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Help! Litter training- Update

Liz

Warren Scout
I know there has probably been threads on this before- but can't seem to find. Tallulah used a litter tray straight off- without any training as such- like Harvey- she poops everywhere but never urinated except in the litter tray . However! for the past 3 days- she has urinated in her hutch- on the bare floor part- I had put sawdust then hay down- but from the start she moved this away- seeming to prefer the bare board. The wee is going everywhere- she seems to stay/sit in it- if I would let her! She has even weed on her food and went to eat it- it all seems very strange and I am just not sure what to do. I have been checking regularly- and when wet- have washed/dried the hutch, washed and dried Tallulah and put her back in the hutch. On occasion she has urinated in it within half an hour again. Any ideas folks?
 
could somthing in her tray be irritating her bits? maybe thats why she prefers to sit and urinate on bare boards?
have you changed the ltype of litter?...does she appear to have any redness or irritation?
 
Hi there- thanks for the reply- I don't use litter as such- I use sawdust on the bottom with hay on top. Checked her bits- no red or soreness visible. She sits in the litter tray but wees outside it- I change it at least once a day- I have 2 trays in her hutch- 1 at each end in the corners. Any ideas? Anyone?
 
does she wee anywhere or just outside the litter tray?
if she is weeing randomly everywhere else maybe your cleaning out to often? :? if she cant smell where she went previously she might simply goo whereever?
does harvey use the same tray?
 
thanks again for your reply. She is weeing a little in the litter tray too- she doesnt wee often- but when she does- there is a lot-maybe it is the cleaning out too often- not the first time she did it but the few times since- it has been after i had cleaned it- i felt i should because she was standing in it and i didnt want it to burn her or stain her fur. she is in a fairly smallish hutch just now- harvs first one- so one wee can soak about a 1/3 to a 1/2 of the hutch- like a puddle. harv and tallulah are still in separate hutches as neither neutered yet- tallulah is still too young. on a more positive note- today i put lots of hay on the almost the whole floor of the hutch-since then, she has not weed outside the litter - yet!
 
Bump!
Any ideas? Anyone?
I usually tend to Harvey first when feeding/ cleaning litter etc- could it be anything to do with his smell on me or o her food/ hay/etc when I then tend to Tallulah?
She has been doing it again today- my worry is if she does (or is ) doing it when I am at work or during the night and then sitting in it until it dries- surely this cant be good for her. Am getting a bit worried now as I thought they hated water/fluid- Can she be making a point because I washed her paws the first couple of times she did this? Now I just wipe them with a damp cloth and dry her off.
 
if i go on google- what should i search for? litter training? I am really very worried about her- i think i will call the vet on monday- today she had the soft poo smeared all over her paws and her hutch- she is not clening herself- i have also noticed a wee sore on her back- just below her neck- the sore/scab is less than a centimetre but there is about an inch baldy patch around it- new to keeping rabbits and now realy quite anxious- cleaned her all up and she in the house for now - just so i can keep an eye on her- could she be depressed? Please- I would appreciate any advice at all here- as i just dont know what to do- or indeed if i am doing the right thing. if anyone had visted me early today- they would have thought she was neglected she was so dirty- as was her hutch. am really quite worried now.
 
Liz said:
if i go on google- what should i search for? litter training? I am really very worried about her- i think i will call the vet on monday- today she had the soft poo smeared all over her paws and her hutch- she is not clening herself- i have also noticed a wee sore on her back- just below her neck- the sore/scab is less than a centimetre but there is about an inch baldy patch around it- new to keeping rabbits and now realy quite anxious- cleaned her all up and she in the house for now - just so i can keep an eye on her- could she be depressed? Please- I would appreciate any advice at all here- as i just dont know what to do- or indeed if i am doing the right thing. if anyone had visted me early today- they would have thought she was neglected she was so dirty- as was her hutch. am really quite worried now.

I have pmd you, don't worry, you will get loads of good advice on here, we can all try to help you out! :D

Don't panic :D
 
Hi Liz.

How old is Tallulah and is she spayed?
The scab on her back may be from either a Vaccination or the antibiotic injection she will have had after her spay (if she has been done!)

As for the weeing, is she actually urinating or is she just leaking wee?
There are numerous reasons (few of them are serious!) as to why a Bun has lost their litter-tray training.

So if you could answer the above perhaps we can be of more help.
Try not to worry, although I know that with Bunnies worry tends to be something we all do rather a lot of!!

