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Squidgy poos

HannahB

Young Bun
As the thread title suggests, I need your opinion about Harry's squidgy poos!

Earlier this year my old chap was diagnosed with chronic arthritis and went through a right old episode while we got that under control. He's currently on metacam, tramadol and gabapentin twice a day with laser therapy every couple of weeks. He's been bouncy and bright in himself, binkying around and having a lovely time of life.

The last few days, his appetite has been down very slightly and he's produced some absolutely noxious smelling, squidgy poos. I suppose they look a bit like caecs. He is producing formed ones too, but the squidgy ones aren't great. He's also had *quite* the temper on him, but I've put that down to his moult which always puts him in a really foul mood. He's still active, but grumpy, which makes me worry in case there's something going on. There've been no dietry or lifestyle changes that I can put it down to and his meds have been established for probably 3 months now so nothing new there either. I'm awaiting a call back from my vet but wondered if anyone had any thoughts?
 
As the thread title suggests, I need your opinion about Harry's squidgy poos!

Earlier this year my old chap was diagnosed with chronic arthritis and went through a right old episode while we got that under control. He's currently on metacam, tramadol and gabapentin twice a day with laser therapy every couple of weeks. He's been bouncy and bright in himself, binkying around and having a lovely time of life.

The last few days, his appetite has been down very slightly and he's produced some absolutely noxious smelling, squidgy poos. I suppose they look a bit like caecs. He is producing formed ones too, but the squidgy ones aren't great. He's also had *quite* the temper on him, but I've put that down to his moult which always puts him in a really foul mood. He's still active, but grumpy, which makes me worry in case there's something going on. There've been no dietry or lifestyle changes that I can put it down to and his meds have been established for probably 3 months now so nothing new there either. I'm awaiting a call back from my vet but wondered if anyone had any thoughts?

Hello

Has he had regular blood tests given the combination of analgesic medication he is on ?

Have you noticed any reduction in his hay intake ?

Has he ever had any Dental problems ?

I see you are in Kent, if you use Trinity Vets I am sure that they will give you excellent expert advice :)
 
As the thread title suggests, I need your opinion about Harry's squidgy poos!

Earlier this year my old chap was diagnosed with chronic arthritis and went through a right old episode while we got that under control. He's currently on metacam, tramadol and gabapentin twice a day with laser therapy every couple of weeks. He's been bouncy and bright in himself, binkying around and having a lovely time of life.

The last few days, his appetite has been down very slightly and he's produced some absolutely noxious smelling, squidgy poos. I suppose they look a bit like caecs. He is producing formed ones too, but the squidgy ones aren't great. He's also had *quite* the temper on him, but I've put that down to his moult which always puts him in a really foul mood. He's still active, but grumpy, which makes me worry in case there's something going on. There've been no dietry or lifestyle changes that I can put it down to and his meds have been established for probably 3 months now so nothing new there either. I'm awaiting a call back from my vet but wondered if anyone had any thoughts?


Hi Hannah

I know Harry has had a couple of blood tests already, and if the've checked that everything's working OK, I am wondering if it's to do with his food? I find that as rabbits get older they don't process it so easily, and quite a few soft poos can be found around the place.

You could try adding a probiotic such as Avipro or Bio Lapis to his food? (I prefer not to add things to water, as they don't always get drunk!). There's no guarantee it will work, as some rabbit specialists suggest a rabbit's stomach acid is too high for it to be any good.

However, I know Mark of Trinity vets would approve of Avipro so you'll be in good company :)
 
Hello! I'm a Trinity regular :wave: Currently waiting on a call from Richard.

His hay consumption had been down a tad but he's doing really well on it again now. No history of dental issues so don't think it's that.

He hasn't had a blood test in the last two months but had several while they were trying to diagnose and get his meds right (he also had a lung infection so bloods helped check that that was clear too), and all showed excellent organ function.

I had made a bit of a pact with myself that I wasn't going to go looking for trouble all of the time that he seemed happy, but now I'm not sure. The grumpiness could be down to his advancing age and moult - he really really hates moulting - but the stinking poos is niggling me.

