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Sore Hocks: Where to go from here?

Akire

Young Bun
My 8 year old bun named Dunkin (Dwarf mix) has been struggling with a bad case of sore hocks for a few months now (since the beginning of November 2016). When I say bad I mean bleeding, open wounds and infection. I'm really at a total loss of what to do because they just don't want to get better and it kills me to not be able to fix my baby boy! :( He's seen THREE different vets. The first was useless, the second not all that better. The third has been treating him since January of this year and says it will just take a long time to heal...

He's been on antibiotics for a month for the infection and had an x-ray of his back feet. It showed very mild arthritis (ie not enough to be the cause) and thankfully no bone infection. Dunkin has always been on soft material in his cage. The only sore hock related problem he's had previously is accidently having a callous on his foot getting torn off and bleeding. It quickly went away. I keep his nails trimmed and he isn't overweight. He is out of his cage pretty much all day, but he never runs around. Just sits mostly. :? I do notice he has terrible posture where he sits with his back feet far in front of him or with his toes practically pointing up in the air. So basically all weight on his hocks.

Dunkin has had his feet wrapped for two months now (they get changed of course) with thick pads on his hocks. The infection is gone. About two weeks back his feet were looking better. I just changed his wraps tonight and they are looking more swollen and red, but the most concerning is the dark spots and what looks like a boil. I couldn't get anything to come out and didn't want to press the matter. The reason his feet are wrapped is due to the fact that when they aren't his hocks start looking worse within 12 hrs. The vet instructed me to put Vetericyn on his feet when I change the wraps to help keep infection at bay. I did that tonight and he acted like it stung badly. It's supposed to be very gentle, so I'm guessing that foot hurts him a lot.

I thought that maybe he has arthritis in his spine since he sits weird and sometimes after sleeping for a while he will stretch and start thumping, almost like he's sore and it hurts. I asked the vet last time he saw her if a spine x-ray was a good idea, but she didn't think it was necessary because she could lift his hind-end up in the air and it didn't bother him? :? I'm starting to think I should get one anyway just to rule it out. I just find it weird the problem showed up so badly out of the blue and won't go away despite my best efforts. I'm so frustrated!

Here is his feet tonight. The redness is back and they are getting more swollen again. Also, they look very dry. Flakey skin was falling off.
*removed pic*

In this photo a red arrow is pointing to what looks like a boil possibly? This is the foot that he reacted very strongly when Vetericyn was applied
*removed pic*
 
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I'm afraid I don't have any advice, if he's on soft material that is great. I'm sending lots of vibes to him. Hopefully your new vets are experienced in rabbits?
 
Is he on any treatment for the arthritis (even if it's not confirmed by x-ray)? Easing the pain and inflammation from that (eg with metacam daily and long term) may help his posture and reduce the sore hocks. Otherwise, you are doing all the right things and it's probably going to be an ongoing issue that has to be managed as you are doing.

Jack's-Jane has had a lot of experience with rex rabbits and sore hocks - maybe search through some of her old posts for ideas.
 
Thanks for the replies, I will look up posts by Jack's-Jane. One of the previous vets he saw was a highly recommended rabbit vet, but he was totally useless and didn't take it seriously. I think my experience wasn't what people normally experience with him, of course. :roll: The current vet is recommended by the House Rabbit Society in my area. She's been good, but I do have concerns as to why we aren't trying treating arthritis, like Shimmer mentioned. :?

It's really frustrating to be trying my hardest and spending all this money on various vets, only to end up back at the start.
 
Thanks for the replies, I will look up posts by Jack's-Jane. One of the previous vets he saw was a highly recommended rabbit vet, but he was totally useless and didn't take it seriously. I think my experience wasn't what people normally experience with him, of course. :roll: The current vet is recommended by the House Rabbit Society in my area. She's been good, but I do have concerns as to why we aren't trying treating arthritis, like Shimmer mentioned. :?

It's really frustrating to be trying my hardest and spending all this money on various vets, only to end up back at the start.

Arthritis is very difficult (impossible?) to treat, though the symptoms can be managed to some extent wth pain killers. Other adjuncts such as physiotherapy and acupuncture could also be useful.

Whether these would significantly impact on sore hocks is another matter :)

I have always used socks and boots whilst the hocks got better .....
 
