I think something is wrong with Lola UD 24/3 Kidneys???

Dear Newbabybuns,

I am sorry your Lola is having issues and causing you to worry. When she has her episodes of tummy pressing and gas she may be in pain. I had a bunny who got regular stints of stasis. She would be eating like food was going out of style followed by periods of gas and stomach pressing. What worked best for my bunny was to manage her pain so she would continue to move around on her own before it became serious, additional fluids sub-Q (my vet showed me how), motility agents short term if required, and not allowing her to binge eat everything in one sitting by portioning her food to morning, after work, and before bedtime. I also limited the variety of food she was given because even small dietary changes would give her gas/pain/not wanting to exercise/stasis. Also, if your bunny has any arthritis she may not want to move around as often and lack of exercise can impact her digestive process to some extent. Pain relief can help that issue too since losing muscle can cause bones to look pointy. In fact, I once owned a bunny who lost the use of his back legs--over time, without physical therapy, his lower and upper body looked like they were from two different bunnies.

There can be a lot of reasons for a 0.15kg weight difference between just two weights. It would not worry me unless it became a trend.

Sending you and Lola some positive vibes.

Thank you for sharing about your bunny, bunny momma. That is great you were taught to administer Sub Q fluids. xxx

Her tummy is feeling pretty normal now, like her abdomen has refilled and her bones aren't feeling prominent at all now. She has peed and pooped and is sat in her comfy resting position rather than laid out. How much is her being genuinely better and how much it is because it is being masked by painkillers I don't know, but she looks a lot better thankfully. I am so scared it will suddenly happen again though and I won't see, it comes on so quickly.

I'm wondering if this is still a knock on effect from two/three (I'm confused now it's past midnight here!) days ago where she slept nearly all day and perhaps her system got sluggish then. I don't think she binged on food today, (I give it separately too).

I am wondering if she has megacolon underlying. I have been reading a bit about it today and looking at pictures of bunny poo (!) and it certainly seems to fit with how sensitive she is to most food and the awful poopy mush she produces at times if she has had anything other than her safe food. I wonder if that has anything to do with it and these random stasis episodes (although this week has not fit her normal pattern at all). I have also noticed when her tummy feels soft and palpable and I have massaged it gently it seems to contract and go harder for a bit. Like Braxton hicks in pregnancy and it almost feels like it is changing shape in the palm of my hand.

Thank you for the positive vibes also xxx

oh no, sorry to hear you ended up at the emergency vets. but glad she is now eating again.

the amount of weight loss might be the start of something, but i'd only be more concerned if it continued in a downward pattern, or she suddenly had one big loss x

nbb, has your vet checked for any kind of urinary tract infection or sludge in the bladder/kidney issues? The symptoms you describe remind me of when Pip has had her bad stasis episodes that were actually triggered by bladder problems. I cannot feed her veggies like kale because it makes it worse for her, or timothy hay either-same result, but her tummy 'sucks in' like what you are describing and she flattens herself and will not eat...when the episode passes (if it does without intervention, last time it happened she was in hospital overnight for fluids and meds) she is back to her boisterous self.

I'd have it checked to be sure. Kind of a wild hunch and maybe nothing, but best safe than sorry. I hope Lola will be feeling more herself and back to normal very soon. xxxxx

MimzMum said:

nbb, has your vet checked for any kind of urinary tract infection or sludge in the bladder/kidney issues? The symptoms you describe remind me of when Pip has had her bad stasis episodes that were actually triggered by bladder problems. I cannot feed her veggies like kale because it makes it worse for her, or timothy hay either-same result, but her tummy 'sucks in' like what you are describing and she flattens herself and will not eat...when the episode passes (if it does without intervention, last time it happened she was in hospital overnight for fluids and meds) she is back to her boisterous self.

I'd have it checked to be sure. Kind of a wild hunch and maybe nothing, but best safe than sorry. I hope Lola will be feeling more herself and back to normal very soon. xxxxx

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Yes, a bladder problem came to mind for me too. I hope that Lola will be feeling a lot better soon xx

Sending vibes x

newbabybuns said:

Thank you for sharing about your bunny, bunny momma. That is great you were taught to administer Sub Q fluids. xxx

Her tummy is feeling pretty normal now, like her abdomen has refilled and her bones aren't feeling prominent at all now. She has peed and pooped and is sat in her comfy resting position rather than laid out. How much is her being genuinely better and how much it is because it is being masked by painkillers I don't know, but she looks a lot better thankfully. I am so scared it will suddenly happen again though and I won't see, it comes on so quickly.

