I've seen it all now.

Lovely Benjie is stretching my ingenuity.
He's recently got an isolated thrombocytopaenia, probably due to intra abdominal neoplasm.
We got out of the verge of stasis, (main cause - excessive fear of the slightest sound) with lavender sprigs.
I can't help his abdominal cradling - NSAI's would increase his bleeding tendancy & the opiate family would slow down his gut too much.
I should add that it's more discomfort that serious pain. his ear skin is nice & pink, he's very active following me up & down stairs, comes down to see visitors & shows interest in them etc.

So the above issues have exaccerbated his snuffles. This is the unbelievable bit. Benjie sleeps like a wildie - head back between the shoulder blades, but this position increases his nasal obstruction so he's snored for the last 2 years.
not a hint of obstruction when awake! Now the snuffles is worse, he wakes himself up when he tries to sleep.

Front paws too far back to rest his head on. He's got a bloomin "hock sore" on his chin.:shock:
he gets a 2hourly nebuliser which has unblocked his tear duct & I let him have some kip with his head resting between my knees.
I've tried rolling up a bit of a soft woolley jumper to prop up his head but he doesn't want to know.
I'm hand feeding him a lot so he doesn't have to scrape his chin on the floor.

I'm right off.
Together we've got his gut in such good form, he's got fantastic big poops no uneaten caecals & after 6 consecutive weeks of weight loss, managed weight gain of 100 Gm over the last 2 weeks. Goodness but he's a fighter!! I didn't know he had it in him.

You may laugh if you wish. What do I do with a bun with a "hock sore" on his chin?

Oh bless him. I can offer absolutely no advice at all but just wanted to send lots of vibes to Benji. What a fighter! I hope someone can give you some advice to help his sore chin. Xx

roxyroller88 said:

Oh bless him. I can offer absolutely no advice at all but just wanted to send lots of vibes to Benji. What a fighter! I hope someone can give you some advice to help his sore chin. Xx

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Benjie says thank you very much for your vibes roxyroller88. He says that although he's a bit of a wabbit rabbit at the mo he's got a lot more determination than the "Missus" thinks.

I'm really missing his snoring. I'm so used to waiting until he snores, "Ah he's asleep now" turning over, & going to sleep myself. Now it takes me ages to get off! It's so quiet!!!:lol:

Poor Benjie His chin must be very sore. I have no advice what to do about it other than what you are already doing i.e. giving him a soft place to rest his chin while asleep. I guess if there was some cream that would help, he wouldn't be able to lick if off. I have no idea what to use though.

Sending him loads of vibes and I hope you find something to help his poorly chin.

Oh dear, I'm afraid I can't offer any advice, but I'm sending lots of vibes for Benjie, I hope it gets better soon:thumb:

Poor Benji, can't help or advise I'm afraid, but sending lots of chin healing vibes his way xxxxx

Oh Benjie boy - I have absolutely no advice. I'd be tempted to try some high grade manuka but there again I can imagine many rabbits hating having a sticky chin. Many vibes for him & you in finding a way forward

thumps_ said:

Lovely Benjie is stretching my ingenuity.
He's recently got an isolated thrombocytopaenia, probably due to intra abdominal neoplasm.
We got out of the verge of stasis, (main cause - excessive fear of the slightest sound) with lavender sprigs.
I can't help his abdominal cradling - NSAI's would increase his bleeding tendancy & the opiate family would slow down his gut too much.
I should add that it's more discomfort that serious pain. his ear skin is nice & pink, he's very active following me up & down stairs, comes down to see visitors & shows interest in them etc.

So the above issues have exaccerbated his snuffles. This is the unbelievable bit. Benjie sleeps like a wildie - head back between the shoulder blades, but this position increases his nasal obstruction so he's snored for the last 2 years.
not a hint of obstruction when awake! Now the snuffles is worse, he wakes himself up when he tries to sleep.

Front paws too far back to rest his head on. He's got a bloomin "hock sore" on his chin.:shock:
he gets a 2hourly nebuliser which has unblocked his tear duct & I let him have some kip with his head resting between my knees.
I've tried rolling up a bit of a soft woolley jumper to prop up his head but he doesn't want to know.
I'm hand feeding him a lot so he doesn't have to scrape his chin on the floor.

I'm right off.
Together we've got his gut in such good form, he's got fantastic big poops no uneaten caecals & after 6 consecutive weeks of weight loss, managed weight gain of 100 Gm over the last 2 weeks. Goodness but he's a fighter!! I didn't know he had it in him.

You may laugh if you wish. What do I do with a bun with a "hock sore" on his chin?

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Thumps! Benjie is certainly pressing out the boundaries

I'm so glad he's such a fighter. So independent and knows his own mind!

