Please can you help me

Hello everyone, I have often looked at this site and often gleaned off much information but this time I really need some help from you experts.

I have 3 lop rabbits (2 mini lops) who are all much loved, but one of them has caused me concern as I took him to the vet last week as he has begun weeing everywhere rather than his normal places, but he is also drinking a lot. The vet who is quite rabbit experienced asked if he was insured?? but as he wasn't we are trying him on Baytril in case of bladder infiection first, as his main worry is sludge My worry is the excess calcium issue. He is still eating his mix and parsley/carrot tops or carrots/brussel sprouts and very happy BUT NOT EATING HIS USUAL HAY. My main worry is that he has not responded to antibiotics and as we cannot afford major ops etc if there is sludge, is there anything we can try before going back to vet? also if we do go ahead with his treatment guide is it likely to be successful/reoccuring?

any advice is most welcome and I have been toO nervous to join the forum before but I am desperate as I do not want to make the wrong decision due to financial reasons but love my rabbits desparately too!

Please help if you can. Many thanks

We had some huge vet bills recently and our vets have let us spread the cost.

Yours should do that too, ask to speak to the business/practice manager. They should be accommodating, at the end of the day if your bun needs treatment, your bun needs treatment!!

Nicola

Hi Kate. Why nervous? Everyone on here is just like you...we all love our bunnies and want to do our best for them. I've never had any experience with the problem you describe but wanted to come on and say Hi. I'm sure that you'll have loads of advice when everyone's up and awake tomorrow morning. As Gaffer says, vets will spread the cost for you if you ask

Hi Kate
welcome to the forum. I can't offer any advice, I'm afraid, but I'm sure there'll be lots of people with similar experiences who reply in the morning or on Monday.
Piccies of your beatiful bunnies would be appreciated :wink:

Vets bill's can get expensive but there are other things than a course of baytril your vet can try, for example a different antibiotic. Perhaps your vet could test a urine/blood sample for kidney function.

Find out from your vet whether there is a change for follow up appointents. For some vets going back again for the same issue means you don't need to pay another consultation charge so you can get another checkup without it costing.

It might be an idea to look at his diet also and cut out any high calcium veg as a precaution.

As he's not eating his hay I would ask the vet to check his teeth. A change in eating habbits can mean his teeth are hurting.

Don't panic yet, it could just be a stubborn bladder infection that needs a longer course of antibiotics

For vets bills, if your on a low income or receive some benefits you may be entitled to free/discount treatment from the PSDA - http://www.pdsa.org.uk or if you're lucky some RSPCA branches have vet clinics with low costs treatments.

Welcome to the forum

Tamsin

Hello

There are many reason apart from 'Bladder Sludge' that can cause the symptoms you describe. Did your Vet examin your Rabbits bladder? It is often possible to feel the sludge build up if it is there.
Here is some info on Calcium metabolism in Rabbits

http://www.houserabbit.co.uk/rwf/articles/calcium.htm

Baytril is usually very efficient at clearing up UTIs so maybe infection is not the problem for your Rabbit.
Other possibilities are Kidney problems or diabetes mellitus/insipidus. A blood test would help to rule these in or out. The average cost for a blood test ranges from £20-£40 depending on the Vet.
Another condition to exclude is Encephalitizoon Cuniculi, info here

http://www.houserabbit.co.uk/rwf/articles/ecuniculi.htm

Aswell as the Central Nervous system EC can effect the Kidneys
Treatment for EC would be a 28 day course of PANACUR. The sooner EC is treated the better re longterm prognosis so I would contact your Vet about this tomorrow to discuss treatment and a mutually acceptable payment plan.

Hope some of this helps and welcome to RU

Janex

Welcome to RU. Hope you can get to the bottom of the problem soon. Sending positive vibes to your little bunny

Fiona x

I agree with Jane, get him on a course of Panacur as soon s possible. It is a long course..(28 days and don't let your vet persuade you it's less..sadly some do )..
..if it is EC and you start the treatment ASAP there is a very high chance of a full recovery.....
however you should treat all rabbits that have come into contact with the affected bun and thoroughly disinfect his cage/run area.
There is no need to consider losing this bunny yet andif you are worried about vets bills perhaps it may be worth thinking of putting a small amount away each week for any bills that may crop in the future.
Good luck and keep us posted.

Rabbits should not be fed parsley (curly type) as it is VERY high in calcium and can cause bladder stones and sludge, the flat leaf parsley is OK, so if you are feeding the curly type then stop so as no more can build up, I agree with the panacur and antibiotics.