Sorry, I know "treat" isn't really the right word since you cannot cure arthritis but can only manage the symptoms. It might not make a difference but I'm willing to try anything :)

The way his wraps are, I use three gauze pads stacked and cut a small hole out of the middle. The vet said this was good because it takes pressure off the hocks. She said it doesn't matter that he's on something soft anymore. It's similar to an elderly person who is bed bound. They can be on a very soft mattress and still get bed sores/pressure ulcers. She said that's basically what he has, but his are from sitting on his hocks all the time.

I forgot to include these pictures before, but this is what his hocks looked at pretty much their worst (December 2016). Pus came out of those holes in his feet. :cry: You can see how incredibly swollen his hocks were. Basically double the size they normally were. He still has the fur loss going up his foot by the way. I pulled back the fur in the picture to show how high the irritation goes.

*images removed*
 
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I've been nursing Foxy for nearly 6 months now, and has been hutch bound on nothing but baby swaddles, cotton faced, and cotton covered duvets.
Metacam twice a day, and has good days and bad days with them still. Some days they look okay, and the next they look inflamed and puffy.

The comfort I can take, is knowing no matter how well you care for them they can still get them!!
I hope your bunny gets better soon, it is heartbreaking. I'm currently in the process of reevaluating her runaround type system, that was where they came from inadequate piping not sold by runaround but another company, a lesser quality as I had a hutch from them. We will then be ready for spring/summer and getting out her hutch.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Sorry, I know "treat" isn't really the right word since you cannot cure arthritis but can only manage the symptoms. It might not make a difference but I'm willing to try anything :)

The way his wraps are, I use three gauze pads stacked and cut a small hole out of the middle. The vet said this was good because it takes pressure off the hocks. She said it doesn't matter that he's on something soft anymore. It's similar to an elderly person who is bed bound. They can be on a very soft mattress and still get bed sores/pressure ulcers. She said that's basically what he has, but his are from sitting on his hocks all the time.

I forgot to include these pictures before, but this is what his hocks looked at pretty much their worst (December 2016). Pus came out of those holes in his feet. :cry: You can see how incredibly swollen his hocks were. Basically double the size they normally were. He still has the fur loss going up his foot by the way. I pulled back the fur in the picture to show how high the irritation goes.

32804854856_af78ef247f.jpg
32845808225_d2a4fbacc3.jpg

Sorry I have only just seen your PM so I am a bit late here.

I think you may be correct in thinking that spinal arthritis may be an issue. I have dealt with exactly that scenario in a Conti called Mo

*WARNING GRAPHIC IMAGE ON THE FOLLOWING LINK*

http://s16.photobucket.com/user/Jan-bun/media/Rabbit Health Etc/Picture2083_zpsq9qnqgaf.jpg.html

Did the Vet also take spinal radiographs ? Obviously any spinal pain will effect mobility and may alter the Rabbit's gait/posture.

Your Bunny's hocks do look to be badly infected again. Did the Vet show you how to correctly apply the dressings so they do not impair the blood circulation to the limbs ? Doing so would obviously cause wound healing/infection problems.

Unfortunately surgery may be needed to assess the tendons which can become displaced/infected in advanced cases of sore hocks. Has this been suggested ?

Has the Vet taken swabs from the wounds to try to identify the specific bacteria involved and the most appropriate antibiotic to prescribe ?

What pain relief is your Rabbit receiving ?

Sorry for all the questions.

These links provide some information about sore hocks (Ulcerative Pododermatitis)

https://books.google.co.uk/books?id...ge&q=rabbit ulcerative pododermatitis&f=false

http://wildpro.twycrosszoo.org/S/00dis/Miscellaneous/Ulcerative_pododermatitis_rabbits.htm

*WARNING-GRAPHIC IMAGES ON THE FOLLOWING LINK*

http://www.medirabbit.com/EN/Skin_diseases/Mechanical/Pod/Podo.htm

I do hope that your Vet can help to get your Bunny more comfortable xx
 
bunnymum85 - Thank you, I really appreciate it and hope your bunny gets fully healed soon!

Jack's-Jane - Thank you so much for responding, I will try to answer all your questions :)

Did the Vet also take spinal radiographs ? Obviously any spinal pain will effect mobility and may alter the Rabbit's gait/posture.

No Spinal Radiographs, just the back feet which showed mild arthritis that the vet didn't think was contributing. There was no infection in the bone. Previously I had asked specially about an x-ray of his spine, but she didn't think it was necessary because she could lift his rear in the air and he didn't react.

Your Bunny's hocks do look to be badly infected again. Did the Vet show you how to correctly apply the dressings so they do not impair the blood circulation to the limbs ? Doing so would obviously cause wound healing/infection problems.

