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Moving buns from UK to Germany or France

What would your preference for moving be?

  • Don't move rabbits at all but re-home instead

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • By car - 7-9hrs each day over 2 days

    Votes: 2 66.7%
  • By car - 6hrs each day over 3 days

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • By car - 4hrs each day over 5 days

    Votes: 1 33.3%
  • By plane - only if in cabin

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • By plane - in cabin or hold

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    3

shava12000

New Kit
Hey there!

After living in the UK for 15 years and expecting to stay indeterminately, Brexit is now forcing me to consider moving back to Germany (Berlin) or France (probably Toulouse). This isn't something I want to do but feel pushed into by the way EU citizens here have been treated since the referendum. Nobody can live without basic rights and security. The question now is how do I get my two wonderful bunny babies, Maya and Ray-Ray, to the mainland in the least harmful way possible? They're a fully bonded pair of free range house rabbits with quite sturdy, bold temperaments at home but the second they go into a carrier and car (to take them to the vets or a bunny hotel) they seem super anxious and stressed. After each short journey it takes a good hour or two before they reappear from under the sofa or the favourite hiding corner, where they would have been lying around looking utterly traumatised with their little hearts beating like crazy. I'm probably being a bit overly dramatic about the short distance travelling since it clearly doesn't harm them long-term. It's just hard seeing them scared and distressed and it makes me quite anxious in turn. Hence, the idea of putting them through either a flight or a long car journey is pretty overwhelming and I wouldn't even think about it under different circumstances. As it is, I can't stay here and I can't leave them behind because I literally can't imagine life without them. Ultimately, of course their welfare comes first and if it really isn't possible to move them in a responsible way I may have to consider re-homing them or staying here til they leave me. The latter will hopefully still be years and years away though and it's not realistic for me to live in the UK post-Brexit. Sigh.

So what do you think? Have any of you transported/moved your bun(s) long distances? If so, how? Do you think a shorter journey by (much more noisy) plane would be preferable to a much longer journey by car/ferry? Do you have a vet/bunny expert who could provide advice? (My vet is lovely but says this isn't an area he feels comfortable giving advice on.)

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated - thanks a mil!

V.


Here's some more background info, which may help:
- Maya & Ray are mixed breed rescue rabbits
- age: 5.5 years (adopted at 7 months)
- size: 2.7 and 2.6kg respectively - in comparison to all the mini breeds around they're really pretty big
- health: generally very good but Maya has had some calcium sludge in her urinary tract recently so they're now on a pure lettuce and hay diet (previously it was greens and hay)

Travel by plane
- Lufthansa allows for small animals to be transported as additional cabin baggage, i.e. in theory I could take both of them onto the plane in a small carrier and have the carrier on my lap for the duration of the flight. In reality their policy is to only allow cats and dogs in the cabin and to put all other animals in the hold but I think there are probably ways to challenge/circumvent that since a friend of mine who regularly takes her small dog on Lufthansa flights says nobody has ever actually looked inside her carrier to check whether the dog is indeed a dog. (https://www.lufthansa.com/pe/en/animals-as-additional-carry-on-baggage)
- A flight from Manchester to Berlin takes ca. 2hrs, and if you add to that travel to and from the airport, security and passport checks and the fact that you have to present at check-in 2 hours prior to departure (just to make it even harder on the little ones, grrhhhh), etc. I reckon a door to door journey may take around 6hrs
- I've found some testimonials online from people who have moved bunnies from Asia to the US or similar (ie on much longer flights) themselves or through a pet relocation service and said it was fine. (But I'm not particularly reassured by that. Should I be?)