Janex
 
thanks for replying Jane- have been pm'ing loopylop as she giving me advice. Tallulah is only 3months old- too young to spay as yet- will probably be done nearer 20wks as is really quite a small bun. She has had both jabs- the last being 2 weeks ago- the scab seems more recent and is about an inch or away from where she got her jab- it is quite red and with a little dried blood- i dont know if she has been overzealous while scratching herself or something as she is bald around it. she did have 2 sores on her back when i got her- took her to the vet- he said nothing underneath- seemed like a bite as she was the "runt" of the litter apparently- hence so small and thin. I had cut her fur back around the sores to keep them dry- and they have since gone and the fur growing back. re urinating- it is a lot- she does not go often- but when she does- it is a wee pool. Have just did a google search re litter trining and got some tips to try- i am more wooried about the overall picture though- she is so frightened most of the time, the sore, the bald patch, the urinating, the poo all over a lot of the hutch, not cleaning herself- could she be depressed do you think? she sure has not taken to me at all- am trying real hard to do it all on her terms but can't all the time- ie; having to put her back in the hutch and having to wash her today as she had poo on tops and bottoms of her paws and over her belly.
 
I think the clue may be in her age. She is proabaly approaching puberty and Buns do sometimes become less good at using a litter tray.
It is always worthwhile ruling out a physical cause so I think it might be a good idea to take her and a wee sample along to the Vets. Buns can sometimes get a low grade cystitis (which might explain her reluctance to wee unless she really has to) but not appear too unwell in other ways.
Another thing I am finding myself thinking these days is prophylactic treatment with Panacur. This is a 28 day oral treatment to rid Bun of a parasite called Encephalitizoon Cuniculi (EC) EC can be contracted from Mum-Bun at birth and can cause a multitude of problems. As Tallullah has always been frail I think I would ask your Vet about treating her with Panacur 'just in case'.
Once any physical problems have been excluded I feel sure she will regain her litter-tray training once she is spayed. Although some Buns are just much muckier than others :roll:
When you go to your Vet I'd also ask for Tallulah's vision to be checked. EC can effect the eyes (causing inflammation of blood vessels and eventual lens rupture) IF, and I emphasise the 'if' it is EC and her vision is effected that could explain her nervousness.
I suspect the scab may well be from over vigourous scratching after vaccination but I'd get the Vet to check that too.
Janex
 
Thanks so much Jane- Have got lots of idea and advice now- will call monday for an appt with the vet- unless you think sooner? Buns are on excel too- as recommended by the vet and Loopylop was saying that this can cause upset tums sometimes- so will try another make of peelets too. What would I do without this forum? PANIC it think! Thanks again!
Liz :)
 
Monday will be fine for the Vets as long as Tallulah is eating OK and passing normal 'currant poos' even though she is not eating her caecotrophs.
It appears that Excel does cause some Buns to get a mucky Bum although I have never had a problem with it. Well, not ME but my Buns :lol:
However to my utter amazement I have managed to change them all over onto Science Selective :p I tried many times before but this time I was DETERMINED :p
SS has a higher fibre content so I'd try Tallulah on that. The other pellet feeds people on here tend to recommend are Oxbow and Allen and Page.
Good luck at the Vets and please keep us updated
:D :D
Oh, and I have all my panics on here. So everyone knows EVERYTHING thats going on :oops: :oops: :roll: :roll:

Janex
 
Yes- she is eating fine- she eats a lot! and some normal poops as well as the soft stuff- will call Monday and keep you posted- have written down your suggestions as couldn't pronounce some of the words :oops: :lol: thanks so much again!
Liz
 
hi there
have read a lot about litter training today- apparently its never really too late and it's easier after spaying/neutering as not so much marking territory etc- if you do a google search for rabbit litter training- theres is lots of useful info- hope it goes well
liz
 
OK- todays update- Cut out the veg and dried grass- kept her on just pellets, hay and water- no smearing or mucky paws this morning- no pools of wee either- there was one small amount just outside litter tray- but such a relief she was soaked and mucky today. She even came to me at the door of the hutch and I picked her up and brought her in the house- there was even a little binky later! still going to call vet tomorrow though- re scab/bald patch and poss EC etc- better safe than sorry.
 
Sounds like the poos are on the way to getting normal then which is good :D

Let us know how you get on at the vets :D
 
went to vet today- unfortunately the vet i ususally see is off for 3 wks. eyes checked- nothing to note by light in eyes- not big response when dropping cotton in front of eyes- have to keep a check to see if she bumps into things or gently/slowly put things in her way to see if bangs into- no evidence of that so far- maybe not a big response as Talulah seemed frozen in fear- she really is a nervous bun. re scab- thinks maybe parasite as a bit bald and scaly too- was given spot on xeno-450 (invermectin)- have to put on Talulah and Harvey as have used same grooming kit on them both :oops: (didnt think not too!) - no more smearing poop for 2 days now- since cut out veg. re wee- there may/may not be a problem- didnt take sample- as wasn't sure how to :oops: . vet said i have to monitor this over next wk to 10 days- said what you had suggested jane- cystitis/ EC- vet said hard to detect this- and wants to treat one thing at a time- so to go back in 7/10 days- monitoring meanwhile. I so wish I knew more about all this as would be more assertive when dealing with vet- hope it all settles down for her- poor wee soul.
 
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