Spaying concerns - please advise!

Hi all

I've booked my three girls in to be spayed tomorrow morning and i'm sick with worry as i've never done this before.

Squiffy and Baggins are young and strong and i have no doubt they'll be fine after the op. My main concern is my dwarf, Munchkin, who at 6 years old and weighing only 1.2kg, is obviously a long way past the time she should have been done. The reason why i've decided to do it now is that she's spent the past month or two in false pregnancy with all teats lactating which must have been sore, though i relieved the milk gently for her on most days. This is the first time this has ever happened despite the fact she has made nests etc all her life when in season.

When i saw the vet last month he said spaying would fix the problem, but he was concerned about her age now. He said if ever she needs to get her back teeth done, then it would be best to do both ops at once. Well her teeth do need doing again and hence why i have now booked her in for dental and spay in one.

But i'm concerned that this is a lot to ask of her little body. She is generally a sprightly and well little thing, but tomorrow's ops could knock her for six? Does anyone think this is or isn't a good idea, or could give me any words of wisdom in terms of similar situations?

I love my little Munch more than anything in the world and i'm really fretting about what's best to do.

Also, how long will it take spays to recover? Do they just laze about for a few days? Should they start eating straight away? Could there be any complications or illnesses that can be caused by being spayed? What should i look out for?

Hope you trusty folk can help and advise me.

Many thanks in advance,

Hazel x

There's no denying that it's a big operation, but it doesn't sound like you have much alternative with your older bunny, and she needs an anaesthetic anyway. My best advice would be that you insist on having pain relief (eg Metacam) to bring home with you. Some vets just don't do it, and I think it greatly assists their recovery and prevents their guts going into stasis etc.

You can expect your bunnies to be quiet for a few days, and not to be eating normally for a day or 2, but they then pick themselves up quite quickly.

The main concern after the op is to get the buns eating again so they don't develop GI stasis. My bunny Pippa was very quiet the evening of the op, to be expected I guess, and hunched up much of the next day. I eventually managed to tempt her to eat with grated carrot. Knowing what I know now I would now take her back to get more painkillers but I didn't, thankfully she was ok. She was spayed on Tuesday and was back to 'normal' by Friday, but do expect them to look unwell for the first couple of days as it is a major operation for them. However most rabbits recover with no problems and there's no reason to suspect yours won't. With your older rabbit, as Sarah says, it doesn't sound like you have much choice and I hope she's ok

Good luck with them - I'm sure they'll be fine

Kathryn x

I would ask the vet run some tests on Munchkin's liver/kidney etc. function, just to make sure it's all OK as anaesthetic puts a strain on the liver particularly. Is she bonded to the others or do they live seperately?

Have you checked that your vet is experienced with rabbit spays too? Has he attended small animal conferences? They are a lot different to cats - also they should NEVER be starved pre-op, so take no notice if the receptionist tells you to starve them.

It's good you are getting them spayed early in the week as they will probably need more painkillers Friday - maybe book them a slot just incase? When they get home they want towels or fleece to lie on, not hay - put that in a rack or box - A dish of water next to them as well as a bottle if that's what they're used to, and they will most likely not want dry food so make sure you have plenty stock of their favourite veg, long grass or whatever. They need to be kept warm indoors as their body temp drops due to shock, and depending what time of day the op is done, they may not really wake up properly till the middle of the night, so make sure you are around to encourage eating - bat them on the nose with some greens and they may eat it.

Hope it goes well

My bunnies are hugely bonded and live together in a bunny converted summer house with carpet and under carpet heating so i think the conditions will be favorable for them on their return. I'm getting them all spayed together and aim to keep them together rather than to separate, as i felt this would stress them out less.

My vet appointment is at 8.20am tomorrow, so i guess the ops will be sometime that morning and hope to pick them up by the end of the day.

I did call the vet today to ask who was doing the ops and whether they were experienced operating on bunnies, the receptionist didn't really say either way and to be honest i felt a bit rude asking. She did say there were two vets operating that day, so they probably work ops in day shifts and because i was booked in tomorrow then i get whoever is doing them that day? She did say if i had any concerns and wanted to pull out when i got there, that would be OK. I guess i can ask again when i get there or possibly call them first thing to double check about the operating vet's bunny experience before i make the journey?