I have a suggestion for his sore chin, and as I owe you one I shall make the effort today

Hugs to you and Benjie x

Benjie says "Oh Wow! thank you for all the vibes, they make me feel good.
I reckon I need one of those things the ladies have.
I didn't hear a naughty giggle did I?:shock: Not humans silly, - rabbits, - a dewlap to rest my chin on. Any vibes going for a dewlap?"

Yes, Benjie has started to really hunch up. Of course I panic that his pain is worse, but his behaviour is just the same, ears nice & pink etc & he's certainly eating.
Unbelievably he's even disadvantaged here, because his veins are very friable, & although an excellent vet, she had to take bloods from the jugular, so his neck is shaved.

This is NOT a recommended diet, Benjie is fantastic at self regulating his diet.
Daily - 125 Gm fresh dill, 200 gm flat leaf parsley (Yep his wee is noticably more chalky but we aren't hitting problems of a sludgy bladder) 4-6 sticks of lemon grass cut longitudinally, 25 gm basil, 4-5 long thin apple twigs from a tree that hasn't been pruned for a few years, a good handful of dry hawthorn, usually a good handful of ribwort plantain, pellets vary daily, sometimes a lot, sometimes none, he always has blackthorn with his pellets, sometimes a good handful of dried brambles, he's stopped the lavender now.

He gets lots of stroking which calms him down, & he almost sleeps while I prop his head. He still purrs when stroked & is determined to lick me in return - either nose licks, or hand. (We're allogrooming like partner buns do)
I should add that I've always used saline in the nebuliser to loosen secretions, so I can do it on my knee. He loves his bisolvon wrapped in a basil leaf.

Some may ask why I'm not giving ABx? His platelets were down to 34 which is bad news, & he's at risk of internal bleeding if we have a struggle. If it was just a bad flare up of snuffles obviously he'd have ABx (Sorry matey you've just got to put up with it)
The big factor is kindness. I know we're in a no wins situation. I just want him to be as comfortable as poss. minimize stress, & let him know he is loved very much. Paradoxically both humans & buns usually live longer when we can do this well. We all know that any stress in rabbits slows down the gut, & knocks down the white count.

Don't imagine for a second that we've given up. This is actually the toughest battle of all. Benjie is the most affectionate rabbit anyone could hope for. He's always stressed very easily. I think because his sense of smell ( major sense to detect danger) is compromised by the snuffles. It might be that with one ear up & the other down, he finds it a bit difficult to localise sound, so he always feels vulnerable after the awful start to his life. I've often found it so difficult to understand what's stressing him & deal with it for him. Battle royal is on!

A very big thank you for all your support.

hi Thumps_ .. just sending some more vibes for Benjie and for you

Thank you so much Griffsk
I found some balm for his chin, & it's healed well - just waiting for the stubbly beard to grow.
He's had a few down days, verging on stasis, empties his caecum then eats for a warren.

I was given some homeopathic tabs for my own long standing "snuffles". (I've had a disgusting hacking cough for over a year from thick nasal secretions) I know - all the studies show it's just placebo effect - but when nothing else works & it can't do harm - give it a whirl. The secretions became thinner overnight, easier to handle, & my nose unblocked. So I gave some to Benjie, powdered up in a basil leaf. He'd virtually stopped snoring by the next night! TBH the house seems very quiet without rabbit snores. I wish we could give ABx like that in powder form!!

Currently Benjie is having the my homeopathy, & I'm doing an experiment on myself along the lines of Koch's postulates but this time for efficacy of meds!.

For light heartedness, some years ago I had a conversation with a GP friend who was more than surprised by the positive effect of some homeopathic medicine she had taken as a last resort. Like me, long standing minor problem, no sign whatsoever of spontaneous improvement (very aware that most minor things in humans get better without any intervention) & a very sudden positive response overnight.
As we contemplated the incredibly dilute solution of a "toxin", I said "It makes you wonder where the active molecule is". Reply - "It isn't there. I swigged it down last night" :lol:

In himself Benjie is a very happy bunny, & did some "friskies" today - my term for his version of a binkie, a sort of back end wiggle. I'll give him an extra week before weighing him so he can catch up on his recent 3 days of low food intake.

So thank you Griffski, we're doing really well. Much better than I expected.

I'm pleased to hear that Benjie's doing reasonably well and that his chin is now healed. Importantly he is happy and that of course is wonderful He is unaware of anything else.

I must admit having to google Koch's postulates, as I'd never heard of them, or him It will be interesting to hear the results of your experiment on yourself.

Ah bless little Benjie, pleased he's doing a bit better and no sore chinny. Lots of vibes and hugs for you both. xx

PS Doughnut does "friskies", her tail wags. When she stayed at the lady who looks after bunnies she said she's never seen a bunny who wags it's tail. She wags it in excitement when she's getting food or up to mischief

thumps_ said:

Thank you so much Griffsk
I found some balm for his chin, & it's healed well - just waiting for the stubbly beard to grow.
He's had a few down days, verging on stasis, empties his caecum then eats for a warren.

