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Help! Just had babies!! WARNING: contains a picture of a dead baby rabbit (sorry)

R

russhill

Young Bun
Hi there, sorry to just join and immediately ask questions but we're so new to having rabbits and we need advice!

We have 2 lovely Netherland Dwarf rabbits (Frisky and Cookie) who we were assured were both male, but this morning, Frisky is now a proud mom of 3 new babies!!!

I've read SOME info on the web and the suggestions vary, but ultimately it seems we must separate the mom and dad so there's no chance of more babies being made and any fighting/injury to the babies.

Cookie was seemingly heartbroken about being apart from Frisky and the babies and just sat around moping, so I made a wire mesh partition for their hutch and put it in with Frisky and the babies on one side and Cookie on the other.

Cookie was really not happy about this arrangement and has been thumping his feet and running back and forth to the mesh. Both he and Frisky have been looking through it at each other.

I am not sure if I have done the best thing or made more stress :(

Does anyone have any advice?

As I say, Cookie seems dreadfully sad when he's taken away from the hutch, but when put back in but separated, he's not settling either.

We're definitely not wanting to make mom or dad stressed!

Thanks

Russell
 
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Welcome to RU Russell. You've definitely done the right thing to separate ...your doe is at her most fertile after giving birth. i understand your sadness at shutting Cookie out but you don't really have a choice. Good luck
 
russhill said:
Hi there, sorry to just join and immediately ask questions but we're so new to having rabbits and we need advice!

We have 2 lovely Netherland Dwarf rabbits (Frisky and Cookie) who we were assured were both male, but this morning, Frisky is now a proud mom of 3 new babies!!!

I've read SOME info on the web and the suggestions vary, but ultimately it seems we must separate the mom and dad so there's no chance of more babies being made and any fighting/injury to the babies.

Cookie was seemingly heartbroken about being apart from Frisky and the babies and just sat around moping, so I made a wire mesh partition for their hutch and put it in with Frisky and the babies on one side and Cookie on the other.

Cookie was really not happy about this arrangement and has been thumping his feet and running back and forth to the mesh. Both he and Frisky have been looking through it at each other.

I am not sure if I have done the best thing or made more stress :(

Does anyone have any advice?

As I say, Cookie seems dreadfully sad when he's taken away from the hutch, but when put back in but separated, he's not settling either.

We're definitely not wanting to make mom or dad stressed!

Thanks

Russell
Click to expand...

It really is essential that Cookie is kept away from Frisky now as he could easily impregnate her again, she will be extremely fertile immediately after kindling. I would move Cookie as far away as possible as the smell of Frisky will drive him crazy and he'll be very frustrated as he'll be desperate to mate with her.

Whilst Frisky is raising her litter you could arrange to have Cookie neutered so there will not be any more accidents. Bucks can remain fertile for 4-6 weeks AFTER castration, so he will need to remain away from Frisky during that time. That would also allow her to raise her litter in peace.

This thread may be useful for you to take a look at :

http://forums.rabbitrehome.org.uk/showthread.php?327923-Accidental-Litters-and-Taking-on-Babies

Good luck !
 
As hard as it is, yes, they definitely need to be separated. As an aside, I don't know if you had a good look around your doe's nest. My doe had two separate litters of three each in two different spots in her nest. I put all six kits together. I believe I read that does can kindle two litters within 24 hours, too? Definitely have your buck neutered in the meantime. It was quick and simple for my buck, thankfully - I was more upset than he was, but he was back to being Jiji very quickly. Good luck with your kits. It is an amazing and learning-filled opportunity to see how incredible life is for a bunny from their very first moment on Earth. Good luck!
 
njbunnymom said:
As hard as it is, yes, they definitely need to be separated. As an aside, I don't know if you had a good look around your doe's nest. My doe had two separate litters of three each in two different spots in her nest. I put all six kits together. I believe I read that does can kindle two litters within 24 hours, too? Definitely have your buck neutered in the meantime. It was quick and simple for my buck, thankfully - I was more upset than he was, but he was back to being Jiji very quickly. Good luck with your kits. It is an amazing and learning-filled opportunity to see how incredible life is for a bunny from their very first moment on Earth. Good luck!
Click to expand...

Thanks for the info (and to everyone else who commented).

Frisky made her nest in the hutch which is outside, in the bedroom in the hay. She lined it with plenty of fur and the babies are now covered in even more fur that she has been putting on top since she had them. We can't actually see the kits!

I was wondering if she and the babies should stay outside? They seem to have made a nice home, but I don't want them to get cold!
 
russhill said:
Thanks for the info (and to everyone else who commented).

