Advice for respiratory infection

Hi Guys, so one of my bunnies Nomnom I noticed on sunday he was breathing really noisy especially when he eats. He's 4 years old, male, neutered and was vaccinated around a month ago. I also put some advantage flea treatment on him 2 weeks ago as I noticed some cat fleas on them. Strange thing is he has not been sneezing and has no nasal discharge that I have noticed.

I gave him 2mls dog metacam and 2mls septrin on sunday evening (I had half a bottle in) and took him to the vet on monday morning. They advised me to carry on with the metacam and septrin and they gave him a depocillin injection which lasts a week. They listened to his chest and said it sounded noisy which I can hear also when putting my ear to his side. He sounds like a pig...really snorty and snuffly.

He is eating ok but I can tell he doesn't feel too well...he's resting more than usual and smells a little like he's been laying in his own wee.

The vet said if there was no improvement by wednesday they will take him in and put him under a GA and have a proper look in his nose/mouth.

My question is that is this the best course of action if the abx doesn't seem to have improved anything?

Lady Logamorph said:

Hi Guys, so one of my bunnies Nomnom I noticed on sunday he was breathing really noisy especially when he eats. He's 4 years old, male, neutered and was vaccinated around a month ago. I also put some advantage flea treatment on him 2 weeks ago as I noticed some cat fleas on them. Strange thing is he has not been sneezing and has no nasal discharge that I have noticed.

I gave him 2mls dog metacam and 2mls septrin on sunday evening (I had half a bottle in) and took him to the vet on monday morning. They advised me to carry on with the metacam and septrin and they gave him a depocillin injection which lasts a week. They listened to his chest and said it sounded noisy which I can hear also when putting my ear to his side. He sounds like a pig...really snorty and snuffly.

He is eating ok but I can tell he doesn't feel too well...he's resting more than usual and smells a little like he's been laying in his own wee.

The vet said if there was no improvement by wednesday they will take him in and put him under a GA and have a proper look in his nose/mouth.

My question is that is this the best course of action if the abx doesn't seem to have improved anything?

Click to expand...

I'm sorry to hear about Nomnom

To begin with, I know of no Depocillin which lasts a week. I have always given it either every day, or every other day. Some vets recommend every three days but I wouldn't be happy with that.

I agree with the septrin, and that it should start making a difference within a few days. However, I would be cautious about a GA. What you've described is a lowered immune response - having the noisy breathing, the vaccination and flea treatment. That's quite a lot for a bun to take on board.

I would give some echincea and perhaps a bit longer with the abx (and more frequent doses of Depocillin) before I would think about GA. However, if you do opt for it, I would have some X-rays done at the same time.

Lady Logamorph said:

Hi Guys, so one of my bunnies Nomnom I noticed on sunday he was breathing really noisy especially when he eats. He's 4 years old, male, neutered and was vaccinated around a month ago. I also put some advantage flea treatment on him 2 weeks ago as I noticed some cat fleas on them. Strange thing is he has not been sneezing and has no nasal discharge that I have noticed.

I gave him 2mls dog metacam and 2mls septrin on sunday evening (I had half a bottle in) and took him to the vet on monday morning. They advised me to carry on with the metacam and septrin and they gave him a depocillin injection which lasts a week. They listened to his chest and said it sounded noisy which I can hear also when putting my ear to his side. He sounds like a pig...really snorty and snuffly.

He is eating ok but I can tell he doesn't feel too well...he's resting more than usual and smells a little like he's been laying in his own wee.

The vet said if there was no improvement by wednesday they will take him in and put him under a GA and have a proper look in his nose/mouth.

My question is that is this the best course of action if the abx doesn't seem to have improved anything?

Click to expand...

It sounds as though the Vet is erring very much on the side of caution with giving Depocillin just once a weak. That regime is appropriate for some conditions, such as Treponematosis, but with RTIs much more frequent dosing is needed for any chance of efficacy. My Vet usually prescribes daily or every other day dosing. Personally I feel happier if daily dosing can be reduced to every other day after 7 days.

