Fundraising Section Rules

[honeybunny]

Oh, I do am I the only one

Oooh you have a section all to yourself!

[elve_mk2]

well having just read the new rules, I can't see any way that maggiethomas would have been stopped by them, because she would have met all the criteria Tamsin's asking for (although she probably lied about having a license for a raffle - no proof is needed so she'd still get away with that now)

I think Twinsen Patrick's idea (I think it was - on Maggie's thread) that you should only be allowed to start a fundraiser after so many posts, is a good one.

Looking at Craftster's forum swap rules, because these have to protect people from being ripped off by scammers as well - they insist minimum age 16yrs old - good idea.

Must have been a forum member for at least a month, and have made at least 15 posts - good idea.

Must be sole user of the account - good idea.

Also occurred to me with Maggie's scam - how would you stop someone using a library or other public computer for such purposes, in which case they would be hard to trace?

I think more proof should be asked for by moderators approving the fundraiser too - certificate of legality if needed should be verified.

And if a photograph of a 'prize' is shown, it must be proven to be original and genuine, not a copy/paste from an online shop. Face it if someone can't afford to buy a camera, they can't afford to donate a generous prize for funraising.

Bearing in mind that many forum members are young, trusting and naive to the ways of criminals, and will happily give away their address as well as money to anyone, regardless of online safety it seems ('maggie' now has everyone's address from paypal!) I do think the rules need to be more stringent than posted on this thread, as regards proving someone is genuinely a forum member, with real goods, which they really will procure when needed.

[Hugo's There]

Can I ask one more question please?

It states that you can't ask for donations, is this just money donations or donations of "stuff" as well? eg when we run short of towels we sometimes ask on here for towels to be donated

[Tamsin]

Looking at Craftster's forum swap rules, because these have to protect people from being ripped off by scammers as well - they insist minimum age 16yrs old - good idea.

How to they verify users are over 16?

Must have been a forum member for at least a month, and have made at least 15 posts - good idea.

If you stood to make a few hundred pounds from a fake fundraiser, would having to sign up a month in advance or post 15 posts stop you? We'll certainly be more strict with newbies but I don't think having been a member a month is anything other than false reassurance.

Must be sole user of the account - good idea.

Also occurred to me with Maggie's scam - how would you stop someone using a library or other public computer for such purposes, in which case they would be hard to trace?

We already monitor duplicate accounts. As you say though - nothing to stop someone using an internet cafe and a fake name.

I think more proof should be asked for by moderators approving the fundraiser too - certificate of legality if needed should be verified.

I've never heard of a certificate of legality - who issues these?

And if a photograph of a 'prize' is shown, it must be proven to be original and genuine, not a copy/paste from an online shop. Face it if someone can't afford to buy a camera, they can't afford to donate a generous prize for funraising.

How do you prove a negative? There are literally billions of images on the internet - there is no way we could check an image wasn't a copy. What about prizes that are donated by companies? People don't necessarily buy the prizes themselves. I don't think we can exclude people from fundraising based on their annual salary.


We have carefully considered the suggestions people have made but there is no way we can stop problems 100%. Not without stopping genuine people fundraising too.

[Tamsin]

Can I ask one more question please?

It states that you can't ask for donations, is this just money donations or donations of "stuff" as well? eg when we run short of towels we sometimes ask on here for towels to be donated

We've never allowed straight requests for cash in fundraising. Asking for items is fine though although you'd probably want to go for rabbit chat for that - it's not really fundraising as such

[elve_mk2]

How do you prove a negative? There are literally billions of images on the internet - there is no way we could check an image wasn't a copy. What about prizes that are donated by companies? People don't necessarily buy the prizes themselves. I don't think we can exclude people from fundraising based on their annual salary.
.

on 'maggie's' thread, someone mentioned that she could take a photo of the hutch with some kind of verification attached to the hutch - I think a piece of paper with 'RU FUNDRAISER' or something like that was mentioned. This would have been quite easy for 'maggie' to do, and would have proved 'she' had a hutch which was linked to the fundraiser.

As for the other issues, I have no idea how you can check people's age. Perhaps a scan of their drivers license or birth certificate or passport could be sent to the mod vetting the new thread?

And being forced to make 15 posts and be member for at least a month might not stop someone determined to scam, but combined with the above measures would probably make it more bother than it was worth.

You don't guarantee nobody will burgle you by taking precautions, but the idea is to make it more trouble for someone to burgle you, so they go elsewhere

[coco1200]

If you start a topic in here, like you post normally, it will automatically be placed in a queue to be checked by a mod and won't display until they approve it.

If there are part of the rules that don't apply to your event eg there isn't a 'winner' just miss that part. It's hard to write rules that apply to every situation so mods will use their disgression.

I'm going to ask the rescues what they prefer re items for sale. One logical thing would be to list things that are straight items for sale in the for sale section (with the fundraising marker) and anything that's an event in here. If so we will give rescues free access to post in the for sale section.

what about people who fundraise on behalf of rescues like myself? I've sold stuff in the past for the dog shelter...

[Tamsin]

You'd need to follow the same fundraising rules but again there would be no charge for a fundraising item. If we decide to put those items in for sale - we'd just move the post in there for you

[kitschkitty]

on 'maggie's' thread, someone mentioned that she could take a photo of the hutch with some kind of verification attached to the hutch - I think a piece of paper with 'RU FUNDRAISER' or something like that was mentioned. This would have been quite easy for 'maggie' to do, and would have proved 'she' had a hutch which was linked to the fundraiser.

As for the other issues, I have no idea how you can check people's age. Perhaps a scan of their drivers license or birth certificate or passport could be sent to the mod vetting the new thread?

And being forced to make 15 posts and be member for at least a month might not stop someone determined to scam, but combined with the above measures would probably make it more bother than it was worth.

You don't guarantee nobody will burgle you by taking precautions, but the idea is to make it more trouble for someone to burgle you, so they go elsewhere

I don't think it's possible to verify someones age, but I do think the other points are valid. If an individual says they are raffling off a large or valuable item themselves, then they should be able to take that kind of a picture elve mentioned.

If a company is directly donating a prize it's very easy to phone or email the business itself and confirm with them they are donating the prize.

I actually think 15 posts is too little for someone who could potentially be scamming hundreds of pounds.

I would go for a membership of at least one month and a minimum of 25 posts at least (personally I'd probably like it to be higher, but say 100 posts would be a bit off putting to far more people).

If that small requirement to try and afford a little more protection to ru members could put off some fundraisers then so be it, I think the potential for them to be put off when it's a fundraiser of magnitude is very small. As most people who genuinely want to raise lots of money for a good cause get to know the community they are asking to join in the project.

Trust has to be earned. By not making members have to participate in a community before being allowed to take money off it, you risk exposing all your genuine forum members to scammers, when there's no need.

[TeflonsShadow]

Id be happy to provide a scan of my passport or something to allow me to be a trusted RU fundraiser person.... I still think 100 or so posts would be good before being able to fundraise, surely thats more effort than a lot of 'trolls' can be bothered with?