Frisky made her nest in the hutch which is outside, in the bedroom in the hay. She lined it with plenty of fur and the babies are now covered in even more fur that she has been putting on top since she had them. We can't actually see the kits!

I was wondering if she and the babies should stay outside? They seem to have made a nice home, but I don't want them to get cold!
Click to expand...

Is their accommodation well insulated and free from damp ? If so and there is plenty of thick hay/straw bedding provided they should be OK outside.
 
joey&boo said:
Welcome to RU Russell. You've definitely done the right thing to separate ...your doe is at her most fertile after giving birth. i understand your sadness at shutting Cookie out but you don't really have a choice. Good luck
Click to expand...

This is absolutely the right advice :thumb:
 
Jack's-Jane said:
Is their accommodation well insulated and free from damp ? If so and there is plenty of thick hay/straw bedding provided they should be OK outside.
Click to expand...

The hutch has a special cover on it that has flaps that roll down to cover the open mesh so they can be kept warmer at night. I put extra hay in the bedroom with the kits so Frisky can organise it how she wants...hopefully that's ok...
 
russhill said:
Thanks for the info (and to everyone else who commented).

Frisky made her nest in the hutch which is outside, in the bedroom in the hay. She lined it with plenty of fur and the babies are now covered in even more fur that she has been putting on top since she had them. We can't actually see the kits!

I was wondering if she and the babies should stay outside? They seem to have made a nice home, but I don't want them to get cold!
Click to expand...

As long as you've put plenty of bedding (hay and straw) in there, things should be OK :thumb:

.... and welcome to the Forum :wave:
 
russhill said:
The hutch has a special cover on it that has flaps that roll down to cover the open mesh so they can be kept warmer at night. I put extra hay in the bedroom with the kits so Frisky can organise it how she wants...hopefully that's ok...
Click to expand...

It sounds as though they will be fine then. It is generally better not to move the nest unless absolutely essential xx
 
New day...new question ;-)

Hi again everyone, first off thanks again for all the advice and information, you're all really helpful!

I was wondering if anyone had thoughts on a couple of things:

1. is it "normal" for the mom to cover the babies completely in fur? How can they feed/be cleaned by mom?
2. is it okay to take mom out of the hutch where the nest is and let her have a run in the garden run or be cuddled by the family (our twin boys are the rabbits owners) for a short time - if so, is there any limit to the time she should be apart from the babies?
3. we have separated mom and dad as soon after the birth as we could. As mentioned above, they are still in the same hutch but have a mesh division between them and are always to be found sitting either side of the mesh next to each other. Is there any way they could have a play date as long as they are watched like a hawk to make sure there's no hanky-panky? We plan to get dad neutered ASAP this week but realise there's a definite wait before they can be back together properly so wanted them to be able to snuggle and clean each other if possible.

My wife and I have had a sleepless night worrying about the new family outside and our responsibilities to them. It's a blessing in many ways, but stressful in others.

Thanks

Russ
 
It is completely normal for Mum to cover babies, maybe in very hot weather she might open up the nest for air, but at this time of year she will know best. She knows how to feed and keep her babies clean and doesn't need any help :thumb: It is ok for Mum to have some exercise, but this weather is not nice and she would probably get wet and maybe muddy, so I personally would not want her running around at this stage.

You can NOT asllow Mum and Dad to spend any time together whatsoever, it takes a spliy second for Dad to iompregnante Mum and then you will have even more problems. As Jack's-Jane rercommended, Dad would be best kept well away from Mum as mesh doesn't always prevent rabbits from getting to one another. The urge for Dad to mate again could be very strong so please bear this in mind. You feel cruel but it's better to be cruel to be kind at times.

Try to give Mum peace and no stress, she will appreciate some fresh food if she is used to eating it already.

Babies will start to emerge from the nest around 2.5 to 3 weeks old. They will start to nibble Mum's food and they will be very cute and very small, being Netherlands. Please make sure your boys understand (sorry, don't know how old they are) what they can and cannot do with regard to Mum and her babies.

Please let us know how everything is progressing.:thumb:
 
Thanks for the reply, much appreciated. Our boys are 9 yrs old and whilst they are very excited about having baby rabbits around, they're still drawn by the ever-present Minecraft, so are easily distracted away from the new bunny family ;-)

Understood about keeping mom and dad apart, we'll make sure that is the case.

You are right about the weather, it never seems to stop raining! Is it okay to get mom out for cuddles and maybe a hop round in the house though - this would be away from the babies so don't know if this might stress her more than the exercise is doing her good...
 