Travel by car
- Let's assume I'm moving to Berlin, which is ca 950 miles (or 1530km) away. (Toulouse is roughly the same distance.). That is likely to take between 14-18.5hrs if done in one go. I don't actually have a driving licence and would have to rely on a friend to drive so we couldn't do it in one stretch and would have to stay over at least once (which might be better for the buns anyway). That would mean two days of travel of around 7-9hrs each day.
- Assuming that I'd be moving my furniture, etc. at the same time we'd probably travel in a small van, which means they wouldn't necessarily have to be in a small carrier. I've got a 30x21 inch puppy crate that I currently use for some extra shelter (and a litter tray) for them in a corner of a hallway. It's large enough for both of them to be lying down fully stretched out and I've already covered the top half to make it more into a cosy, protected, burrow-type space. Indeed, going by how fast the litter tray in there fills up, it seems like a favourite poop spot.
- If the trips to the vets and bunny hotel are anything to go by (longest journey they've ever taken would have been around 1hr one time we got stuck in traffic) they're unlikely to eat anything while driving and I'm not sure that taking breaks would help with that either because it always takes them quite some time to calm down after each trip. As in: I imagine that a break would have to be at least 1.5hrs to allow them to recover before hopefully eating something. Therefore, I'm wondering if it would be better to drive shorter distances spread out over more days so that they have one big stretch of driving each day but are in the same environment (i.e. a hotel room, airbnb, etc.) for the rest of the time. Maybe 4.5hrs over 5 days? Or 6hrs over 3?
- Some people online recommend taking critical care and feed them with that at regular intervals (every 2-3hrs) during the journey but that seems a bit over the top to me. Obviously I get the importance of regular feeding for rabbit digestion but both of mine have had the odd upset tummy where they didn't eat for up to 10hrs and then carried on right as rain. From those occasions I also know that they don't take kindly to being force fed critical care. Indeed, I've tried to on a couple of occasions (following all the usual tips re burrito-ing them in a towel, putting them on a table facing the edge, etc.) but failed every time. Even when unwell they're still surprisingly strong - and since they both detest being picked up that's not something I often do and hence quite stressful for them when it has to happen. Although maybe syringe feeding water throughout the journey is a good idea if they don't drink by themselves?
- Is it likely that they'd get used to driving after a while? Should I try to get them more used to it by taking them on car journeys now? If so, how long should they be? Or is that only causing them more distress now without much of a chance of it being beneficial later?
- Many moons ago when my childhood pet rabbit was ill we took him to my grandparents with us over the weekend. Clearly we had no idea what we were doing since we only took my bun but not their bonded mate and should have just left him in his usual surroundings, etc. Still, despite the fact that he seemed so poorly (difficult to remember details from 30 years ago but he was fairly out of it for at least two weeks and it then took another week or two before he was strong enough to hop again; before that he'd just flop to the side unable to keep himself sitting up) he made the 1h45mins journey there and back okay. While it pains me to think of how stressful that must have been for him, I find it kinda reassuring that a rabbit who was smaller than my current ones and fairly touch and go at the time survived that ordeal. Surely that makes it much less likely that Maya and Ray might not survive? I have to admit that anything happening to either or both of them on the journey is the stuff my nightmares are made of.
 
I would take them by road in carriers stuffed with hay and fresh grass / greens so they have moist food. I wouldn't have them being transported in anything larger as there is the risk of injury whilst on the road. They will be safer and feel more secure in carriers.

Take water for frequent watering stops. Bottles and bowls in transit can be a problem if they spill and the bedding becomes wet.

Some members have tried to fly rabbits out of the UK before and found it impossible as cabin baggage at the time. That was some years ago, though.

I have taken a rabbit to Ireland and back via road / ferry and he was fine. He was disabled and needed syringe feeding and there was no-one to leave him with, so he went with me. They do tend to settle down into the carrier and it just takes as long as it takes.

I have also known someone who transported a few rabbits to Germany and back to the UK every few years - their partner was in the forces. The hutches etc were dismantled and transported each time.

If you are stopping over somewhere, take a collapsible run or dog crate so they have some extra space overnight. They will also need a good supply of their regular dry food in case you can't get it in your new home - allow for a few weeks for changeover to whatever is available locally.

You may need to check with authorities such as DEFRA on regulations for exporting pet rabbits.
 
I would take them by road in carriers stuffed with hay and fresh grass / greens so they have moist food. I wouldn't have them being transported in anything larger as there is the risk of injury whilst on the road. They will be safer and feel more secure in carriers.

Take water for frequent watering stops. Bottles and bowls in transit can be a problem if they spill and the bedding becomes wet.

Some members have tried to fly rabbits out of the UK before and found it impossible as cabin baggage at the time. That was some years ago, though.

I have taken a rabbit to Ireland and back via road / ferry and he was fine. He was disabled and needed syringe feeding and there was no-one to leave him with, so he went with me. They do tend to settle down into the carrier and it just takes as long as it takes.

I have also known someone who transported a few rabbits to Germany and back to the UK every few years - their partner was in the forces. The hutches etc were dismantled and transported each time.

If you are stopping over somewhere, take a collapsible run or dog crate so they have some extra space overnight. They will also need a good supply of their regular dry food in case you can't get it in your new home - allow for a few weeks for changeover to whatever is available locally.

