Twinkle [emoji92]'s started eating but she's eating a lot or cardboard and paper agai

Hi,

Twinkle [emoji92]'s started eating again, but she's also started munching on cardboard [she'll chew just about anything that's not made of metal if you let her].

Normally I'm not that bothered because she spends her life inhaling hay and veggies, but she's literally only just started eating again.

The thing is when I take the cardboard away and give her some hay instead she just walks away and sulks like I'm punishing her.





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ghibli said:

Hi,

Twinkle [emoji92]'s started eating again, but she's also started munching on cardboard [she'll chew just about anything that's not made of metal if you let her].

Normally I'm not that bothered because she spends her life inhaling hay and veggies, but she's literally only just started eating again.

The thing is when I take the cardboard away and give her some hay instead she just walks away and sulks like I'm punishing her.

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The behaviour you describe often happens when the motility of a Rabbit's cecum is reduced. The Rabbit craves fibre, but the wrong sort of fibre. So they will try to eat paper, cardboard, carpet etc.

I'd take all the cardboard away from Twinkle as it will not help at all if she ingests it. I assume that she is still on gut motility medication ?

Fluids and hay are vital for promoting good motility of the cecum, so continue to encourage her to eat her hay and try to optimise her fluid intake.Exercise will help too.

What is her poo output like now ?

This link gives details of Cecal Impaction, although I am not suggesting that Twinkle is actually impacted. But rather she has a reduced motility of that part of her GI tract

http://wildpro.twycrosszoo.org/S/00dis/Miscellaneous/Caecal_Impaction.htm

ghibli said:

Hi,

Twinkle [emoji92]'s started eating again, but she's also started munching on cardboard [she'll chew just about anything that's not made of metal if you let her].

Normally I'm not that bothered because she spends her life inhaling hay and veggies, but she's literally only just started eating again.

The thing is when I take the cardboard away and give her some hay instead she just walks away and sulks like I'm punishing her.

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Hi there

Sorry to hear Twinkle is causing you concern.

I personally would remove all the cardboard from her.

Can you pick her some fresh grass, or provide readigrass as an alternative?

The other thing is you can provide something like seagrass mats for her to chew on, instead of the cardboard. Again you wouldn't want her to ingest a lot of it, but some would at least be natural fibre. Then there are rabbit safe twigs and leaves, and also Bramble leaves, which are tasty and also good for digestion.

Fibafirst sticks might also be useful and quite tasty



I've found these articles useful in cases like Twinkle's:


http://rabbit.org/disorders-of-the-cecum/


http://www.rabbit.org/journal/3-7/gi.html

Good luck

Jack's-Jane said:

The behaviour you describe often happens when the motility of a Rabbit's cecum is reduced. The Rabbit craves fibre, but the wrong sort of fibre. So they will try to eat paper, cardboard, carpet etc.

I'd take all the cardboard away from Twinkle as it will not help at all if she ingests it. I assume that she is still on gut motility medication ?

Fluids and hay are vital for promoting good motility of the cecum, so continue to encourage her to eat her hay and try to optimise her fluid intake.Exercise will help too.

What is her poo output like now ?

This link gives details of Cecal Impaction, although I am not suggesting that Twinkle is actually impacted. But rather she has a reduced motility of that part of her GI tract

http://wildpro.twycrosszoo.org/S/00dis/Miscellaneous/Caecal_Impaction.htm

Click to expand...

Thanks,

It hadn't occurred to me that she was chewing cardboard because of any other reason than she likes tearing things up. She destroyed a couch when we first got her! I'll get rid of the cardboard and magazines at rabbit level right away.

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ghibli said:

Thanks,

It hadn't occurred to me that she was chewing cardboard because of any other reason than she likes tearing things up. She destroyed a couch when we first got her! I'll get rid of the cardboard and magazines at rabbit level right away.

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Rabbits do chew things for many reasons - boredom also being one, and the need to constantly wear their teeth down.

I have had rabbits that chew up sofas and boxes when they are perfectly well. It's a feature

It's also a sign a poorly rabbit can be in pain

Jack's-Jane said:

The behaviour you describe often happens when the motility of a Rabbit's cecum is reduced. The Rabbit craves fibre, but the wrong sort of fibre. So they will try to eat paper, cardboard, carpet etc.

I'd take all the cardboard away from Twinkle as it will not help at all if she ingests it. I assume that she is still on gut motility medication ?

