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territorial buns/neutralising a big territory - ideas please!

Squishies

Warren Scout
Hi everyone, I'm looking for ideas on how to neutralise the wider territory of my bunnies; the territory beyond their cage/aviary.
...my pair have supervised free run of the garden and most of the house when I am home, and are very clear with me and any visitors that they own, well, *everything*!

To give a couple of comedy examples of how territorial they are...
- if I am out in the garden planting new plants, they will attempt to move pots/trays/watering cans etc, if I have put them in a place that is not to their liking :roll:
- when I go on holiday and they have no access to the house for a couple of weeks, the moment I get back and throw open the back doors, they will run in, do a full recce of 'their' rooms, and then drop a few territorial poops in the lounge for good measure in reminding me whose house it really is...
...it's very amusing and cute of course, but it does worry me that they may be incredibly reticent to accept interlopers, even if I re-extend their space from the aviary very slowly.

The basic background is that I'd love to bond in another bunny or another pair with my existing pair, and while I can go elsewhere to do the bond in completely neutral territory, plus I can then neutralise and rearrange the aviary before their return; I am worried that my two are not going to want to 'share' the rest of their territory - especially their beloved garden and favourite spots under the table/under the bed etc. Obviously I can deep clean the house and wipe down the skirting etc, but even then they seem to remember the location/sight of everything just as much as the smells, and of course, the garden is far trickier again!

Any ideas or experience anyone has of bonding with rabbits who have such a big and established territory (and are not used to sharing!) would be gratefully received. No idea is bad idea! ...all rabbits are different with their own personalities of course, and my aim is driven only out of wanting to do a good thing for my bunnies longer term.

...some of you already know the context of why I would like to re-grow my little troop, but I shall put it again briefly here if helpful, or if anyone is wondering why on earth I might want to attempt to bond in more furries!:
I had a sublimely happy trio, and tragically lost one of my boys who was the 'social glue' of the group. In particular, he was inseparable/lifelong mates with my girl bunny, and they went everywhere together (while the other boy was always quite timid and kept himself to himself).
Having lost everyone's favourite bunny, I now have a pair that despite being generally healthy/ok, I would describe as 'rubbing along' rather than actively 'getting on' and my girl bun in particular seems quite lonely, despite having a litter mate around.
[other info! they are just turned 3 years and are both neutered/spayed]
 
Hi everyone, I'm looking for ideas on how to neutralise the wider territory of my bunnies; the territory beyond their cage/aviary.
...my pair have supervised free run of the garden and most of the house when I am home, and are very clear with me and any visitors that they own, well, *everything*!

To give a couple of comedy examples of how territorial they are...
- if I am out in the garden planting new plants, they will attempt to move pots/trays/watering cans etc, if I have put them in a place that is not to their liking :roll:
- when I go on holiday and they have no access to the house for a couple of weeks, the moment I get back and throw open the back doors, they will run in, do a full recce of 'their' rooms, and then drop a few territorial poops in the lounge for good measure in reminding me whose house it really is...
...it's very amusing and cute of course, but it does worry me that they may be incredibly reticent to accept interlopers, even if I re-extend their space from the aviary very slowly.

The basic background is that I'd love to bond in another bunny or another pair with my existing pair, and while I can go elsewhere to do the bond in completely neutral territory, plus I can then neutralise and rearrange the aviary before their return; I am worried that my two are not going to want to 'share' the rest of their territory - especially their beloved garden and favourite spots under the table/under the bed etc. Obviously I can deep clean the house and wipe down the skirting etc, but even then they seem to remember the location/sight of everything just as much as the smells, and of course, the garden is far trickier again!

Any ideas or experience anyone has of bonding with rabbits who have such a big and established territory (and are not used to sharing!) would be gratefully received. No idea is bad idea! ...all rabbits are different with their own personalities of course, and my aim is driven only out of wanting to do a good thing for my bunnies longer term.

...some of you already know the context of why I would like to re-grow my little troop, but I shall put it again briefly here if helpful, or if anyone is wondering why on earth I might want to attempt to bond in more furries!:
I had a sublimely happy trio, and tragically lost one of my boys who was the 'social glue' of the group. In particular, he was inseparable/lifelong mates with my girl bunny, and they went everywhere together (while the other boy was always quite timid and kept himself to himself).
Having lost everyone's favourite bunny, I now have a pair that despite being generally healthy/ok, I would describe as 'rubbing along' rather than actively 'getting on' and my girl bun in particular seems quite lonely, despite having a litter mate around.
[other info! they are just turned 3 years and are both neutered/spayed]


Hiya :wave:

My rabbits free range the whole house, always. They also have (when out and supervised) the whole of the patio and garden.

