What to feed a bunny with molar root elongation??

Bubbles has had x-rays which have shown that her molar roots (top and bottom, both sides) are elongated, causing her considerable pain and meaning that she doesn't want to eat hay at all.

She'll be on metacam long-term now and I'll still be trying the usual tricks to get hay into her, plus giving lots of grass BUT:

Is there anything else I can add to her diet/changes I can make that will help with tooth wear?

She currently has unlimited hay (which she doesn't touch), grass, limited veg as it upsets her stomach, a handful of SS pellets daily.

KarenM said:

Bubbles has had x-rays which have shown that her molar roots (top and bottom, both sides) are elongated, causing her considerable pain and meaning that she doesn't want to eat hay at all.

She'll be on metacam long-term now and I'll still be trying the usual tricks to get hay into her, plus giving lots of grass BUT:

Is there anything else I can add to her diet/changes I can make that will help with tooth wear?

She currently has unlimited hay (which she doesn't touch), grass, limited veg as it upsets her stomach, a handful of SS pellets daily.

Click to expand...

Apple sticks ?

If she will eat grass then have you tried readigrass? Pipkin won't eat hay but he loves normal grass and will also nibble at readigrass.
Pipkin has the same root troubles as Bubbles, he hasn't had a problem with spurs in over a year which I am pleased (and a bit amazed) about. He used to need a dental every 6 months or so.

Mine love JR stuff

http://www.zooplus.co.uk/shop/small_pets/hay_and_bedding/hay_small_pets/186137

http://www.zooplus.co.uk/shop/small_pets/snacks_supplements/natural_treats/jr_farms/13320

If its tooth roots, have they done a dental and burred the relevant molars back as far as possible Karen?

What dose of metacam is she getting, and how often and of what metacam?

I've been giving them Graze-On (which I think is similar to Readigrass) for a few mths; Bubbles seemed to love it at first but she barely touches it now although that may improve now she's had a dental. :? The same with the apple sticks.

I'll have a look at the JR stuff though, thanks, as she seems quite keen on dried herbs/plants etc still.

Graham, yep, the teeth have been burred right down which I'm hoping will make a difference but I'm also trying to look from other angles. She weighs 1.2kg and is on 0.25ml of dog metacam twice daily which, if I've done the maths right, is the highest dose for long-term use.

Unfortunately I have a lot of experience with this.
With Grim his teeth became too painful to eat anything hard. He hasn't eaten hay as long as I've had him as it's just too painful. Slowly other foods have become painful too and he's stopped eating almost everything.

I managed to get him off painkillers by feeding him only soft food. I give him unlimited pellets which I soak in water first. It's hard to let him have unlimited pellets while he;s bonded but I separate him every few hours and feed him on his own. I think this is really important as if a rabbit can't eat hay they still need to eat continuously to avoid stasis. And in fact when Grim started his unlimited soggy pellets the time between dentals increased. Another member also commented this happened to one of their rabbits on a pellet only diet. I think it has something to do with the body not having enough of the nutrients to grow the teeth, but I'm not sure.

What I do for Grim is scoop up a cup of pellets and fill the cup with water just to the top of the pellets. After a few minutes they soak up all the water. Excel and Science Selective work well as they both keep their shape rather than disintegrate.

Then you just have to keep on top of dentals, but this way Grim has been off pain killers most of the time. My personal opinion is there is no point trying to get a rabbit with root elongation that causes pain to eat hay. They just can't do it as it's too painful. Keeping the teeth short is the best way to deal with it but if it's too painful it's too painful.

Grim does get a lot of excess cecals but he's gone from having a dental every month to having a dental every eight months and he east no hay at all, just soggy pellets, some oats and some bread to hide his baytril in.

I hope that helps.

No advice but sorry to hear that Bubbles is having such trouble

sorry to hear this...poor Bubbles...

I dont know about this problem...but what came to mind was perhaps hawthorn...fresh & you can dry it for winter forage....mine adore it...but its great fibre and quite soft...so perhaps Bubbles would be able to cope....you could also give willow leaves & branches..again fresh & dried...dont over do it but willow has a natural pain killer in it...and often it rabbits eat loads it can be a sign of pain or discomfort. Bothe of these you can get for free by foraging...:thumb: Introduce slowly so as not to cause extra ceacs.

Thanks Alison and chelle for thinking of Bubbles. Chelle, I've been thinking about foraged foods so I might have a wander through the threads later to find out a little more. :thumb:

Jenova, thank you for all the info. I've been giving Bubbles extra pellets for the past couple of weeks and she seems to manage fine with them atm as they are - soaking them may be something I'll need to look at in the future. As you say, it's difficult when they're paired with a bunny with healthy teeth because I don't want to affect Alfie's diet so I'm going to have to feed Bubbles separately little and often I think.

The pain relief hasn't made any difference at all to her eating habits but I've seen a difference in her general behaviour on the metacam so she definitely needs it atm.