It may help to thin out and loosen mucus secretions to give Nomnom some Bisolvon, a mucolytic. This can be sprinkled on food or given in water syringed directly into the Rabbit. Obviously syringing anything into a Rabbit with a compromised respiration must be done with extreme caution due to the increased risk of a Rabbit with an RTI aspirating syringed feeds/meds etc. I am sure you are already aware of that though.

With regards to the GA, I would be reluctant to go down that path at this stage. The risk would be significant. I would prefer to give a more aggressive dose regime of Depocillin along with the Septrin for several more days first and review the situation then

The fact that you have noted a smell of urine about him, but no mention of urine soiling/incontinence etc, makes me wonder if he may have some renal problems going on. The RTI may be a secondary symptom. A full blood profile might shed some light on things-ie renal function, evidence of active bacterial infection. It is possible to take bloods from a Rabbit without the need for sedation.

If/when Nomnom does go under GA I would ask for chest Xrays to be taken, but as I mentioned, personally I would not want to take the risk of a GA just yet.

Lots of vibes for poorly Nomnom xx

Thankyou Mighty Max and Jane. I am going to ring the vets this morning and ask about the depocillin as he had it on monday so only 2 days ago so if I can get him in later then its not too long since his last one. I will also try the bisolvin I haven't used this before. Am I right in thinking it is a human medicine so can pick this up from the chemist? I will also ask about bloods and if they eventually do decide on a GA I will make sure I request a chest xray as well to avoid possibly another GA. I will also get some echincea...again do you normally just give the one for humans and in what form/dose?

I don't feel he is incontinent more that he is laying down in the corner of the run where one of my others tends to wee. This seems to be the area they sit in where they are not feeling well or grumpy because it's shaded in a corner. I think they feel more safe there. It's on grass so I have a feeling he's just getting more damp by laying on the grass.

Thanks guys xxx

Lady Logamorph said:

Thankyou Mighty Max and Jane. I am going to ring the vets this morning and ask about the depocillin as he had it on monday so only 2 days ago so if I can get him in later then its not too long since his last one. I will also try the bisolvin I haven't used this before. Am I right in thinking it is a human medicine so can pick this up from the chemist? I will also ask about bloods and if they eventually do decide on a GA I will make sure I request a chest xray as well to avoid possibly another GA. I will also get some echincea...again do you normally just give the one for humans and in what form/dose?

I don't feel he is incontinent more that he is laying down in the corner of the run where one of my others tends to wee. This seems to be the area they sit in where they are not feeling well or grumpy because it's shaded in a corner. I think they feel more safe there. It's on grass so I have a feeling he's just getting more damp by laying on the grass.

Thanks guys xxx

Click to expand...

Hello

You will need a prescription for Bisolvon. I didn't recommend it at this stage because there was no sneezing or mucous discharge from the nose. It would be good to establish where the issue is before prescribing it.

I normally give the echinacea herb a couple or three times daily. You can get herbal capsules and open them, or a herbal tincture.

I didn't suspect renal failure from the symptoms you describe, but if you want to get a blood test done, there's no harm. Just expense!

My vet (Twickenham) has recommended Depocillin every day for several weeks in the past with my rabbits. It's usually tolerated very well and can be very effective.

Lady Logamorph said:

Thankyou Mighty Max and Jane. I am going to ring the vets this morning and ask about the depocillin as he had it on monday so only 2 days ago so if I can get him in later then its not too long since his last one. I will also try the bisolvin I haven't used this before. Am I right in thinking it is a human medicine so can pick this up from the chemist? I will also ask about bloods and if they eventually do decide on a GA I will make sure I request a chest xray as well to avoid possibly another GA. I will also get some echincea...again do you normally just give the one for humans and in what form/dose?

I don't feel he is incontinent more that he is laying down in the corner of the run where one of my others tends to wee. This seems to be the area they sit in where they are not feeling well or grumpy because it's shaded in a corner. I think they feel more safe there. It's on grass so I have a feeling he's just getting more damp by laying on the grass.

Thanks guys xxx

Click to expand...