Over the last 25 years I have always bonded new rabbits in my kitchen, including the existing 'old' rabbit/s. I then clean the front room, (where they seem to gravitate to) whilst they are bonding. After a length of time in the kitchen I then throw the doors open and they can all go everywhere. They end up together in the front room.

Once rabbits are bonded, I have had no issues regarding 'what's mine and what's yours'.

Have you a time scale in mind? :)
 
Hello hello!

That is hugely encouraging, I have to say! I have been worried that my pair have too much 'ownership' currently, but what you say makes sense; to only allow them into the 'shared' territory once they are well bonded.
...and you bond in the kitchen as somewhere they don't usually go, I'm guessing? (or do the existing/original rabbits have access to the kitchen usually too?)

Thanks a million as always!
Mx
 
Hello hello!

That is hugely encouraging, I have to say! I have been worried that my pair have too much 'ownership' currently, but what you say makes sense; to only allow them into the 'shared' territory once they are well bonded.
...and you bond in the kitchen as somewhere they don't usually go, I'm guessing? (or do the existing/original rabbits have access to the kitchen usually too?)

Thanks a million as always!
Mx


Yes, my own rabbis go into the kitchen :lol:

It's always worked though because the rabbit left behind is eager for company, and finds being shut up in the kitchen with a newcomer slightly odd (since they usually have freedom). I introduced two new rabbits this way to the 'original homeowner rabbit' and it worked a dream.

With rabbits I don't know, it's all strange to them. Once bonded I put them into a big shed/run while they wait for their owners to arrive and collect them for home.

I've been helping someone on here recently, and my advice was to make sure the bond is well and truly secure before opening out or moving to *any* new area. Err on the side of caution if you're not used to bonding, and keep them in their happy space for as long as you can bear to before moving back to a thoroughly cleansed 'home'

I'm sorry you've not had any replies apart from myself M, I shall put out for more info for you!!
 
What MM said :lol: Sorry, I can't add much to that. Your rabbits sound fun. I'm not too sure how effective neutralising in houses is (but I guess we should try). Boo is not a humpy bunny but she got very humpy on just carrying the buns into what was her usual space. Yes I'd definitely leave them as long as poss in the neutral space to cement their bond . Good luck & keep posting
 
I'd definitely bond somewhere that is as neutral as possible. A kitchen or bathroom (I like using the bathroom) is easy to neutralise before a bond and I usually find them to be the perfect size.

In terms of them being territorial with everything else - personally I think if they are well bonded before having access to the larger territory they should be fine. The most you may get is a little humping or fur pulling to real quick figure it out but I can't imagine it would be anything too serious so long as you don't rush them.
 
If they are bonded elsewhere, I would then rearrange as much as possible in the communal (eg garden) areas, and put a lot of other suitable objects there eg new tunnels, large pots, boxes, bales of hay - anything that will confuse the existing bunnies and give the newbies an equal chance. Maybe reduce the area at first by a series of puppy panels.

If you want to make everything smell more 'neutral', maybe let the weather do most of it (ie hope for lots of rain while they are away) and you could try spraying a weak liquid soap over everything (including grass and plants). It won't harm the plants (as long as it's not done in bright sun when it could cause scorching) and may get rid of a few greenfly.
 
Hi M, you're going to get another one then yay! I can't really add to the above, MM and others are far more experienced than me, but let me know if you want any bonding vibes or to talk it through. Its a funny thing this rubbing along versus properly bonded. I thought Lucy had properly bonded into the quad, but then it all fell down, and now seeing her with Dave, I can see the difference. You know your bunnies well, you'll be fine. Xx
 
Thanks for all the encouraging advice, everyone - this makes me feel much more confident that (although it maybe tricky and take time!) it should not be impossible with enough thought and patience...!

I like the hay bale distraction idea, too - my two will not be able to resist jumping up on the bales, for sure...
[funnily enough, I already do the old 'spray with weak fairy liquid' trick on the roses for the darn aphids, so I guess that can't hurt to try either!]

...J&B, yes, they are a lot of fun if also a bit naughty! Smart though; they will even come and find me in another room in the house to tell me they want to go back to bed/back out to the aviary when they're 'done' of an evening, and will then go and sit by the french doors ready for me to open them to walk them back up the garden to bed.

I will keep you all posted/report back as and when I take the first steps!