I was given some homeopathic tabs for my own long standing "snuffles". (I've had a disgusting hacking cough for over a year from thick nasal secretions) I know - all the studies show it's just placebo effect - but when nothing else works & it can't do harm - give it a whirl. The secretions became thinner overnight, easier to handle, & my nose unblocked. So I gave some to Benjie, powdered up in a basil leaf. He'd virtually stopped snoring by the next night! TBH the house seems very quiet without rabbit snores. I wish we could give ABx like that in powder form!!

Currently Benjie is having the my homeopathy, & I'm doing an experiment on myself along the lines of Koch's postulates but this time for efficacy of meds!.

For light heartedness, some years ago I had a conversation with a GP friend who was more than surprised by the positive effect of some homeopathic medicine she had taken as a last resort. Like me, long standing minor problem, no sign whatsoever of spontaneous improvement (very aware that most minor things in humans get better without any intervention) & a very sudden positive response overnight.
As we contemplated the incredibly dilute solution of a "toxin", I said "It makes you wonder where the active molecule is". Reply - "It isn't there. I swigged it down last night" :lol:

In himself Benjie is a very happy bunny, & did some "friskies" today - my term for his version of a binkie, a sort of back end wiggle. I'll give him an extra week before weighing him so he can catch up on his recent 3 days of low food intake.

So thank you Griffski, we're doing really well. Much better than I expected.

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:lol::lol: That's priceless!

I am so glad to hear that Benjie is doing well at the moment!

I had to google Koch as well! I have to say I'm not sure I'll be able to understand his postulates though ...

Thank you so much for your replies.

I'm really sorry to use jargon - & there isn't really a true link with Koch's postulates, it'sjust a similar idea.
To explain.
a) I've got thick secretions & a cough but no infection.
b) Take a few days worth of tabs which "shouldn't work"
c) Have immediate improvement in symptoms.
d) Stop the tablets, (because Benjie needs them more than I do) & symptoms return
Last phase
e) Have yet to restart tablets & see if I get a similar improvement or even cure.

The idea of experimenting on me (human) for the benefit of rabbits really appeals to me.

ETA If you folks could see how hard he's trying to pick the right foods to stop losing weight & keep GI motility at optimum, it would bring you to tears. I think it's abdo pain which slows down his GI motility. Again he sometimes has a few hours when it seems to be improved.

He's had another problem of an intermittantly blocked L tear duct. This is infection from his snuffles. He'd lost a small area of fur where the infected tears flow. I was worried about a tear duct flush because if it triggered bleeding in an infected duct, the eventual clot could block it irreveribly. On the other hand we didn't want the skin to get infected & sore. I put a bit of calendual balm on there, about 3 days ago, & the fur is regrowing nicely.

Of course if the homeopathy thinned down my nasal/ sinus secretions my hope was that it would thin down his too. My whole approach to his snuffles has been to get the infected secretions thin enough, so they don't hang around for long enough to invade the membrane of his nose & cause scarring, so that they can't drain. This should also help to prevent his tear duct from blocking. Although he's been dry today, it's early days to say it's done the trick for him. Fur growth is fast at the mo, because he started spring moult on his head
It's all early days TBH. I'm just trying any small thing which can't do any harm & which helps the smallest discomfort without stressing him.

Lovely to see that Benjie is doing well at the moment

roxyroller88 said:

Lovely to see that Benjie is doing well at the moment

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Thank you Roxy. For some reason I didn't get notified of Sylar's progress & found it had leaped foreward by 3 pages. I'm thrilled that he's got through his dental & is eating again, with signs that he's feeling better in himself.

Oh Benjie!

Poor felllow

All I can suggest is a "bed" for the whole of him that's gentle for the chin and moulds to him - H has a (human sized) bean bag and gets himself into all sorts of comfy positions. He also loves to pull the cushions of the sofa to prop part of him up too! Not sure whether they are any help?

SJH said:

Oh Benjie!

Poor felllow

All I can suggest is a "bed" for the whole of him that's gentle for the chin and moulds to him - H has a (human sized) bean bag and gets himself into all sorts of comfy positions. He also loves to pull the cushions of the sofa to prop part of him up too! Not sure whether they are any help?

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It's an excellent suggestion SJH - OH how I wish. It would solve his hocks too.
Benjie is a very nervous rabbit, with a compromised sense of smell & won't stay on a soft surface. I suspect it's because he wants a fast getaway in the event of a strange noise. I always know when his snuffles is worse, because he can't smell me coming & skiddadles under the bed as I approach the bedroom.
He was even worse with his recent GI slow down, he lived under the bed & I had to feed him there! Today he's eating like crazy & lying in his usual place - threshold of the bedroom door.
I've tried soft blankets with my old lambs wool jumper. No goes, they got kicked out.
I think that in general Conti's are less nervous that way.

So good to hear this news .. the 'friskies' and the lying in his usual place sounds great