How would you help a rabbit who's struggling...? UD doing really well! & lab results

Having a long term poorly bunny is the hardest thing in the world and I do not feel its appropriate to turn this thread into an argument. I do not feel that jacks jane or Hugo's there were being hypocrites, they were simply offering advice on what they saw. It is extremely difficult to judge these situations when you are not the primary caregiver and you are only seeing a small snipet of the bigger picture but they both tried and were honest and caring in their answer. I do not believe that anyone on ru would intentionally allow a rabbit to suffer and it's just wrong to judge people in such a manner.

UPDATE FROM THE VETS:

First of all I want to say that I value everyone's opinions, even if I don't agree with them. And I am not letting Grim suffer. :wave:

Now, we went to the vets and she agreed that it's not time to let him go yet.

His lungs are perfect. So the infection is still an URI (upper respiratory infection) which is good. She believes that most of it is in his sinuses which is what is causing the blockage, swelling and discomfort.

She's taken a swab for testing in the labs. He's still on the antibiotics so if they're the right ones for the bacteria, nothing will grow, but if they're not, well see something which might help. I should get the results in about a week.

Medicine: So we're basically trying everything. We're stopping the norocillin for now and trying (I think it was) entromycin. It was a -mycin anyway, an injectable one. I have a week's worth drawn up which should take us to the results of the swab and then we'll go from there on antibiotics. He also has some steroids to go in the nebuliser to help with the swelling and some piriton incase of allerigies to pollen etc as it always shows up at this time of year. We're also carrying on with the metranidazole, metacam and acetylcysteine as normal and she's also going to post me some bisolvon on Monday as she'd just run out.

We're avoiding a GA if possible, but if this doesn't work she might have to drain his sinuses, hopefully not.

Wish me luck, I'm about to try and get a quarter of a piriton tablet into a bunny for the first time.

Good luck with the piriton - depending on how you get on, it might be worth trying the piriton syrup, Santa used to drink it out of the syringe like metacam. It's not ideal as it contains an alcohol base but it's a tiny, tiny amount. I should think it would be far easier to administer from the liquid form than the tablet!

The other thing that really helped Santa when she was blocked in her nose/sinuses was a tear duct flush, as a sort of 'side effect' is that it clears through some of the nasal passages. When Santa had hers done, some of the exudate which came out was sent to the lab for cytology analysis, as this showed exactly what it was that was in the piles of goo up there.

Good luck, hope Grim improves xx

Can you crush the tablet between two spoons and mix with a little something to syringe in - I used to o this with a steroid tablet for Daisy years ago.

Thanks. He ate it fine... phew! He's got about three teeth left, so I just put it on the end of my finger and put my finger in his mouth. :lol: I followed it up with the metranidazole and metacam which he quite likes so I think it went down.

I'm not sure about a tear duct flush as his are so damaged, but I'll mention it next time.

Are you allowed to grind the tablet and then mix it with a liquid or Ella's kitchen fruit purée? I do this with Flopsy's daily fortekor tablet and his vetmedin. He hates the taste but will happily take them when they're disguised.

Lots of vibes for the lovely Grim , I hope that he's feeling a little better soon and doesn't require going under GA. x

Im glad the vet was able to help him. Knowing his lungs are clear is great.

I only gave advice based on the video. There is nothing in the first post to say he was not like this all the time. It just says he is in a really bad way and you thought there was nothing else you could do. So it wasnt just Jane and I who reached the same conclusion. There were quite a few others who agreed based on the info in the first post.

We use liquid piriton here and the rabbits absolutely love it. Poor Lois is actually upset that we have just stopped hers and keeps begging for it!!

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It's hard when you're posting online. I only gave a snippet of the information that I thought would help people give me advice. I obviously missed off an important part this time which made people jump to the conclusion that he was like this all the time. I've learned my lesson.

Again thank you everyone for the advice. Hopefully it will all help him.

I don't mean to second guess your vet and...
maybe the "Mycin" is safe because you are injecting it (because many antibiotics are safe when injected but unsafe when given orally) but...
(I'm a little bit obsessive compulsive)
I'm always doing research on antibiotics and when you said entromycin, I had to look it up and got erythromycin, looked it up and I got a website that lists antibiotics dangerous to rabbits, it lists seven "mycins" as dangerous here: http://www.thepawblog.com/antibiotics-and-rabbit-care/
and here http://www.rabbit.org/health/antibiotics.html

And here there is a safe list of rabbit antibiotics and there is only one mycin- tobramycin, but it says not injectable (neurotoxic).