Mx
 
Thanks for all the encouraging advice, everyone - this makes me feel much more confident that (although it maybe tricky and take time!) it should not be impossible with enough thought and patience...!

I like the hay bale distraction idea, too - my two will not be able to resist jumping up on the bales, for sure...
[funnily enough, I already do the old 'spray with weak fairy liquid' trick on the roses for the darn aphids, so I guess that can't hurt to try either!]

...J&B, yes, they are a lot of fun if also a bit naughty! Smart though; they will even come and find me in another room in the house to tell me they want to go back to bed/back out to the aviary when they're 'done' of an evening, and will then go and sit by the french doors ready for me to open them to walk them back up the garden to bed.

I will keep you all posted/report back as and when I take the first steps!

Mx


Looking back here ....... How are you Squishies?? :wave:
 
Hello hello!

Spooky timing, I was just about to start a new thread to introduce this little rescue fella:
IMG_3535_zpsvl53x8yd.jpg

IMG_3557_zpsuallogyq.jpg


(no idea whether these photos will display properly but worth a try!)

He has been checked over by the vet and is generally ok (he was a tiny bit malnourished - he had been fed mostly muesli - but as you can see from photo 2, he is delighted by his new diet of forage and veg!), and has had his jabs, but he needs to be neutered before I can introduce him to the naughty pair.
[guessing I need to give it 2 months post 'snip' before introductions?]

So currently we have mayhem in the house, as I have given him my front room, away from the others, so as to allow the naughties access to the usual parts of the garden/house such that they don't suspect anything is up, (and I have to completely change/shower between spending time with each set of bunnies to avoid any smells giving the game away)...

Interestingly, 'new bun' doesn't chin rub or scent anything, whereas the original pair (see Honey yesterday, chinning a totally fresh piece of cardboard box in the lounge for no apparent reason other than to stake a claim!!) will scent anything that comes in to the house, even it has been nowhere near other animals:
IMG_3558_zpsuifmhujl.jpg


...I will introduce new bun and his story properly on a fresh thread :)

Hoping all's well with you and your troop!

Mx x
 
Hello hello!

Spooky timing, I was just about to start a new thread to introduce this little rescue fella:
IMG_3535_zpsvl53x8yd.jpg

IMG_3557_zpsuallogyq.jpg


(no idea whether these photos will display properly but worth a try!)

He has been checked over by the vet and is generally ok (he was a tiny bit malnourished - he had been fed mostly muesli - but as you can see from photo 2, he is delighted by his new diet of forage and veg!), and has had his jabs, but he needs to be neutered before I can introduce him to the naughty pair.
[guessing I need to give it 2 months post 'snip' before introductions?]

So currently we have mayhem in the house, as I have given him my front room, away from the others, so as to allow the naughties access to the usual parts of the garden/house such that they don't suspect anything is up, (and I have to completely change/shower between spending time with each set of bunnies to avoid any smells giving the game away)...

Interestingly, 'new bun' doesn't chin rub or scent anything, whereas the original pair (see Honey yesterday, chinning a totally fresh piece of cardboard box in the lounge for no apparent reason other than to stake a claim!!) will scent anything that comes in to the house, even it has been nowhere near other animals:
IMG_3558_zpsuifmhujl.jpg


...I will introduce new bun and his story properly on a fresh thread :)

Hoping all's well with you and your troop!

Mx x


:wave:

Lovely to hear from you again :D

I can't wait for more info and photos. You brave person! I'm glad you're going for it again and being ultra careful.

I always leave a couple of months post neuter. If you want to be really safe then leave three, but two should be enough. Did he come from a rescue centre? If so, I'm surprised they released him without neutering first.

Has he had his jabs? Presume not?
 
:wave: hola!

Yes, mega careful is the way this time! ...I also figured at least 2 months post-neuter, and will be taking all the rabbits to my parents' house for the week to ensure complete neutrality.

He was a "Gumtree rescue", and was simply too beautiful to pass by -- classic case of designer bunny being purchased for a young child, who had quickly lost interest, and poor mum was struggling to look after him/unsure of best way to care for a rabbit. He was in a tiny cage and his nails were all grown round, poor little mite. He is currently having a ball binkying in my lounge and discovering new leafy foods, which is all proving a delight to behold, although really hard work keeping them all separate for so long.

...I got him checked over by Daisy at the vets, as I was worried about his teeth if he hadn't been on hay (they're fine), and we did his combined jabs to start with.
I was thinking of getting him in to be snipped next week.