Sadly I think the reality is that Harry won't make terribly old bones. He's nearly 8 now but is a giant breed so obviously that's getting on a bit for a big boy. I can't tell you how much we've been through this year. He pretty much lived at Hotel Trinity throughout March - I think he only spend about 3 days of the whole month at home - and I'm worried about putting him through more bloods etc etc and the stress that that''ll cause him. I hope you know what I mean when I say that I'm worried of looking for problems. Harry has been given so much this year to keep him happy and healthy so it's not that I'm unwilling to pay for care but more that I worry about the ethics of putting him through diagnosis and then goodness knows what else given his advanced years.
 
Hi Hannah

I know Harry has had a couple of blood tests already, and if the've checked that everything's working OK, I am wondering if it's to do with his food? I find that as rabbits get older they don't process it so easily, and quite a few soft poos can be found around the place.

You could try adding a probiotic such as Avipro or Bio Lapis to his food? (I prefer not to add things to water, as they don't always get drunk!). There's no guarantee it will work, as some rabbit specialists suggest a rabbit's stomach acid is too high for it to be any good.

However, I know Mark of Trinity vets would approve of Avipro so you'll be in good company :)

Hello lovely

Your reply came in while I was typing the one above. Are you a Trinity go-er too? All the best people are! I had wondered about probiotics. Julian at Trinity mentioned a couple of months back that periodic blood tests might be a good idea to check for organ function. I don't know - I don't want to be jumping to all sorts of conclusions when it could just be age/ a bit of crunkiness due to his arthritis.

Since his long stay at Trinity in the Spring, his eating habits have been really quite different and he tends to graze now rather than clear all of his veggies within 30 seconds of being given them.

Do you have any thoughts on diet for ageing buns? I've been feeding him the same as always (except for substituting pellets for cereal!); loads of hay, herbs, kale, spinach, broccoli, cabbage, sprouts - he normally has a combination of 4 or 5 different veggies with every meal plus extra herbs as a treat in the evenings.
 
Hello! I'm a Trinity regular :wave: Currently waiting on a call from Richard.

His hay consumption had been down a tad but he's doing really well on it again now. No history of dental issues so don't think it's that.

He hasn't had a blood test in the last two months but had several while they were trying to diagnose and get his meds right (he also had a lung infection so bloods helped check that that was clear too), and all showed excellent organ function.

I had made a bit of a pact with myself that I wasn't going to go looking for trouble all of the time that he seemed happy, but now I'm not sure. The grumpiness could be down to his advancing age and moult - he really really hates moulting - but the stinking poos is niggling me.

Sadly I think the reality is that Harry won't make terribly old bones. He's nearly 8 now but is a giant breed so obviously that's getting on a bit for a big boy. I can't tell you how much we've been through this year. He pretty much lived at Hotel Trinity throughout March - I think he only spend about 3 days of the whole month at home - and I'm worried about putting him through more bloods etc etc and the stress that that''ll cause him. I hope you know what I mean when I say that I'm worried of looking for problems. Harry has been given so much this year to keep him happy and healthy so it's not that I'm unwilling to pay for care but more that I worry about the ethics of putting him through diagnosis and then goodness knows what else given his advanced years.

I 100% understand. I am a great believer in doing what is right for the individual Rabbit even if that means not doing certain diagnostics. Dont let anyone make you feel bad about your choices. Harry is your Rabbit and you know him better than anyone. You are also in the care of some superb Vets, Harry could not be in better hands.

How long has he been on the muesli mix and which one are you feeding him ? I ask as soft poo can be an issue for some Rabbits fed muesli, but I know that you are feeding it as opposed to pellets for a very good reason. Dont worry, I have had to do the same for a few of my Rabbits, despite encountering the wrath of some :roll:

I have also had a lot of success using Avipro Plus for one of my Rabbits who has a chronic gut problem. Again I was criticised for that by a few rather verbose people :roll: But as it was Mark (Rowland) at Trinity who advised me to use it I prefered to take his qualified advice over that of anyone else.

http://www.vetuk.co.uk/dog-suppleme...probiotic-products-c-5_172/avipro-plus-p-1225
 
I 100% understand. I am a great believer in doing what is right for the individual Rabbit even if that means not doing certain diagnostics. Dont let anyone make you feel bad about your choices. Harry is your Rabbit and you know him better than anyone. You are also in the care of some superb Vets, Harry could not be in better hands.