Bisolvon is a POM so you'd need to obtain it via your Vet. If the Vet does not keep it in stock they could order it in for you or give you a prescription to enable you to purchase it online. You only need to use a pinch of the powder a day, so you certainly wont need to buy a huge amount of sachets.

http://www.viovet.co.uk/Prescriptio...5Qe7V39MOyz8qs8vJwHbFpjvnVw6Yzsxr0aAih58P8HAQ

Nomnom is now on the depocillin every other day...the vet would not let me take the injection home so I'm taking him every other morning for it. They have also given me a sachet of bisolvin. The vet also thinks it's in the upper part of his chest when they last vet thought it was the lower part...I suppose because he is so noisy it's difficult to tell. We are carrying on with the septrin, depocillin, metacam and bisolvin until monday and if no improvement then the vet suggets we change the septrin to baytril. Is this a good course of action do you think? I actually think this morning he did sound slightly less noisy when eating but will see later on when I get home from work. He's still bright and active and eating well which I'm pleased about. Thanks for the help everyone much appreciated

Lady Logamorph said:

Nomnom is now on the depocillin every other day...the vet would not let me take the injection home so I'm taking him every other morning for it. They have also given me a sachet of bisolvin. The vet also thinks it's in the upper part of his chest when they last vet thought it was the lower part...I suppose because he is so noisy it's difficult to tell. We are carrying on with the septrin, depocillin, metacam and bisolvin until monday and if no improvement then the vet suggets we change the septrin to baytril. Is this a good course of action do you think? I actually think this morning he did sound slightly less noisy when eating but will see later on when I get home from work. He's still bright and active and eating well which I'm pleased about. Thanks for the help everyone much appreciated

Click to expand...

Aaww I am glad you're seeing an improvement.

Can I ask why your vet doesn't let you take the Depocillin and do the injections yourself? It's good to learn as you never know when you'll need that skill :shock:

I hope the Septrin does the trick. I presume there vet sounded your rabbit's chest - is it on the lungs or higher up? Is that what they mean by 'upper and lower' ?

Lady Logamorph said:

Nomnom is now on the depocillin every other day...the vet would not let me take the injection home so I'm taking him every other morning for it. They have also given me a sachet of bisolvin. The vet also thinks it's in the upper part of his chest when they last vet thought it was the lower part...I suppose because he is so noisy it's difficult to tell. We are carrying on with the septrin, depocillin, metacam and bisolvin until monday and if no improvement then the vet suggets we change the septrin to baytril. Is this a good course of action do you think? I actually think this morning he did sound slightly less noisy when eating but will see later on when I get home from work. He's still bright and active and eating well which I'm pleased about. Thanks for the help everyone much appreciated

Click to expand...

I hope that you will soon start to see an improvement in Nomnom's symptoms. Some Vets are not happy to allow clients to administer an 'off licence' medication such as Depocillin via SQ injection at home themselves. It is the prerogative of the individual Vet as to what they do. It is their Licence to practice that is at stake.

You may find that after a few days of Bisolvon a mucus discharge may occur. Dont panic if it does, it is simply that the Bisolvon is doing it's job and thining out all the thick gunk from the sinuses. Once the sinuses start draining it may also cause bouts of sneezing, some quite dramatic at that. But that too is 'normal' and once the abx get on top of the bacterial infection the mucus secretions should reduce along with the soft tissue inflammation within the nasal passages. It's great to hear that Nomnom is bright enough within himself, that has to be a positive sign.

interesting thread, I too was having the same problem

You may find that after a few days of Bisolvon a mucus discharge may occur. Dont panic if it does, it is simply that the Bisolvon is doing it's job and thining out all the thick gunk from the sinuses. Once the sinuses start draining it may also cause bouts of sneezing, some quite dramatic at that. But that too is 'normal' and once the abx get on top of the bacterial infection the mucus secretions should reduce along with the soft tissue inflammation within the nasal passages. It's great to hear that Nomnom is bright enough within himself, that has to be a positive sign.

Thanks everyone, the vet today at the same practice did let me take one injection home so he can have the depocillin on sunday. I have a vet nurse friend who is going to do it. I am happy to do it but don't want to waste the injection if I do something wrong seen as it will be a sunday and I won't be able to get another one.