Welcome to RU and don't ever be nervous about asking anything, we were all new once and we ALL learn from everyone, so bombard us with questions as I am sure someone can come up with the answer.

Come again soon :lol: and good luck

Thank you

Thank you all for your advice. Gus has had teeth checked and all was ok and he is still eating his rabbit mix. I have been feeding Curly leaf parsley so I will stop that immediately.

I am just off to the pet shop to buy some Timothy Hay as I understand that is low in calcium and hoping that a change might encourage him.

He is very happy in himself.

Will keep you all posted and hope to upload some photos of my buns soon.

Thanks again,
Kate

snowy said:

Rabbits should not be fed parsley (curly type) as it is VERY high in calcium and can cause bladder stones and sludge, the flat leaf parsley is OK, so if you are feeding the curly type then stop so as no more can build up, I agree with the panacur and antibiotics.

Welcome to RU and don't ever be nervous about asking anything, we were all new once and we ALL learn from everyone, so bombard us with questions as I am sure someone can come up with the answer.

Come again soon :lol: and good luck

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:shock: :shock: How did I miss that about parsley??? I've been giving mine some, but will stop immediately. It's a continuous learning curve this rabbit ownership isn't it? :lol:

Yea i give parsley to my bun, he loves it aswell

I sometimes give Parsley to mine aswell ... I won't again though thanks for letting us know..

Hi Kate :wave:

reading through your post, do you know if your bun has bladder sludge or is your vet worried that he may start to get it :?: :?:

If you can hang about and wait for him to have a wee you will be able to tell as bladder sludge is like sludgy white chalk and dare I say it if you rub you fingers in it it will feel chalky :wink: even on newspaper you can tell the whiteness of it as the sludge settles/dries ontop of the paper :wink:

As well as the parsley, carrot tops are exceptionally high in calcium as I have just discovered, more so than Kale and Kale is very high in the calium department :wink: one of the top highest so puts carrot tops at the top of the list I think :wink:

try super forage as well as the timmy hay and try mixing it with your usual hay :wink:

oh **** i didnt kow about parsley or carrot tops either.

Thank you for that advice

Sue
xx

Denny said:

Kale is very high in the calium department :wink: one of the top highest so puts carrot tops at the top of the list I think

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Oh no Mine love Kale, I did not realise that calcium was such a no-no. Which veg are safer?

Julie

julieszoo said:

Denny said:

Kale is very high in the calium department :wink: one of the top highest so puts carrot tops at the top of the list I think

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Oh no Mine love Kale, I did not realise that calcium was such a no-no. Which veg are safer?

Julie

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kale is fine, just not advisable every day and a no no if your bun suffers with bladder sludge :wink: things like spinach, brocolli, kale, curly parsley (I did not know about the curly parsley until the other week from a post by snowy) and the carrot tops I found out about the other week from a book I have brought that I have lent it to a friend, dont get me on the hays, the contents were worse in some of them (not calcium but protein :shock: ) :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Rabbits do need a certain amount of calcium unless it is causing a problem in your rabbit. Do you have a problem with sludgy wee :?:

Thanks again

Thank you for the extra advice. When I had Gus out in the run today whilst I was cleaning him out, he had done a wee but it was clear. He really is drinking quite a bit at the moment too (15fl oz in 24 hours). The patches in the hutch just look clear as if someone has spilt water and don't smell. It is so hard to decipher anything when he is so bright in himself.
As for the Timothy Hay I specially went out for today, basically he told me to poke it! :evil: I also bought some with dandelion mixed in, does anybody use this or should I not try it :?: I just want him to get back to eating hay again.
The link that was mentioned earlier in a reply lists a lot of the calcium levels and is very useful, so thanks for that He hasn't finished his antibiotics yet, a couple more days to go, I then have to ring the vet to let him know how he is so we will go from there.

As for the panacur - do I get that from the vets? is it something they are happy to prescribe :?:

Thank you from me and a grateful Gus :rabbit2:

Yes Panacur by prescription from your vet there is a special Rabbit Panacur out that is a nine day course..you DO NOT want that one..that is a preventative wormer.
you need the a 28 day course of the 10% panacur..your vet will know which one..but it MUST be given every day for 28 days.

Good luck!

If your Buns wee is very watery and there is lots of it that MIGHT indicate a 'filtering problem' with the kidneys. This can indicate Diabetes Insipidus or impared kidney function in general. I would advise discussing this with your Vet again ASAP to ensure any necessary treatment is given promptly

Janex