How long has he been on the muesli mix and which one are you feeding him ? I ask as soft poo can be an issue for some Rabbits fed muesli, but I know that you are feeding it as opposed to pellets for a very good reason. Dont worry, I have had to do the same for a few of my Rabbits, despite encountering the wrath of some :roll:

I have also had a lot of success using Avipro Plus for one of my Rabbits who has a chronic gut problem. Again I was criticised for that by a few rather verbose people :roll: But as it was Mark (Rowland) at Trinity who advised me to use it I prefered to take his qualified advice over that of anyone else.

http://www.vetuk.co.uk/dog-suppleme...probiotic-products-c-5_172/avipro-plus-p-1225

That's really interesting as Julian at Trinity had recommended that supplement for my other bun, Molly, who has all sorts of chronic problems linked to pasteurella. I'll definitely give it a go if it'll help both of them.

Harry's been on the mix probably since late March/ April. It's really not ideal but he still completely refuses pellets! But he'll take his oxbow joint supplement and fenugreek treats which are harder and crunchier than pellets which makes no flippin' sense.

I guess I'm most worried that the combination of meds might be causing trouble, but we're a bit stuck there. We'd been trying to wean him off of the tramadol but found he was struggling without it. And I'd rather have him here for a shorter time if he's feeling realy well, than string things out with him sailing at half mast and feeling poorly.
 
That's really interesting as Julian at Trinity had recommended that supplement for my other bun, Molly, who has all sorts of chronic problems linked to pasteurella. I'll definitely give it a go if it'll help both of them.

Harry's been on the mix probably since late March/ April. It's really not ideal but he still completely refuses pellets! But he'll take his oxbow joint supplement and fenugreek treats which are harder and crunchier than pellets which makes no flippin' sense.

I guess I'm most worried that the combination of meds might be causing trouble, but we're a bit stuck there. We'd been trying to wean him off of the tramadol but found he was struggling without it. And I'd rather have him here for a shorter time if he's feeling realy well, than string things out with him sailing at half mast and feeling poorly.

The soft poo didn't coincide with starting Gabapentin did it ?
 
The soft poo didn't coincide with starting Gabapentin did it ?

Nope, he's been on gabapentin since March and the poo thing only started over the weekend. That said, I've been hiding his gabapentin inside a blueberry and the last couple of days he's been resistant to eating it which did make me wonder if the gabapentin in particulat was bothering him...

Do you have experience of gabapentin in your buns? Not many vets seem to prescribe it so it's hard to find information about owners' experiences.
 
Hello lovely

Your reply came in while I was typing the one above. Are you a Trinity go-er too? All the best people are! I had wondered about probiotics. Julian at Trinity mentioned a couple of months back that periodic blood tests might be a good idea to check for organ function. I don't know - I don't want to be jumping to all sorts of conclusions when it could just be age/ a bit of crunkiness due to his arthritis.

Since his long stay at Trinity in the Spring, his eating habits have been really quite different and he tends to graze now rather than clear all of his veggies within 30 seconds of being given them.

Do you have any thoughts on diet for ageing buns? I've been feeding him the same as always (except for substituting pellets for cereal!); loads of hay, herbs, kale, spinach, broccoli, cabbage, sprouts - he normally has a combination of 4 or 5 different veggies with every meal plus extra herbs as a treat in the evenings.

:D

My vet has consulted with Mark on a number of occasions, and I am in no doubt of the expertise of the Trinity Vet Practice :)

Does Harry give up his blood easily? Sometimes it's very stressful for a rabbit to have a blood test, and it occasionally requires sedation. Perhaps Harry is OK with them? If that's the case, and they've been recommended, then I would go for it. Barring the stress factor for Harry, which you have to watch for.

For my elderlies I add in a pinch of oats a couple of times a day. I've been told by someone that I shouldn't do this, as it's carbs and they are bad for bunnies, etc etc ... But several specialist vets have recommended what I do, and also Tamsin, our esteemed Forum creator :) And anyway, I have a great deal of experience so I don't worry about the odd deviant element :lol:

You could also try a few sunflower seeds .. They are rich in vitamin E, which I find helpful as rabbits age. Just the kernels. His diet sounds pretty good to me.

How is his weight? Is he keeping up?

