Bonding success has now reverted back to square one ADVICE PLEASE

Hi all,

I have previously bonded rabbits, but some advice would be appreciated.
I started bonding my neutered boy with a very gentle sweet un neutered girl,( who i got from a friend ) it was love at first sight, both showed fantastic signs, we had humping by both, eating together, layed out beside eachother, and then the lovely grooming from him to her.

signs were so good that i didn't seperate them, all was well, until a few days later i noticed that toffee the female, was constantly grunting if he came anywhere near her, and kept running away, he started thumping his feet and chasing her, and then they were circling eachother, which i stopped straight away. when he lunged for her i decided to seperate them. I was sooooo dissapointed,

I think my mistake was letting them have too much space too quickly.
I have started bonding from the beginning again today on neutral ground, they seem to be fine with eachother, ignoring, eating etc: until he tries to hump her, (she doesn't try humping him anymore) at that point she make lots of grunting sounds, runs away or tries to nip him, i have to seperate before she can as it's always face to face. She nipped me which was fine as i had thick gloves on, i am obviously nervous that they will have a full on fight.

I can have them both face to face nussled up together while i groom them both on the top of their heads, and they will stay there for ages but as soon as i stop he is trying to hump again, and she freaks out.

they are now in seperate hutches and i will swap them over after every session, she is obviously not happy with all the humping, I do intent to get her neutered at some point when i have the money, just wanted to bond them before as i know it can be done depending on the rabbits.

will this pairing still work like it did in the beginning, or will it stay broken?

I have the option of returning her to my friend, but i would rather keep her now i have her,

Please can i have your expert opinion
thanks

In all honesty I wouldn't try again until after she's neutered. Yes it is possible to bond a neutered male to an unneutered female, but it's harder and sometimes won't work. It could have been too much space too quickly, or it could just have been that they took a few days to find their feet and work out where they wanted to be in the hierarchy of this relationship. That's not uncommon at all during bonding, it can start very well and then all go pear shaped after a few days.

After some incidents where there has been significant circling/scuffling I would suggest separating them and letting them 'forget' about the incident for a while, so she could perhaps get neutered and have time to recover in the meantime. Also, the whimpering noise you describe is not uncommon in unspayed does in particular. This would make me think that she is viewing the humping hormonally rather than just as hierarchy, rabbits are induced ovulators so as an unspayed doe it could well have triggered her hormones and this could also account for some of the more recent grumpiness. It is also possible that the scent of her being unspayed is different to a sensitive bunny nose and perhaps he just can't resist her because he instinctively knows what he is supposed to do with a female bunny! It's not uncommon for humping to continue a bit (sometimes relentlessly) in a new bond even between long-term neutered bunnies, but I wouldn't mind betting that her hormonal state is heightening things in this pair. It might not do in every pair, hence it's sometimes ok to do that as a bond, but it sounds to me as if it is making a difference with your two.

From the first few days it sounds like it certainly wasn't hate at first sight, so I think there is hope, but personally I would let them calm down from their scuffles and get the hormones sorted before trying again. Good luck x

I will sort out getting her neutered asap, in the meantime they are being housed seperatley, would it benefit swapping them over occasionally or is there no point?????

I'm not really sure if it adds anything, personally I've never bothered doing it before bonding.

If they've had a fight I think I'd rather keep them in their own place to settle back down again properly and 'forget' rather than unsettle them and potentially keep some anger or frustration bubbling under the surface - especially as one of them is unneutered. Others might disagree, I don't think it's something you'll get a particular consensus of opinion on!

They haven't had a full on fight to be honest, she is making loads of noise and lunging at him, which is when i intervine, once she did bite me, but i had thick gloves on, so guessing she would of got him, if i hadn't intervined.
any more advice people, i would be very grateful

I agree with Santa. She needs spaying before trying the bond again. As Santa mentioned, unspayed does can send a neutered bun mad with humping. It may be that he would not leave her alone and she has got fed up of him. He may hurt her so I'd not try again until she is neutered.
I wouldn't want to risk a full blown fight because this can jeopardise any further bonding attempts. Rabbits have a long memory and it can be difficult to bond buns once they have had a real fight.

Two of my bucks had a bad fight but after months of being apart (having already been neutered) they went back together just fine (with two does added in to the mix). They have been a contented quad since October 2013.

I have booked toffee in to be neutered on Thursday this week, some people say to wait 4 weeks, some say 6 which is best??????

maisydaisystar said:

I have booked toffee in to be neutered on Thursday this week, some people say to wait 4 weeks, some say 6 which is best??????

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I say 6 weeks. The longer the better tbh, especially if a bun is displaying hormonal behaviour. x

I agree with Vegan_Bunny, esp at this time of year (Spring fever).

Good luck on Thursday. Remember to insist on pain relief to take home (as well as the injection that they give her) some vets dont routinely give it!!:shock:!!