Fluids and hay are vital for promoting good motility of the cecum, so continue to encourage her to eat her hay and try to optimise her fluid intake.Exercise will help too.

What is her poo output like now ?

This link gives details of Cecal Impaction, although I am not suggesting that Twinkle is actually impacted. But rather she has a reduced motility of that part of her GI tract

http://wildpro.twycrosszoo.org/S/00dis/Miscellaneous/Caecal_Impaction.htm

Click to expand...

She is still on medicine, but it's becoming really difficult. She despises being picked up or handled in any way, and every time I have to give her medication it upsets her to the point where it seriously adversely affects our relationship. I'm worried that at this point the trauma of being given medication is outweighing the benefits of receiving it.

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ghibli said:

Thanks,

It hadn't occurred to me that she was chewing cardboard because of any other reason than she likes tearing things up. She destroyed a couch when we first got her! I'll get rid of the cardboard and magazines at rabbit level right away.

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Chewing stuff they shouldn't does not always indicate a GI tract problem, Rabbits chew as part of their natural behaviour. But given that your Vet has just diagnosed Twinkle as having a GI tract motility problem it makes it much more likely that 1- she will want to chew cardboard etc even more and 2- Doing so could exacerbate her GI tract motility problem as it would be unlikely to pass through very efficiently. Thus slowing things down even more.

ghibli said:

She is still on medicine, but it's becoming really difficult. She despises being picked up or handled in any way, and every time I have to give her medication it upsets her to the point where it seriously adversely affects our relationship. I'm worried that at this point the trauma of being given medication is outweighing the benefits of receiving it.

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What is the name of the medications she is on ? Is there any chance that if you mixed the dose(s) up in some grated carrot/apple she would eat it from a dish. Thus meaning you would not have to pick her up ?

Noting what her poo output is like now, aswell as what she is eating, would give a better idea of how her GI tract motility is now doing.Usually it is necessary to continue giving prokinetics until both input and output return to normal x

ghibli said:

She is still on medicine, but it's becoming really difficult. She despises being picked up or handled in any way, and every time I have to give her medication it upsets her to the point where it seriously adversely affects our relationship. I'm worried that at this point the trauma of being given medication is outweighing the benefits of receiving it.

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I understand this totally. It's a judgement call for you but I would try and persist with the meds if at all possible.

I've decided that she eating enough that I can hopefully get away with adding it to food rather than traumatising her.

I spoke to the vet today and she said if it's that bad just stop. Keep an eye on her, and I'd she starts going downhill restart the meds. Luckily [or more accurately ironically] I've still got the meds from when Ghibli died [emoji22] so I can at least afford to loose some trying something different, and perhaps spare her the trauma while getting her over the hump. The only problem is that she'll probably recognise the taste at this point, so I don't really know what to do about that. I know I've got spare, but I've also not got a lot of money, and I don't just want to waste it!

I am planing to at least see if she wants another friend [she actually doesn't get on with other rabbits and the woman who bonded her told my wife - who she worked with for a while on an unrelated job - that they had to exercise her separately from the other rabbits].

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Jack's-Jane said:

What is the name of the medications she is on ? Is there any chance that if you mixed the dose(s) up in some grated carrot/apple she would eat it from a dish. Thus meaning you would not have to pick her up ?

Noting what her poo output is like now, aswell as what she is eating, would give a better idea of how her GI tract motility is now doing.Usually it is necessary to continue giving prokinetics until both input and output return to normal x

Click to expand...

She's on 0.3ml of Zantc twice a day and 10 ml of Metacam one a day.

What you've suggested is exactly what I've decided to try.

I've got extra medication left over from when Ghibli died [emoji22] so even if it doesn't work and it gets waisted I'll still have some if it come to an emergency.

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I'm sorry Twinkle has been poorly. I'm glad she is starting to eat a bit more now. I agree with you that if trying to syringe feed her the meds is stressing her out too much then switching tactics and hiding them in food is probably the best way to go. I've certainly done that myself in the past. I've always used a finger nail portion of food, just enough to hide the meds but not too much that it might get left uneaten.
If you're giving her metacam and Zantac she should be ok about eating them herself as they're quite palatable for most buns.
Another thing I've found is that when a bunny is in sulk with me they will refuse to let me see them eating food I offer directly to them. So if you offer it to Twinkle and she refuses to it at first, don't take it away immediately but leave it in front of her and leave the room for about half an hour or so. When you go back to check on her you should find she's eaten it herself. Sometimes you just have to humour their little mood swings!