I began a thread recently about weight loss in rabbits (may not apply to Harry) and what the possible causes might be:

http://forums.rabbitrehome.org.uk/showthread.php?465203-Anyone-experienced-Rabbit-weight-loss

And yes, regarding probiotics - I certainly think it's worth giving it a go. As I say, options are divided amongst the rabbit vet world, just as they are over Iinfacol, but it can do no harm and therefore worth trying :D
 
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Nope, he's been on gabapentin since March and the poo thing only started over the weekend. That said, I've been hiding his gabapentin inside a blueberry and the last couple of days he's been resistant to eating it which did make me wonder if the gabapentin in particulat was bothering him...

Do you have experience of gabapentin in your buns? Not many vets seem to prescribe it so it's hard to find information about owners' experiences.

Not in a Rabbit of mine, but I know of someone who's Rabbit was prescribed it but could not tolerate it as it caused lots of gut problems. That said, I also know of far more people who's Rabbits have been fine on it. As with all drugs, what is fine for the majority of Rabbits may upset one or two.
 
Hi Hannah

I am at Trinity and Doughnut is under Mark's care. She has slow gut mobility and acid reflux so we have gone through so many medicines to find out what was wrong with her and how different ones helped her. She had gabapentin at one point as we didn't know it was acid reflux but all her gullet was ulcerated. She still sometimes rubbed her throat so Mark thought it may be the scar tissue hurting her. He said gabapentin is prescribed for people without limbs as they can still feel them and get itches and it helps with the pain. I found Doughnut to be very nervous on this and jumpy, but she didn't stay on it long and I can't tell you about the soft stools as she gets them all the time!

She also went on Avipro plus. Mark said not to put it in her water though as it gets too diluted so I used to make a syringe up so I knew she got all of it.

I know what you means about tests, Doughnut had so many at one point but I'm sure any of the vets at Trinity wouldn't put your little one through them if it wasn't in your bunnies best interest, so I would be guided by what they say. It's so good to have a great vets to go to. I had seen about 4 and 1 specialist who all told me Doughnut was well when I knew something was wrong and was in pain. I went to Mark as a last resort and he told me you have a very sick little bunny. I just cried, not because she was sick, I knew that but because he actually recognised it when no one else did!
 
Nope, he's been on gabapentin since March and the poo thing only started over the weekend. That said, I've been hiding his gabapentin inside a blueberry and the last couple of days he's been resistant to eating it which did make me wonder if the gabapentin in particulat was bothering him...

Do you have experience of gabapentin in your buns? Not many vets seem to prescribe it so it's hard to find information about owners' experiences.


Re Gabapentin, Maria Kubiak exotics vet said this on the Forum:


I use tramadol quite frequently in rabbits, guinea pigs and chinchillas with pain that is not controlled by non-steroidals like metacam, or where NSAIDs can't be used due to other health issues. It works well to control soft tissue pain, less well for bony pain and rarely causes sedation and I've had no adverse reactions. Doses required for pain relief in bunnies are much higher than in cats and dogs.
Gabapentin I use only for nerve-damage related pain so far less frequently but has seemed to give some relief in a number of these cases.


http://forums.rabbitrehome.org.uk/s...he-vertebrae-of-the-back&highlight=gabapentin
 
:D

My vet has consulted with Mark on a number of occasions, and I am in no doubt of the expertise of the Trinity Vet Practice :)

Does Harry give up his blood easily? Sometimes it's very stressful for a rabbit to have a blood test, and it occasionally requires sedation. Perhaps Harry is OK with them? If that's the case, and they've been recommended, then I would go for it. Barring the stress factor for Harry, which you have to watch for.

For my elderlies I add in a pinch of oats a couple of times a day. I've been told by someone that I shouldn't do this, as it's carbs and they are bad for bunnies, etc etc ... But several specialist vets have recommended what I do, and also Tamsin, our esteemed Forum creator :) And anyway, I have a great deal of experience so I don't worry about the odd deviant element :lol:

You could also try a few sunflower seeds .. They are rich in vitamin E, which I find helpful as rabbits age. Just the kernels. His diet sounds pretty good to me.

How is his weight? Is he keeping up?