I'm wondering if this is still a knock on effect from two/three (I'm confused now it's past midnight here!) days ago where she slept nearly all day and perhaps her system got sluggish then. I don't think she binged on food today, (I give it separately too).

I am wondering if she has megacolon underlying. I have been reading a bit about it today and looking at pictures of bunny poo (!) and it certainly seems to fit with how sensitive she is to most food and the awful poopy mush she produces at times if she has had anything other than her safe food. I wonder if that has anything to do with it and these random stasis episodes (although this week has not fit her normal pattern at all). I have also noticed when her tummy feels soft and palpable and I have massaged it gently it seems to contract and go harder for a bit. Like Braxton hicks in pregnancy and it almost feels like it is changing shape in the palm of my hand.

Thank you for the positive vibes also xxx

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I'm really sorry to hear you had to visit the emergency vet, just after you were thinking things had settled.

You may have a point about megacolon, and it sounds a bit like one of my bunnies. Sensitivity to a lot of foods is the key.

It's so difficult to get to the bottom (sorry!) of their problems, as sometimes there's more than one going on.

MimzMum has suggested urinary issues, and you could get the vet to test a bit of urine when you are next there, and especially if it happens again and you've noticed her straining to wee at all.

biscandmatt1 said:

oh no, sorry to hear you ended up at the emergency vets. but glad she is now eating again.

the amount of weight loss might be the start of something, but i'd only be more concerned if it continued in a downward pattern, or she suddenly had one big loss x

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Thank you xx thinking about it she weighed more in August too (I think she was 3.3kg) so maybe this is something I need to bring up with the vet to have a check back on throughout her records, and keep a closer eye on.

MimzMum said:

nbb, has your vet checked for any kind of urinary tract infection or sludge in the bladder/kidney issues? The symptoms you describe remind me of when Pip has had her bad stasis episodes that were actually triggered by bladder problems. I cannot feed her veggies like kale because it makes it worse for her, or timothy hay either-same result, but her tummy 'sucks in' like what you are describing and she flattens herself and will not eat...when the episode passes (if it does without intervention, last time it happened she was in hospital overnight for fluids and meds) she is back to her boisterous self.

I'd have it checked to be sure. Kind of a wild hunch and maybe nothing, but best safe than sorry. I hope Lola will be feeling more herself and back to normal very soon. xxxxx

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Jack's-Jane said:

Yes, a bladder problem came to mind for me too. I hope that Lola will be feeling a lot better soon xx

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Thank you both for the suggestions. I hadn't even considered anything like that. I think I will take her in to our normal vet and put it to him. Hopefully this Baytril may keep something like that at bay? I'm dubious of 4 day courses that the emergency vet gave us last night being enough, but I guess ours could extend it if he felt that would be beneficial.

MimzMum I'm glad you know what I meant about the tummy seeming sucked in, I get the impression the vets think I'm a bit crazy when I say it. It's like a deflated balloon, totally empty, a soft and squishy empty sack, and sometimes I can feel it filling back up in my hand when she has it happen. Certainly when I rang them last night it was empty, her bones were sticking out, it was as if nothing was inbetween them. By the time we got there her tummy was round and full again. I just don't understand the science of it, as to where it all goes when it's empty. I wish I knew!

daphnephoebe said:

Sending vibes x

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Thank you xx

newbabybuns said:

Thank you both for the suggestions. I hadn't even considered anything like that. I think I will take her in to our normal vet and put it to him. Hopefully this Baytril may keep something like that at bay? I'm dubious of 4 day courses that the emergency vet gave us last night being enough, but I guess ours could extend it if he felt that would be beneficial.

MimzMum I'm glad you know what I meant about the tummy seeming sucked in, I get the impression the vets think I'm a bit crazy when I say it. It's like a deflated balloon, totally empty, a soft and squishy empty sack, and sometimes I can feel it filling back up in my hand when she has it happen. Certainly when I rang them last night it was empty, her bones were sticking out, it was as if nothing was inbetween them. By the time we got there her tummy was round and full again. I just don't understand the science of it, as to where it all goes when it's empty. I wish I knew!

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I can't see a four day course of Baytril being any good for anything to be honest. But I expect he thought it would tide you over until you saw your regular vet maybe?