Maybe yours is not dangerous because you are injecting it?

Good luck to you and Grim :wave:

Tbh I thought from the post YOU were saying it was the end of the line ftom him too so I actually thought I was supporting you initially. I dont have a lot of time to post on here but consider us friends so wanted give you help and advise when you were struggling.

It would be great to see another video of grim at his best

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Max1 said:

I don't mean to second guess your vet and...
maybe the "Mycin" is safe because you are injecting it (because many antibiotics are safe when injected but unsafe when given orally) but...
(I'm a little bit obsessive compulsive)
I'm always doing research on antibiotics and when you said entromycin, I had to look it up and got erythromycin, looked it up and I got a website that lists antibiotics dangerous to rabbits, it lists seven "mycins" as dangerous here: http://www.thepawblog.com/antibiotics-and-rabbit-care/
and here http://www.rabbit.org/health/antibiotics.html

And here there is a safe list of rabbit antibiotics and there is only one mycin- tobramycin, but it says not injectable (neurotoxic).

Maybe yours is not dangerous because you are injecting it?

Click to expand...

Could it have been engemycin? That's a really commonly used in Essex (funny how the antibiotic of choice varies around the country - wonder if it's local folklore and learning from each other, or if bacteria are different and some genuinely do work better than others in some places!) It's one injection every 3 days and is broad spectrum and bunny safe. It's my vet's antibiotic of first choice in the absence of information to the contrary, and I've used it safely in many bunnies over the years.

Jenova said:

It's hard when you're posting online. I only gave a snippet of the information that I thought would help people give me advice. I obviously missed off an important part this time which made people jump to the conclusion that he was like this all the time. I've learned my lesson.

Again thank you everyone for the advice. Hopefully it will all help him.

Click to expand...

I too was basing my opinion on what I saw in the video. I wont trawl over all that has been 'said' and I could have worded my posts better so that they were not interpreted as implying you were 'allowing Grimlock to suffer'. That is not what I meant. Having been on the receiving end of such accusations myself, both here and 'elsewhere' I know all too well how that feels.

Anyway, the most important factor in all of this is Grim and I really hope his new medication will help him to feel much more comfortable.

Sending lots of vibes for Grim. I hope he stays strong and comfortable for a long while to come. I'm so glad that his lungs are clear, having been through lower respiratory infection with Wally this is now one of my biggest dreads.

I too have given tablets via syringe, crushed then mixed with water. Although it sounds like Grim is being a good little patient and taking his tablet well

When Mimzy was younger he was always snuffly and would sound terrible but it was always sinus related and the vet would be surprised it wasn't lower in his lungs. He got a lot of children's benadryl along with his various abx which, in hindsight, probably wasn't the most efficient choice but it was all we had at the time.
I'm glad Grim has some new meds to try and I hope the tests come back conclusive. Mimzy had quite a few swabs done but we couldn't find anything specific going on. :?

(((((((((((Huge hugs))))))))) to you and extra healing vibes and snuggles for Grim. xxxxxxxx

Glad you are feeling happier today and I hope Grim responds to the treatment.

Piriton was like a magic medicine for Tillie - I used to put it in some apple which was her favourite!! I hope it has similar effects for Grim

I too have been at the shall we shant we - and still am at times - with Berry so I feel your pain. It is truly draining. The aloe gel has been like a magic medicine for him and like you I will keep going as I know, I will know when to stop.

Take care x x

Hope Grim improve more soon. Not sure whether you've tried olbas oil I know there are lots of mixed views I've used it an it helped sometimes whatever helps is the key.

I've been trying to post a reply for about an hour but it wouldn't let me...

I'll find out what the antibiotic actually is when I next speak to my vet, but I can assure you she knows what she's doing. I would say she's one of the best rabbit vets there is, if not the best. :wave:

I'll get another video of him eating if I can tonight. And hopefully he gets better soon and you can have another one of him even better.

Bless Grimlock. He is one of my fave RU rabbits xxxx

glad you have a plan of action now and more options to try. lots of love to grim x