I hope Twinkle is back to full health again soon.

I hope you're doing ok too. It's really stressful medicating a sick bun and it must be even harder for you at the moment when your grief for little Ghibli is still very raw [emoji17]


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Jack's-Jane said:

Chewing stuff they shouldn't does not always indicate a GI tract problem, Rabbits chew as part of their natural behaviour. But given that your Vet has just diagnosed Twinkle as having a GI tract motility problem it makes it much more likely that 1- she will want to chew cardboard etc even more and 2- Doing so could exacerbate her GI tract motility problem as it would be unlikely to pass through very efficiently. Thus slowing things down even more.

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I think you're right, and I've removed all the cardboard and paper from her reach!

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Scrappy's Little Helper said:

I'm sorry Twinkle has been poorly. I'm glad she is starting to eat a bit more now. I agree with you that if trying to syringe feed her the meds is stressing her out too much then switching tactics and hiding them in food is probably the best way to go. I've certainly done that myself in the past. I've always used a finger nail portion of food, just enough to hide the meds but not too much that it might get left uneaten.
If you're giving her metacam and Zantac she should be ok about eating them herself as they're quite palatable for most buns.
Another thing I've found is that when a bunny is in sulk with me they will refuse to let me see them eating food I offer directly to them. So if you offer it to Twinkle and she refuses to it at first, don't take it away immediately but leave it in front of her and leave the room for about half an hour or so. When you go back to check on her you should find she's eaten it herself. Sometimes you just have to humour their little mood swings!

I hope Twinkle is back to full health again soon.

I hope you're doing ok too. It's really stressful medicating a sick bun and it must be even harder for you at the moment when your grief for little Ghibli is still very raw [emoji17]


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Thanks for the info. She does get like that when she's in a sulk with me, but this is more than just a sulk. Usually she'll let me pet her after half an hour or so, but today she grunted at me, and actually lunged and lashed out. She's bitten all her careers, but she's never bitten me or been aggressive with me before. She does hate it when I watch her eat if she's mad at me, so I usually just do some work. I've got my desk against the wall so I'm facing the other way, but maybe leaving the room is a better idea!

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My bun had gut stasis recently and was prescribed zantac, emiprid and metacam.
I tried syringing the meds without any luck (he despises being picked up, will tolerate headrubs). After half an hour of trying and us both becoming distressed I took him to the vets where the nurse syringed the meds in. (He was very stubborn and tried not swallow). It was the same the next day and so the vet gave an injection (painkiller instead).
Then the vet decided that as he was so feisty he was clearly improving and it wasn't worth the stress of syringing meds not to try. Instead he suggested I put them meds into his food. So I mushed up a small piece of banana (only small as it's not great for buns due to the sugar level) with the metacam. I syringed the emiprid over dried herbs (dandelion worked for my bun). I left the food and didn't try to coax and left the room. A couple of hours later he'd scoffed the lot.
I think it was a combination of him feeling a bit better and me no longer being stressed/ under pressure to get meds into him.
So there are options - injections instead, hide in food.
I also tasted the metacam (I figured if I was asking him to eat it it was only fair that I tried a bit) and it tasted nice, sweet and slightly of banana.
Good luck, I hope your bun's feeling better soon x

ghibli said:

Thanks for the info. She does get like that when she's in a sulk with me, but this is more than just a sulk. Usually she'll let me pet her after half an hour or so, but today she grunted at me, and actually lunged and lashed out. She's bitten all her careers, but she's never bitten me or been aggressive with me before. She does hate it when I watch her eat if she's mad at me, so I usually just do some work. I've got my desk against the wall so I'm facing the other way, but maybe leaving the room is a better idea!

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How have you managed with Twinkle's evening meds?

MightyMax said:

How have you managed with Twinkle's evening meds?

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I didn't give her any! She's eating her third bowl of veggies right now [emoji5] I'm calling it!

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ghibli said:

I didn't give her any! She's eating her third bowl of veggies right now [emoji5] I'm calling it!

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That's good news!

I hope she continues to eat well. Is she pooping OK at all yet?

ghibli said:

I didn't give her any! She's eating her third bowl of veggies right now [emoji5] I'm calling it!

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Just keep a close check on her output, as I mentioned previously how much is coming out is as important as how much is going in !! I really hope that Twinkle will remain well now. You've been a great Nurse to her, even if she doesn't seem to appreciate it !!