panels overnight if needed. Thanks again
JuliaW
Warren Scout
Hi. I'm no expert but it sounds hopeful as no aggression. Is there any way you can sleep within earshot if any thing went off? It is nerve racking and it is early days so if you are worried putting a barrier in overnight may slow things down but not stop the process. Trouble is there isn't a single correct way to do this and a lot of advice is contradictory. Good luck!
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Thanks for this. Unfortunately, due to space, I have had to create the bonding pen in a shed so I won't be in earshot overnight (usually they will have an indoor/outdoor linked run). I have just been to check on them again and all seems very peaceful. Removing the box seems to have worked and I can see that my original bunny (male) has eaten etc. and moved around a bit. There is no sign that there has been any fighting of any sort so I've made the decision to leave them together overnight. Fingers crossed that they will be happy until morning. If I wake up in the night I'm sure I'll be tempted to pop out to check they are okay!!
I went out to check on them before sunrise as I was worrying! My little dwarf bunny is still sitting in the same place - completely still. I watched him eating pellets and hay last night so I know he has eaten. The female bunny seems perfectly happy lounging around. I picked them both up for a cuddle - I haven't held her before but she was very good and seemed not to mind - when I put her down she stamped her foot but then did a big bunny flop so I assume she wasn't too unhappy with me! I just feel so bad for my little dwarf bunny - he seems sad! No signs of any aggression still which must be a positive. Do you think he will get a bit more confident as time passes? Thanks
JuliaW
Warren Scout
It's really easy to feel sorry for your original bun, I know we did as we were aware he was being disrupted and appeared out of sorts. He should come round. Keep an eye to make sure he continues to eat- maybe try giving them something really tasty, scattered to check his appetite. Hey, this is good though -they (and you!) got through their first night fine.
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Thank you! Yes, I am so relieved that they are both fine this morning and there was no sign of any scrapping overnight! I expect they are really fed up with me popping in every 5 mins - but I have just taken out some fresh veg for them...he won't move from his spot but did eat veg I put close by - she on the other hand is going round hoovering up the lot! I should be grateful she is so comfortable I suppose. Fingers crossed they will get a bit more friendly during the day
MightyMax
Banned
Thank you! Yes, I am so relieved that they are both fine this morning and there was no sign of any scrapping overnight! I expect they are really fed up with me popping in every 5 mins - but I have just taken out some fresh veg for them...he won't move from his spot but did eat veg I put close by - she on the other hand is going round hoovering up the lot! I should be grateful she is so comfortable I suppose. Fingers crossed they will get a bit more friendly during the day
I'll be thinking of you!
I use food as a bonder when I am putting rabbis together. Lots of herbs and tasty sorts of hay and readigrass. Whatever forage I can find. I send diet sheets out of the window (oops, keep that to yourself :lol
for the couple of days I'm bonding rabbits.24 hours in and it clearly isn't love at first sight! Although, she is now starting to sit a bit closer and eat close to where he is - he is as still as a statue when she is near but if she looks at him he stamps and runs. I do feel we are making a bit of progress (when I sat in the run with them he became more confident so may try that again later)....let's hope they have a good second night. Thanks for the food tip - I have been offering lots of treats to try and entice them to interact with eachother a little more
Monty's Human
Alpha Buck
As said up thread, without any outright aggression, I wouldn't worry too much. We had all sorts to start with - everything you've described, as well as nipping, chasing, and a couple of fights we had to break up. A month (I think!) in and they're still hanging on in there together
One piece of really good advice I was given when we first started was not to pick them up, so they get used to the smell of each other, not you (sorry! I am totally stealing that and propagating it) Once we stopped hugging/stroking, it seemed to help a lot. I'd also second (third?) using food to get them together. To begin with we had no litter tray at all, just a lump of hay in the middle of the room which we scattered treats/herbs/veg through. Nothing to fight over, and they were able to eat separately or together as they felt like.
It took about 48 hours for the periodic thumping/freezing to stop and for them to become more able to cuddle up happily together. It took until about day four for them to seem truly comfortable with each other. I'm by no means one of the experts on bonding, but I have only done it for the first time myself recently, so feel free to PM if you wish Can't guarantee any good advice, but I can definitely send sympathy and similar tales of horror! Good luck!
One piece of really good advice I was given when we first started was not to pick them up, so they get used to the smell of each other, not you (sorry! I am totally stealing that and propagating it
) Once we stopped hugging/stroking, it seemed to help a lot. I'd also second (third?) using food to get them together. To begin with we had no litter tray at all, just a lump of hay in the middle of the room which we scattered treats/herbs/veg through. Nothing to fight over, and they were able to eat separately or together as they felt like.It took about 48 hours for the periodic thumping/freezing to stop and for them to become more able to cuddle up happily together. It took until about day four for them to seem truly comfortable with each other. I'm by no means one of the experts on bonding, but I have only done it for the first time myself recently, so feel free to PM if you wish
Can't guarantee any good advice, but I can definitely send sympathy and similar tales of horror! Good luck!
MightyMax
Banned
24 hours in and it clearly isn't love at first sight! Although, she is now starting to sit a bit closer and eat close to where he is - he is as still as a statue when she is near but if she looks at him he stamps and runs. I do feel we are making a bit of progress (when I sat in the run with them he became more confident so may try that again later)....let's hope they have a good second night. Thanks for the food tip - I have been offering lots of treats to try and entice them to interact with eachother a little more
Yeah, as MH says - food scattered is a good distraction. When they seem antsy that's something you can do
And yes, also as MH said, keep out of the way/hands off!! (was that my idea? :lol
. It's them that's bonding with each other - not you!I remember a story in my early cobwebby days of bonding where I interfered to protect a little boy bunny from a feisty female. She eventually rushed up to me, bit me, and in no uncertain terms said 'LEAVE HIM TO ME' :shock:
They can do it if we let them. Just a gentle nudge when needed ......
Good luck! xx
Monty's Human
Alpha Buck
And yes, also as MH said, keep out of the way/hands off!! (was that my idea? :lol
...Might have been
I think that was the thing that made the different between "Fine, we'll get on together" and "We could be friends", though, so I mean to remember it!
I think it gets easier to tell when to interfere the more you can see them bond, as well. There were things they did in the beginning that had us rushing to separate them, whereas now they do the same things occasionally and I watch to see how it pans out. If one bunny is obviously not happy about it, or if it crosses a line, I'll still step in, but almost all of the time the other bunny is completely unbothered by the temper tantrum and just waits a few minutes then sidles up going "Do you still love me?" They get better at it as time goes on, too. It used to take hours for Monty to convince Ossie he didn't mean it and he wasn't really humping her anyway, honest, it was just vigorous grooming, now within five minutes they'll be curled up together again and Ossie's all "Take no notice of him - stupid male!"
MightyMax
Banned
That's it to a T
They have their own agenda. God knows what it is sometimes :lol:
But they generally can sort things out, and they need to. Our scent and input is often redundant :thumb:
Monty's Human
Alpha Buck
"Food... more food... mmm, hay... food... I should probably nibble that... will she give me a treat yet?... Nap time." I think is about all that goes through my rabbits' heads :lol: I think once you're happy they're unlikely to fight/injure each other, backing off is probably the best thing for the present. And do be prepared for ups and downs! It sounds like it's all going as it should though