I feel sick with worry i really do. I've spent today cleaning and scrubbing their house to ensure it's comofrtable and hygenic for when they return tomorrow. I hate that they're all so happy and lively and that tomorrow i'm going to make them all really poorly, in pain and sad. And as for Munchkin, i just can't get the fear of worst case scenario out of my head and i'm in tears writing this. I love her so much and she is so affectionate, i can't bear the thought of putting her through this. I just don't know what to do for the best.

xxx

I feel for you, it must be awful trying to make that decision. For me I had a single doe and wanted to bond her so she needed spaying. However yours are already bonded and if you aren't sure about the spays then you don't have to get them done - there is always a risk with any surgery but chances are they will all be ok. There is always that chance of them getting uterine cancer but at their age you do have some time before that risk increases. Is there an alternative for the older doe, such as injections to stop her lactating? Most people on here are pro-spay for health reasons but if you are so worried about it there's nothing to stop you postponing it until you feel happier.

I can't really add anything to the above, I just wanted to say I hope all goes well tomorrow. I felt really awful the day before mine were spayed so I know how you feel, however I understand your extra worries about Munchkin. My vet got a major grilling when i dropped them off for their pre-op checks in the morning and he was happy to answer all my questions, so don't worry about being rude, you are their mummy after all!! xxx

HI I have had several bunnies spayed now, due to behaviour or for medical reasons. It really is the best idea as it prevents lots of nasty illnesses later in life. When any of my buns have a GA now I keep them in overnight, but as yours have underfloor heating they may feel better in their house (I have 7 together so its not really fair to put one sleepy one back in with 6 wide awake buns!) As someone has already said its really important that they eat within a couple of hours of coming round, ask the vets when you pick them up if they have eaten anything. I always have a jar of liquid baby food in the cupboard and a syringe (obviously without a needle), if you buy a really sweet pudding food they love it. When Pistachio lost her eye it was the only thing I could get her to eat for about a week after, she was in such pain with her head. I was syringing in about 5ml every 4 hours which was hard work, but I think if I hadn't done it I would have lost her. My most recent spay I started doing the same, and within a couple of feeds her appetite was back and raring to go!
Good luck, you know your buns, and if you are in any doubt ring your vet. A little bit of pain stops them leaping about and ripping the stitches but they should certainly be up and moving around the next day. Also keep an eye on their poohs, sounds delightful but is the best way to see if they are eating.
Let us know how they go, X Jess

Will be thinking of you and the bunnies x

You've all been very helpful and soothing, i hope i can stay strong and make the right decision tomorrow morning.

If Munchkin definitely needs the teeth op then i'll just have to make that judgement about the spay and the operating vet. If she doesn't need the teeth op after all, then i think i might pull out on that one???? After joining this forum and reading up on utrine cancer etc I just want to prolong her life for as long as possible by getting her spayed, i know ideally i should have done it years ago, but i've always been too scared of losing her under anaesthetic. Catch 22 and i feel crappy about it either way.

The suggestion about sweet pudding baby food is a neat idea, i'll also use Science Recovery to ensure she gets the prebiotics. I'm also dreading handling them to syringe feed and the possibility of hurting their wounds.

Just soooo worried. I don't think i'll be sleeping at all well tonight. Poor babies

xxxx

I found the best way to handle them is to gently place them between your legs on the floor this way you can control them but don't need to be picking them up, stops any touching of the wound. If they struggle, try wrapping them in a towel. And yes I put a powder stuff in their baby food to help but can't remember what its called now, sorry. x

How are your girls now? Did you change your mind? Hope they are OK!

Hi all

I didn't get Munchkin spayed today after all. She did have the teeth op but the vet thought doing the two together could be problematic for a bunny so small and quite old, as it would take an hour under anaesthetic. I'm relieved and a bit disappointed at the same time, as i would have liked to have got her done if it helps extend her life a bit, i was just so worried about putting her thru so much. I guess i can think a little while longer whether i want to go ahead with a spay another time.

As for Squiffy and Baggins, they are also both round from their anaesthetic, all gone well apparently, so i'm chuffed about that. They'll all be pleased to be back together by now as the nurse asked if i'd like them put into one holding cage whilst they wait to be picked up at 4pm.

Thanks for all the advice and kind words you guys have sent, it has really helped. Now all i need to do is gauge how the other two recover and see if i think i should put Munchkin thru the spay op at a later date. Also i asked for a blood test on Munchkin - what would that determine? Would it show up any obvious problems such as kidney, liver, cancer???