I began a thread recently about weight loss in rabbits (may not apply to Harry) and what the possible causes might be:

http://forums.rabbitrehome.org.uk/showthread.php?465203-Anyone-experienced-Rabbit-weight-loss

And yes, regarding probiotics - I certainly think it's worth giving it a go. As I say, options are divided amongst the rabbit vet world, just as they are over Iinfacol, but it can do no harm and therefore worth trying :D
I always think opinions are divided as what works for one rabbit doesn't necessarily work for another. I think infracol is great. I've seen Doughnut with tummy ache, stomach pressing and in pain and given her infracol and 30 minutes later she's fine. Like you say a probiotic or infracol won't hurt at all so always worth trying :)
 
:D

My vet has consulted with Mark on a number of occasions, and I am in no doubt of the expertise of the Trinity Vet Practice :)

Does Harry give up his blood easily? Sometimes it's very stressful for a rabbit to have a blood test, and it occasionally requires sedation. Perhaps Harry is OK with them? If that's the case, and they've been recommended, then I would go for it. Barring the stress factor for Harry, which you have to watch for.

For my elderlies I add in a pinch of oats a couple of times a day. I've been told by someone that I shouldn't do this, as it's carbs and they are bad for bunnies, etc etc ... But several specialist vets have recommended what I do, and also Tamsin, our esteemed Forum creator :) And anyway, I have a great deal of experience so I don't worry about the odd deviant element :lol:

You could also try a few sunflower seeds .. They are rich in vitamin E, which I find helpful as rabbits age. Just the kernels. His diet sounds pretty good to me.

How is his weight? Is he keeping up?

I began a thread recently about weight loss in rabbits (may not apply to Harry) and what the possible causes might be:

http://forums.rabbitrehome.org.uk/showthread.php?465203-Anyone-experienced-Rabbit-weight-loss

And yes, regarding probiotics - I certainly think it's worth giving it a go. As I say, options are divided amongst the rabbit vet world, just as they are over Iinfacol, but it can do no harm and therefore worth trying :D

Trinity are AMAZING. They seem to lead the field and be a bit more maverick than others with using certain drugs, which I like. I've spoken to them previously about the supplementary medicines such as oxbow and they definitely encourage it - I think the challenge is that there's little solid evidence to completely prove that they're helpful. But as you say, if it's not harming them then you may as well give it a go.

I'd not heard about sunflower seeds before, I'll give that a go! We check his weight every couple of weeks when he has a laser therapy appointment and his weight is holding really well. He lost a load of weight when he was very poorly in March but it's all back on now and he's holding steady which is fab.

I've had an older bun once before who reached 10, but he was much smaller and didn't really have any problems in his declining years. We lost Harry's partner last year, also aged around 8, and she was really slowing down, poor girl. But sadly I don't have *enough* experience in older buns to know what to put down to an old age slow-down, and what is something else entirely. Hopefully Trinity can shed some more light on it - or better still, Harry can just get back to normal!
 
I always think opinions are divided as what works for one rabbit doesn't necessarily work for another. I think infracol is great. I've seen Doughnut with tummy ache, stomach pressing and in pain and given her infracol and 30 minutes later she's fine. Like you say a probiotic or infracol won't hurt at all so always worth trying :)


Exactly so :D Infacol works in 30 mins for my rabbits too.

Be nice to have an armistice over Probiotics and Infacol and just accept that if they work, then why the hell not?? :lol:
 

I found this particular article last night, which I was initially worried by but Harry doesn't seem to be showing any of the side effects that they mention. The first link was really interesting, especially as it was another arthritic bun, so thank you v v much for posting it. Interestingly, Harry really turned a corner once Gabapentin was thrown into the mix (after they got the dose right - he spent the first two days completely spaced out and dribbling everywhere!), so I'm loathe to give it up. I tried cosequin on my old girl who was also arthritic but could not for love nor money get it into her. Bunnies! Who'd have 'em?! :lol:
 
I found this particular article last night, which I was initially worried by but Harry doesn't seem to be showing any of the side effects that they mention. The first link was really interesting, especially as it was another arthritic bun, so thank you v v much for posting it. Interestingly, Harry really turned a corner once Gabapentin was thrown into the mix (after they got the dose right - he spent the first two days completely spaced out and dribbling everywhere!), so I'm loathe to give it up. I tried cosequin on my old girl who was also arthritic but could not for love nor money get it into her. Bunnies! Who'd have 'em?! :lol:


You're welcome :)

I didn't know whether to post that article on the side effects, so I'm glad you've already seen it :)

It's certainly a lifetime's learning keeping bunnies, isn't it?
 
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