You may need to check with authorities such as DEFRA on regulations for exporting pet rabbits.


i tend to agree on this ↑

it may've been the vets that stressed them rather than being in a carrier.
my last 2 were not tame at all & hated being caught &/or handled but once in a carrier they were OK.

being in a car would mean you would be able to have breaks & feed & water them.

- just as long as they don't get too hot in a car.
 
My rabbits are very different travellers: Lopsy gets on just fine, but Aboleth doesn't like being moved not of her own accord, be it in a carrier or just me moving the litter tray. She doesn't relax until the top of the carrier is opened, so she knows she's not being moved anymore. I don't think she'd react well to this sort of move. I don't think I'd consider transporting Aboleth and would rehome her (with Lopsy for the sake of argument :)). But then my rabbits aren't loved pets (that sounds harsher than i mean it), I've taken them on for their sake, not mine, so I expect my situation is different to yours.

The road move sounds better tbh, especially as air travel comes with more risk (flights being delayed, aircraft overbooked, that sort of thing) and you have more control, arguably, of road movements.
 
Plane (in cabin not the hold) would probably be my first choice as the journey will be a lot shorter, you can keep a close eye on them (unlike if they're in the back of a van), and it won't be as bumpy and they won't see the outdoors flashing past the window, but of course you can't just stop and let them run around. If you do decide to drive i think regular breaks are a must, as you said they don't tend to eat/drink much during travel so you will need to stop regularly enough to keep their stomachs moving and for long enough for them to calm down and feel like eating. I would definitely have them confined to a carrier, but you could have a pen set up in the back for when you stop. If they are prone to stasis I would have a conversation with your vet before you go, they may consider prescribing something to help prevent it. The best thing to do in the meantime whilst you decide is try prepare them as much as possible. I would probably start with noise, find a road/traffic noise video on youtube and play that whilst they're eating, increasing the volume each day. Then I would get them really familiar with the carrier they're going to be in, leave it in their cage/run/enclosure, put food inside it, let them explore it on their own terms. If you do decide to go via van, nearer the time I would put them in the car/van/whatever you have access to (but i would cover them up so it's dark as the back of a van would be, i think sometimes them being able to see out of the window and seeing how fast outside seems to be moving makes things worse). Start off by just picking up the carrier and putting it in the vehicle, so they get used to being enclosed in a small space and moved to an unfamiliar environment, and try encourage them to eat. Then once they seem okay with that, you can move on to doing it with the engine running, then the vehicle actually driving etc.
 
I've been trying to figure out a way to get the bunnies over to the netherlands, as my boyfriend would like to move back there being his home. its a nightmare honestly :(

finding an airline that will accept pets in the cabin into the UK will be hard. there are laws against it and no airline is permitted to carry pets in the cabin if I'm not mistaken. its a messy area and hard to find any clean cut information imho. theres no official website about it or similar. however there are a few articles from other places:

The first consideration is the Pet Travel Scheme outlined by DEFRA (the UK government Department for Environment, Food & Rural Affairs). The second, more pressing issue, was that UK Authorities do not permit animals to fly to the UK within the aircraft cabin because they wish to prevent rabies from entering the country via infected animals. There are strong border controls in force checking animals that travel in the hold, however they feel it would not be possible to prevent rabies from entering the country if animals were routinely allowed into the cabin. Only certain airlines are permitted to carry dogs, cats and ferrets into the UK under the Pet Travel Scheme and none of them are permitted to bring in animals within the aircraft cabin. The exception to this rule is if you are travelling with an Assistance Dog.
from: https://pethelpful.com/dogs/flying-with-pets-in-cabin-to-UK

I would personally not allow them in the hold at all, its noisy and scary for them and I'd worry they'd pass from stress. along with that theres been a few too many ""accidents"" of rabbits being mishandled or even put in the incorrect spaces, and dying due to that.

there are pet relocation companies but in my experience most don't have a clue about rabbits. many wanted to split Luna & Orion into separate carriers which them being a bonded pair is a no go, and didn't seem to understand the urgency of them not eating. all in all I wasn't personally impressed with what they said to me. it might be something you can look into, but personally it didn't strike me as a good option.

for me, I would not trust anybody with my babies but myself. so the only option me is via car, but sadly I don't drive, so my options are even narrower!

I would opt for driving in decent carriers or a small sized dog pen. bring along a pop up run so they can have some exercise.

the one thing (while more complicated) could be driving across and then getting a flight in europe, as I believe the laws are laxer on animals flying in the cabin.
 
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