Finally, our vets don't send patients home with painkillers - i mentioned Metacam - but it's their policy not to. They are given a long acting injection today, then I guess if the buns appear to be in pain in a few days then i just need to take them back to the vet.

I'll let you know how they all get on later.

xxx

You must feel relieved to have made the decision, and also that the others got through OK.

I have to say, I don't agree with your vet (but it does seem common practice) about pain relief. Given that the pain relief they've had straight after the op wears off, if they are still in pain their guts can stop working and they go into GI stasis. It's all very well saying that you can go back if the bunny is in pain but by that time you have a new emergency. :roll:

Anyway, that's just my view and I don't say that to have a go at your vet particularly - as I say, it seems to be common.

Glad your buns are ok.

I've had 4 girls spayed, all recovered really well, the youngest was 6 months and the oldest 2 years at the time, so I know its not quite the same but Smudge who was 6 months had her spay at the same time as extensive abdominal wound debridement and re-suturing (she'd been bitten by one of the other does she lived with at the time).

She only weighed 1.2kg when she had the op and was under for an hour and she pulled through fine, and has been a picture of health ever since and that was 6 months ago now.

The liver problems, I believe, occur when a bun doesn't eat for a period of time and not a direct cause from a GA but a potential after effect, and even then the risk is small.

Good luck for whatever you decide to do for Munchkin

Nicola

My vets are really good and i've been using them 10+ years for my bunnies, piggies and more recently a pussy cat, but they stipulate that they are not an exotic pets speciality centre, but then how many of them are there out there in truth?

I do worry about conflicting advice sometimes tho - for instance i gather from reading on here that small breeds live longer whereas my vet this morning said it was the other way round. She said with Munchkin now 6 i had to weigh up the risk of putting her thru a double op today, or spay any other time, with the liklihood that she could effectively die at any time due to old age and any other illness. I know illness is a risk at any time, but my buns are healthy and very well cared for and observed for changes in behaviour. I just don't know who to believe at the end of the day, my head tells me if anyone should know then a vet should, but my heart tells me the collective experience on this board is the best judge of all. It's nice that you guys can say "i would do this" or "i would do that", which is really helpful, but when taking some of your suggestions to the vets i get a "we don't really do that" or "i'm not familier with that course of action". It's difficult to assert what is effectively a laymans suggestion to a qualified practitioner, and i imagine they get frustrated at people coming in giving diagnoses or treatment ideas when it is they who are the vet?

Anyways, all my bunnies are alive and (hopefully) soon to be up and bouncing again soon. I'll keep in touch.

H xx

I'm glad to know that the ops went well, even if Munchkin wasn't spayed as you hoped she would.
Like SarahP I'm a bit amazed your bunnies didn't get painkillers like Metacam to help them recover once at home. But as you say, if you notice any sign of pain, you just have to go back there and they will treat them.
As to know what I'd do for Munchkin's spaying if I were you, it's difficult to say because I don't know why she has to be operated on. Sorry.
Anyway, I hope all these lovely bunnies will get well soon.

I'm glad they're all ok My vet didn't send Pippa home with painkiller and she was fine, but if you think they are in pain don't hesitate to take them back for more - I'd like to see these vets have hysterectomies and no painkiller :roll:

As far as your older doe goes I have to say that unless there is an urgent need I probably wouldn't spay her if she were mine although I know plenty of people spay older rabbits with no problems - it seems a lot for her to go through if it's not necessary medically although of course it might be.

Oh well I hope they all recover well - are you ready to play nurse for 2 days now? I would make them an appointment for Friday as they are bound to need painkillers by then - and if not then you can always cancel - it would be awful if they were too busy to fit you in.

As for Munchkin, well if it's any comfort to you (and only time will tell) I haven't spayed any of my female rabbits as I don't think it's as important as giving them a good quality of life and building up their immune system - do they care when they die? No - they care about how they live now, and your rabbits sound very happy. I didn't mention this yesterday as I would have had the responsibility of your rabbits too if you'd changed your mind - I think we all should make the decision ourselves for our own rabbits.

Hi really glad all 3 ops went well, hope they are all poohing now!!:lol: You know your buns best, if you think the advice on here is relevant then try discussing it with your vet, i use the line "i read somewhere that...." and then try having a discussion, but then my vets are used to me self-diagnosing and just put up with it now! And if your older bun isn't spayed then she isn't. At the end of the day you never know what tomorrow will bring, do what you feel is best for her and you. Don't put yourself under added stress about it, that will have an impact on all your buns! xx Jess