No they didn't show me, I had to go to the rabbit rescue I volunteer at and get help. Actually, the last time the vet did wrap his feet I had to rush him back the next morning because his left foot swelled up overnight and he wouldn't put weight on it. I was freaking out so badly. Thankfully I noticed and was able to get him in before the foot started to get cold.

Unfortunately surgery may be needed to assess the tendons which can become displaced/infected in advanced cases of sore hocks. Has this been suggested ?

Nope, not once.

Has the Vet taken swabs from the wounds to try to identify the specific bacteria involved and the most appropriate antibiotic to prescribe ?

No swabs have been taken. He was put on TMS for a month.

What pain relief is your Rabbit receiving ?

None, which pisses me off. All three of the vets he's seen are apprehensive about pain meds! I think it's because he's older. He's only 8 though... it's not like he's ancient or something. :?

I'm happy to answer any questions you have for me, but after answering the one's above I'm beginning to feel like this vet isn't taking this serious like the others. I shouldn't have to answer "no" or "none" to so many questions. I feel like I should try taking him to someone else, again. :|

I've been doing TONS of reading online regarding sore hocks. I bought some thick and soft baby socks at the store to use instead of the bandages, that way I can change them more often. I read they are better anyway because they allow the foot to breathe, yet still offer protection. I read that a tea bag allowed to cool and placed on the hocks for a bit can be soothing so I bought some pure Camomile tea bags.
 
bunnymum85 - Thank you, I really appreciate it and hope your bunny gets fully healed soon!

Jack's-Jane - Thank you so much for responding, I will try to answer all your questions :)



No Spinal Radiographs, just the back feet which showed mild arthritis that the vet didn't think was contributing. There was no infection in the bone. Previously I had asked specially about an x-ray of his spine, but she didn't think it was necessary because she could lift his rear in the air and he didn't react.



No they didn't show me, I had to go to the rabbit rescue I volunteer at and get help. Actually, the last time the vet did wrap his feet I had to rush him back the next morning because his left foot swelled up overnight and he wouldn't put weight on it. I was freaking out so badly. Thankfully I noticed and was able to get him in before the foot started to get cold.



Nope, not once.



No swabs have been taken. He was put on TMS for a month.



None, which pisses me off. All three of the vets he's seen are apprehensive about pain meds! I think it's because he's older. He's only 8 though... it's not like he's ancient or something.
:?

I'm happy to answer any questions you have for me, but after answering the one's above I'm beginning to feel like this vet isn't taking this serious like the others. I shouldn't have to answer "no" or "none" to so many questions. I feel like I should try taking him to someone else, again. :|

I've been doing TONS of reading online regarding sore hocks. I bought some thick and soft baby socks at the store to use instead of the bandages, that way I can change them more often. I read they are better anyway because they allow the foot to breathe, yet still offer protection. I read that a tea bag allowed to cool and placed on the hocks for a bit can be soothing so I bought some pure Camomile tea bags.

My god, no pain relief :shock: Seriously, I am actually sickened by this :cry: I am assuming that the Vet you consult is not the one who deals with the Rescue Rabbits ? A Vet can run a blood profile to assess the Rabbit's kidney/liver function before deciding on the type of analgesia to prescribe and at what dose. I just find it to be very upsetting that no pain relief at all has been given for what is obviously an extremely painful condition.I am sure that you are very upset too.

Are there other Vets in your area whom you could consult ? From your answers to my questions it does not sound as though the current Vet is being too helpful :? There is a lot more that could be done that obviously has not been done :cry: I would try to see if you can locate a more Rabbit Savvy Vet. I dont know if this link is of any help:

http://rabbit.org/vet-listings/
 
My god, no pain relief :shock: Seriously, I am actually sickened by this :cry: I am assuming that the Vet you consult is not the one who deals with the Rescue Rabbits ? A Vet can run a blood profile to assess the Rabbit's kidney/liver function before deciding on the type of analgesia to prescribe and at what dose. I just find it to be very upsetting that no pain relief at all has been given for what is obviously an extremely painful condition.I am sure that you are very upset too.

Are there other Vets in your area whom you could consult ? From your answers to my questions it does not sound as though the current Vet is being too helpful :? There is a lot more that could be done that obviously has not been done :cry: I would try to see if you can locate a more Rabbit Savvy Vet. I dont know if this link is of any help:

http://rabbit.org/vet-listings/

I've honestly just been having the most awful luck with vets around here :( The one he is currently seeing is recommended in the link you provided. She's supposed to be rabbit savvy. For some reason the vets around here just don't want to take this issue seriously. They just say "it's going to take a while, sore hocks are stubborn" which I realize, but surely we should be doing more. Like pain meds and some kind of ointment for me to apply :?