Nomnoms nose is still noisy and the vet does think it's in his nose and not in his lungs at all. He does definitely seem better in himself...he's not sitting in his own wee and smells much better plus he was on the top of the hutch yesterday so must have felt well enough to jump on top of it.

I'm still getting the feeling there is something else going on like something up his nose. There is no sneezing or discharge at all his nose is just incredibly noisy especially when he eats or I pick him up making him stressed. I will take a video later to upload. I've never had this before in a 'snuffles' type illness. I'm used to noticing sneezing/nasal discharge. His only symptom seems to be extremely noisy breathing. When he eats he sounds like a pig really snorting through his nose.

I'm a little worried as where to go from here if his nose is still noisy on tuesday when he goes back. Will he be ok for a GA if his lungs are clear but his nose isn't? I'm thinking maybe a dig around up his nose might be the next thing to try.

Lady Logamorph said:

Thanks everyone, the vet today at the same practice did let me take one injection home so he can have the depocillin on sunday. I have a vet nurse friend who is going to do it. I am happy to do it but don't want to waste the injection if I do something wrong seen as it will be a sunday and I won't be able to get another one.

Nomnoms nose is still noisy and the vet does think it's in his nose and not in his lungs at all. He does definitely seem better in himself...he's not sitting in his own wee and smells much better plus he was on the top of the hutch yesterday so must have felt well enough to jump on top of it.

I'm still getting the feeling there is something else going on like something up his nose. There is no sneezing or discharge at all his nose is just incredibly noisy especially when he eats or I pick him up making him stressed. I will take a video later to upload. I've never had this before in a 'snuffles' type illness. I'm used to noticing sneezing/nasal discharge. His only symptom seems to be extremely noisy breathing. When he eats he sounds like a pig really snorting through his nose.

I'm a little worried as where to go from here if his nose is still noisy on tuesday when he goes back. Will he be ok for a GA if his lungs are clear but his nose isn't? I'm thinking maybe a dig around up his nose might be the next thing to try.

Click to expand...

I'm glad he seems to be feeling a bit better within himself. Hopefully you will start to see gradual further improvement over the next week or so.

Lady Logamorph said:

Thanks everyone, the vet today at the same practice did let me take one injection home so he can have the depocillin on sunday. I have a vet nurse friend who is going to do it. I am happy to do it but don't want to waste the injection if I do something wrong seen as it will be a sunday and I won't be able to get another one.

Nomnoms nose is still noisy and the vet does think it's in his nose and not in his lungs at all. He does definitely seem better in himself...he's not sitting in his own wee and smells much better plus he was on the top of the hutch yesterday so must have felt well enough to jump on top of it.

I'm still getting the feeling there is something else going on like something up his nose. There is no sneezing or discharge at all his nose is just incredibly noisy especially when he eats or I pick him up making him stressed. I will take a video later to upload. I've never had this before in a 'snuffles' type illness. I'm used to noticing sneezing/nasal discharge. His only symptom seems to be extremely noisy breathing. When he eats he sounds like a pig really snorting through his nose.

I'm a little worried as where to go from here if his nose is still noisy on tuesday when he goes back. Will he be ok for a GA if his lungs are clear but his nose isn't? I'm thinking maybe a dig around up his nose might be the next thing to try.

Click to expand...

I would suggest trying the Bisolvon, and loosening any mucous that may be in his nose. If there's something up there, it should help it to come down and out.

I hope things improve for him ... I would be interested to see a video :thumb:

Thanks guys I think your right just to wait and see over the weekend now. I will upload a video later tonight when he is eating his tea to see what you think of his piggy snorts!

Thanks for the advice guys...Nomnom is much better his breathing is back to normal. Going to finish the abx course which is for another week but so pleased he is all back to his normal self x

Lady Logamorph said:

Thanks for the advice guys...Nomnom is much better his breathing is back to normal. Going to finish the abx course which is for another week but so pleased he is all back to his normal self x

Click to expand...

Oh wow, good to hear :thumb:

Lady Logamorph said:

Thanks for the advice guys...Nomnom is much better his breathing is back to normal. Going to finish the abx course which is for another week but so pleased he is all back to his normal self x

Click to expand...

That's great news