I was wondering about the excess cecals too, and that's another issue as Bubbles has got quite a delicate digestive system and can't tolerate much veg etc. She's been ok with the increase in pellets so far but ideally it would be good to find foods to either help her teeth wear or to provide the fibre that she's missing out on from the hay.

I need to do some searching of old threads too, but there are so many it's hard to know where to start.

Thanks for the ideas and keep 'em coming. :wave:

Spenser quite liked one of the JR mixes. It was the one that had green oat hay through it.

Noserubs to dear little Bubbles. xxx

Oh no poor little Bubbles!!!

Sometime last year Sarah-Jane mentioned an article she'd read that said the smaller sized pellets such as Excel are better for teeth wear rather than the longer ones like SS, so I wonder if it's worth breaking them into smaller pieces? I can't remember where she said she'd seen the article :? Also how is her tummy with the bags of dried meadow herbs that Excel and Burns do?

Also Thumps_ said that rabbits with tooth root problems are still able to eat dried forage very easily and with minimal pain when they are dried to a crisp so they almost dissolve in the mouth. She kindly sent me some for Grim and I used a hairdryer to crisp them even more, but Grim wouldn't touch them. That might worth trying.

Thanks for the recommendation from Spenser, Susan. We've had some green oat hay & dandelion before which went down very well. :thumb:

I'll do some digging to find out more about the pellets; they used to be on Excel with no ill effects so I could always switch back if that would help. I've been feeding Bubbles some of the Excel dwarf & junior pellets to try to get some weight back on her as, being so small, she only has to lose a little to feel boney (Daisy would probably be jealous but Bubbles says she'd much rather be a bit plumper and without sore teeth ) She seems to cope ok with the dried herbs etc so I could up those - would they be ok for Alfie too? (I don't want him to end up as a lardball with bad teeth)

That's interesting info about the dried forage. :thumb: I've already told OH he's got to come foraging with me - wait till I tell him he's got to help me dry the stuff with a hairdryer. :shock::lol::lol:

Hello!

I'm awakening this threat as it is the reason I found this forum. My dear and belloved Brko is 5 year old mini Rex mix (smaller then mini rex, smaller ears with velvet fur). He was super at eating hay, never had spurs and then schock of my life-elongated tooth roots with abscess in the preiorbital area.

He had 2 tooth extraxted, abscess drained, a month of antibioticcs and pain meds. Up until mid january he seemd fine, he ate hay quite OK. But now I'm calling the vet tomorow morning I guess.

He had teeth filed down on 3. december. He show interests and eats pellets, oxbow treat, veggies and veryy little hay. I guess it hurts him. He is drooling a bit more and he is constantly moving his yaws lef/right. But there seems to be no spurs (I took him a long to the vet for quick teeth check up, when other bun Sherlock had his appointment for spur grinding).

Everybunny what is a long(er) term plan for this kind of problem? What to feed (no grass around it is snow outside)? How much pellets? He has 1.3kg / 2.8 lbs. Before root problems he got less then 1/4 of cup. Now i feed him 1/4 of cup 30g. + one oxbow treat and one cup of veggies and some herbs in the hay. He refuses apple sticks that he liked before (i'm guessing it is the pain-too hard).

Is it too optimistic, to have him around for 5 more years? He was soo happy just a month ago, binkys, zommies...and he has been off antibiotics and pain meds since 27.12.2020.

He may need longer on the pain reief and antibiotics. Absesses can take some time to clear, and can reccur.
Dentals may become a regular thing. X-rays will show what the tooth roots are doing. Keeping the teeth burred down also helps to keep the roots shorter.
Weigh him weekly to checkthat he is eating enough. A steady drop over 2 or 3 weeks indicates dental problems again. You will get to recognise a pattern.

Bramble leaves are available to forage in the UK all year round. They are good for coarse fibre, but easier to eat than grass / hay.
Willow branches (and leaves when they come out) may be easier than apple twigs.
Dandelion leaves always go down well.
If there is no forage, try bunches of herbs, celery, cabbage, broccoli, etc from the shops. Introduce anything new to his diet slowly.
Also try different hay types. Sone are soft, some stalky and harder - some may be easier to eat than others. There's also Readigrass, and different pellet alternatives.

Personally from experience, the antibiotics, I presume depocillin? (I'm not sure you would have this available in your country) needs to be given much longer - possibly for life.

Thank you for answer. I do have some herbs and forage. SO far he eats some of meadow on the softer side. Dandelion is great. He had his check up in 16. december and it was healed fine. He was on two antibiotics for whole month Efloran (metrodinazol) and Sumamed (azitromicin), pain meds Novasul (Metamizole) and Melosus/Metacam. I will talk to the vet about long term use of metacam or antibiotics if needed.

I'm trying to get some Fibafirs here, but so far no luck :/ He eats Selective Grainfree. is 1/4 of cup cca 30g enough for him?