All I'm doing right now is keeping his feet wrapped and applying the Vetericyn once a week. It feels like the bare minimum.

I need to take him somewhere else anyway, because the current vet said he has a spur on his back tooth but he wouldn't let her grind it down. She quoted $711 for the procedure to file down that tooth under anesthesia... :shock: The owner at the rabbit rescue said that is ridiculously overpriced and told me to go to a different vet for a second opinion.
 
I've honestly just been having the most awful luck with vets around here :( The one he is currently seeing is recommended in the link you provided. She's supposed to be rabbit savvy. For some reason the vets around here just don't want to take this issue seriously. They just say "it's going to take a while, sore hocks are stubborn" which I realize, but surely we should be doing more. Like pain meds and some kind of ointment for me to apply :?

All I'm doing right now is keeping his feet wrapped and applying the Vetericyn once a week. It feels like the bare minimum.

I need to take him somewhere else anyway, because the current vet said he has a spur on his back tooth but he wouldn't let her grind it down. She quoted $711 for the procedure to file down that tooth under anesthesia... :shock: The owner at the rabbit rescue said that is ridiculously overpriced and told me to go to a different vet for a second opinion.

I would try to get started on locating a more Rabbit Savvy Vet who is willing to actually treat the sore hocks appropriately. Not really wanting to jump on the 'Vet Bashing Wagon' but you are paying your current Vet for a service that is far short of being even 'adequate'. I would vote with your feet (and your money) and take your custom elsewhere pronto. The situation must be so distressing for you :cry: It upsets me just reading about it as with over 16 years of dealing with several cases of sore hocks I know just how serious it can be and how very, very painful. In my unqualified opinion it is negligent of a Vet not to prescibe pain relief for a Rabbit with an agonisingly painful condition.

Sorry, my ranting wont help you or your Bunny :oops:

You are trying very hard to help your Bunny and I hope you will find a Vet willing and able to do the same xx
 
Sorry for not updating sooner! I called my vet after seeing your post Jack's-Jane and said I wanted pain meds (he's now on Metacam once a day). It seems to be making a noticeable difference in his activity levels. He's actually been running around a bit, binkying and playing! I don't remember seeing him so happy and playful since Amber passed away. He's also back on TMS for 14 days. Since he is responding so well to pain meds I'm guessing he does have arthritis in his back that was contributing. It makes sense since his is activity level dropped very low and then he got the sore hocks, not the other way around. I hope since the pain is under control that his hocks start showing real improvement. Fingers crossed!

Thanks for the help :wave:
 
Good update! I'm sorry you've had to go through all this to get to this stage. Hope he continues to inprove xx
 
Sorry for not updating sooner! I called my vet after seeing your post Jack's-Jane and said I wanted pain meds (he's now on Metacam once a day). It seems to be making a noticeable difference in his activity levels. He's actually been running around a bit, binkying and playing! I don't remember seeing him so happy and playful since Amber passed away. He's also back on TMS for 14 days. Since he is responding so well to pain meds I'm guessing he does have arthritis in his back that was contributing. It makes sense since his is activity level dropped very low and then he got the sore hocks, not the other way around. I hope since the pain is under control that his hocks start showing real improvement. Fingers crossed!

Thanks for the help :wave:

Metacam makes a world of difference to the quality of life :) It's so good to hear he's been enjoying things again.

Once the arthritis is 'under control' with pain management, you may see the hocks improve.
I've known this with one of my rabbits, for sure :)

Good luck xx
 
Sorry for not updating sooner! I called my vet after seeing your post Jack's-Jane and said I wanted pain meds (he's now on Metacam once a day). It seems to be making a noticeable difference in his activity levels. He's actually been running around a bit, binkying and playing! I don't remember seeing him so happy and playful since Amber passed away. He's also back on TMS for 14 days. Since he is responding so well to pain meds I'm guessing he does have arthritis in his back that was contributing. It makes sense since his is activity level dropped very low and then he got the sore hocks, not the other way around. I hope since the pain is under control that his hocks start showing real improvement. Fingers crossed!

Thanks for the help :wave:

I am so glad that I was able to help and that the Vet finally prescribed pain relief. Drop me another PM if I can be of any more assistance :)
 
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