Did the photos work, does anyone know what breed he is?
I think he is a Netherland dwarf smoke pearl marten, but really I don't mind/just curious, I just fell in love with him really!
...I don't know what I'm going to do if the other two munchkins do not accept him. I think he will be a good little match for Honey, as he is active but with a very good-natured temperament, but Einstein can be a real grump sometimes, even towards Honey, so who knows?!

Mx x
 
:wave: hola!

Yes, mega careful is the way this time! ...I also figured at least 2 months post-neuter, and will be taking all the rabbits to my parents' house for the week to ensure complete neutrality.

He was a "Gumtree rescue", and was simply too beautiful to pass by -- classic case of designer bunny being purchased for a young child, who had quickly lost interest, and poor mum was struggling to look after him/unsure of best way to care for a rabbit. He was in a tiny cage and his nails were all grown round, poor little mite. He is currently having a ball binkying in my lounge and discovering new leafy foods, which is all proving a delight to behold, although really hard work keeping them all separate for so long.

...I got him checked over by Daisy at the vets, as I was worried about his teeth if he hadn't been on hay (they're fine), and we did his combined jabs to start with.
I was thinking of getting him in to be snipped next week.

Did the photos work, does anyone know what breed he is?
I think he is a Netherland dwarf smoke pearl marten, but really I don't mind/just curious, I just fell in love with him really!
...I don't know what I'm going to do if the other two munchkins do not accept him. I think he will be a good little match for Honey, as he is active but with a very good-natured temperament, but Einstein can be a real grump sometimes, even towards Honey, so who knows?!

Mx x


Daisy :)

Did she say how old he might be, or did the owner tell you?

His breed - bit of a mix I would say, but you're probably mainly right :) His ears are a bit long and body shape a bit slim for a true Nethie, but only having rescue buns I'm no expert on breeds!

I really hope he matches up with the other two. Your gut told you it was the right thing to do :)

Did you have to travel far for him?
 
Likewise, I don't really know too much beyond the basic breeds, I have to say!
...I quite like that his ears are a bit bigger than a true Nethie, and I think he's a touch bigger and leaner - he's basically "more rabbity", he sort of looks like a cartoon rabbit sometimes!

Yes, M H, he's just so stunning, I don't really mind what he is, I just *needed* him!
...he is a bit grumpy today (despite having 4 times the space he used to, plus play time in the lounge! he likes to climb the sofa and sit atop like a little mountain goat), and has done much paper shredding for me {thank you little one, that's just what I needed?!}. Ungrateful little furball <joke> ~ what is it with rabbits that the more space you give them, the more they want??!

Yes, MM, I really like Daisy, she's really dedicated; takes it all very seriously/understands just how complex bunnies are, and if she's ever unsure (I often ask very odd questions!), she will always look in to it for you and call you with an update.

Not far really, this side of London. The owners were well-intended and doing their best; I think they'd been given some really bad advice from the breeder actually, (including to feed him muesli and keep him on his own), so it really wasn't their fault, they wanted the best for him and I think the time involved in looking after him came as bit of a shock. They were very honest and sweet, and were very conscientious in seeing lots of 'applicants' before letting him go.
 
Likewise, I don't really know too much beyond the basic breeds, I have to say!
...I quite like that his ears are a bit bigger than a true Nethie, and I think he's a touch bigger and leaner - he's basically "more rabbity", he sort of looks like a cartoon rabbit sometimes!

Yes, M H, he's just so stunning, I don't really mind what he is, I just *needed* him!
...he is a bit grumpy today (despite having 4 times the space he used to, plus play time in the lounge! he likes to climb the sofa and sit atop like a little mountain goat), and has done much paper shredding for me {thank you little one, that's just what I needed?!}. Ungrateful little furball <joke> ~ what is it with rabbits that the more space you give them, the more they want??!

Yes, MM, I really like Daisy, she's really dedicated; takes it all very seriously/understands just how complex bunnies are, and if she's ever unsure (I often ask very odd questions!), she will always look in to it for you and call you with an update.

Not far really, this side of London. The owners were well-intended and doing their best; I think they'd been given some really bad advice from the breeder actually, (including to feed him muesli and keep him on his own), so it really wasn't their fault, they wanted the best for him and I think the time involved in looking after him came as bit of a shock. They were very honest and sweet, and were very conscientious in seeing lots of 'applicants' before letting him go.


Well having spoken with you M, I know how utterly dedicated you are :)

Tell me, having the little one now, do you think you'll find a use for those 'redundant' CC panels? ;)
 
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