I wouldn't worry about the lack of exercise - keeping her safe at this time is more important so she can bring her babies up. They crave Dandelion leaves and grass at a time like this if you have a safe source.
 
UPDATE: we moved the blanket of fur to check on the kits and sadly, one was dead :(

We removed him/her and double/triple checked.

There are 2 lively ones still scrabbling around under the fur now.

Fingers crossed these 2 survive!
 
Oh! I'm sorry you lost a little one. I hope mom and the two remaining kits are doing well. The growth process over the next 10 to 20 days is nothing short of amazing. I had my two children take lots of photos when we had our surprise litter, especially because we ended up hand-feeding our runt who remarkably survived and now lives with us. Mama knows just what to do with her kits. We have dwarfs, too. Even though she was young, our doe, Grace, really knew what to do as a mama. It seems like indifference when you compare typical mammal mothering behavior, but they behave that that way to avoid predation. In the wild, if a mother rabbit fussed too much over her kits, it would draw the attention of predators. That's why you'll only see her nursing once or twice a day, standing over her kits, then getting back to whatever she was doing seemingly "ignoring" her babies. Nothing much happens for the first ten days (except you'll see your kits getting larger and larger) - and they by day ten or so, they'll start to open their eyes and you'll begin seeing their unique personalities begin to emerge.

Absolutely keep papa rabbit away from his mate. Our buck came home from his neuter and Grace kindled a week later. He was still wanting to mate her even though he was neutered - his drive was still initially there for about a week or two post surgery!

One thing to add - make sure your doe has lots and lots of fresh water. She'll be drinking more than usual to support her nutritional/nursing needs.
 
njbunnymom said:
Oh! I'm sorry you lost a little one. I hope mom and the two remaining kits are doing well. The growth process over the next 10 to 20 days is nothing short of amazing. I had my two children take lots of photos when we had our surprise litter, especially because we ended up hand-feeding our runt who remarkably survived and now lives with us. Mama knows just what to do with her kits. We have dwarfs, too. Even though she was young, our doe, Grace, really knew what to do as a mama. It seems like indifference when you compare typical mammal mothering behavior, but they behave that that way to avoid predation. In the wild, if a mother rabbit fussed too much over her kits, it would draw the attention of predators. That's why you'll only see her nursing once or twice a day, standing over her kits, then getting back to whatever she was doing seemingly "ignoring" her babies. Nothing much happens for the first ten days (except you'll see your kits getting larger and larger) - and they by day ten or so, they'll start to open their eyes and you'll begin seeing their unique personalities begin to emerge.

Absolutely keep papa rabbit away from his mate. Our buck came home from his neuter and Grace kindled a week later. He was still wanting to mate her even though he was neutered - his drive was still initially there for about a week or two post surgery!

One thing to add - make sure your doe has lots and lots of fresh water. She'll be drinking more than usual to support her nutritional/nursing needs.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the info!

It's typical of course that we've had a very mild winter so far and as soon as Frisky has a litter it starts getting colder and colder. We've topped up the hay in the bedroom and put the hutch cover flaps down earlier in the evening than normal to try and keep things a little warmer in the hutch for her. I guess she'll top up the fur on the babies if she thinks it's getting colder, but we're still worried for her and them.

The breeder where we got Frisky and Cookie from said she's had moms give birth and raise a litter in an outside hutch when there's been a frost, so I guess bun moms know what they are doing.
 
Sorry you found 1 baby dead, it's really only if they are out of the nest they get cold, sometimes they are still attached to Mum whilst feeding and she runs out of the nest and they fall onto the hutch floor.
 
Lost another baby today :(

We checked the nest this morning and things seemed okay - 2 little babies, both moving.

I noticed mid-morning that Frisky (the mom) was spending a lot of time in the bedroom with the nest, when previously she'd been ignoring it. I put this down to her feeding, so left things alone. Just now she was outside the bedroom so we peeped in and there was one of the little babies outside the warm nest. He/she was stone cold and unmoving. I picked him out and checked closely and he's gone :(

So sad. From 3 little babies down to 1.

I was very much wondering if this one was a peanut though as he has signs of narrow hind quarters - sorry, I'm only quoting what I just read on the internet about abnormal kits...

Would it be terrible of me to post a link to a picture of this little kit so someone could confirm if he/she was a peanut? It's no consolation, but maybe he was and he died naturally and Frisky pulled him out of the nest? Is that possible? If he wasn't a peanut, maybe this was a tragic accident where he got knocked out the nest when feeding...
 
I wouldn't mind you posting a photo, I don't think anyone else would? Sorry you have lost another baby - how old is Mum btw?
 
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