MightyMax said:

I'm really sorry to hear you had to visit the emergency vet, just after you were thinking things had settled.

You may have a point about megacolon, and it sounds a bit like one of my bunnies. Sensitivity to a lot of foods is the key.

It's so difficult to get to the bottom (sorry!) of their problems, as sometimes there's more than one going on.

MimzMum has suggested urinary issues, and you could get the vet to test a bit of urine when you are next there, and especially if it happens again and you've noticed her straining to wee at all.

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I know, I think I jinxed myself! It happened so fast aswell, and scared my 12 year old to death as she noticed it first. I am paranoid now that it will happen any second, especially as OH is out working. I saw on a job website my vet is searching for someone to do out of hours work at their practice which will be so much easier and more reassuring having them there, than having to drive 40 mins away down little country roads to the current OOH vets!

Yes with Lola, she has become intolerant to more and more things over the last couple of years. After a bit of trial and error of working out what she'd had the day before etc, I stopped giving it, just gave basic hay and pellets until her tummy was normal again, I had mentioned to the vet every now and then, like even the smallest chunk of carrot she absolutely cannot tolerate now. What she produces after is gross, and smells terrible too. We just sort of left it as thinking well it is sugary and only the occasional treat really so no biggie not to have anymore without really thinking, 'hang on, is there something more going on here'. Definitely time to get to the bottom of everything!

MightyMax said:

I can't see a four day course of Baytril being any good for anything to be honest. But I expect he thought it would tide you over until you saw your regular vet maybe?

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Sorry MightyMax, I was still typing out your reply while you were posting this. Yes, it could have been what they were thinking.

I have had to go to work today, but she she has eaten, and pooped a lot! She is a little quieter than normal, but had a late night/trauma of a car trip and being fed yucky medicine, so maybe to be expected. She actually just 'asked' for more pellets (she sits next to the empty bowl!) so I gave her a few and she has started eating them, so hopefully that is a good sign that she doesn't feel too off.

Hello, might be bacterial infection in the gut. I give my rabbit the choice of dandelions and I use pure zeolite and use a light therapy instrument. Kale is a great nutrient and my rabbits love it and also Carvelo Nero cabbage. But dandelions are a great blood cleaner. See what the vet says. Let your rabbit on the soil and watch what he/she does, sometimes they will eat it to clear the infection. Some cat litters contains zeolite. I'm not saying your rabbit will definitely eat it, but its worth observing if he/she goes for it.

Accrington1947 said:

Hello, might be bacterial infection in the gut. I give my rabbit the choice of dandelions and I use pure zeolite and use a light therapy instrument. Kale is a great nutrient and my rabbits love it and also Carvelo Nero cabbage. But dandelions are a great blood cleaner. See what the vet says. Let your rabbit on the soil and watch what he/she does, sometimes they will eat it to clear the infection. Some cat litters contains zeolite. I'm not saying your rabbit will definitely eat it, but its worth observing if he/she goes for it.

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Do you mean the rabbit will eat the soil or the zeolite - I have noticed rabbits eating soil at times.

I lost all track of time and didn't think I had been away from the thread for so long! Thank you Acrington for mentioning the dandelions, she has been having a small amount of dried dandelion after I read that, but does not have access to soil to test her with that.

To update as to where we are now, Lola has been on Sulfratrim incase of a UTI - she had been doing quite dark wees in small amounts, although I had been giving her more kale (soaked in water for extra fluid) and dried dandelion so that could account for the darker urine. While on the course of Sulfratrim she went off her SS pellets, she would eat them slowly, but was absolutely wolfing down hay. Now she has finished the Sulfratrim she is eating pellets again and while off them she was picking at them, but now is back eating at her regular times.

I have however just booked her in for blood tests on Tuesday (damn Easter holidays) as something is just not right and I am very concerned it is something terribly wrong with her kidneys. She is now producing bigger wees again, but some have been very clear, almost too clear for her, and the weightloss I felt right at the start of this thread is definitely there. It's like the space between her ribs/back legs are definitely more bony. She has a nice full tummy, her spine does not feel prominent so that is something but these side bits just feel wrong. She is not drinking any extra I don't think.

Do you have any experience of renal problems/outcomes? I have made myself scared silly reading through old threads on here and am crying again! I am so scared to lose another bunny it does sound like it though doesn't it, with the weightloss and clear urine