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Endoscopy for Dexter next :( - U/D Pasteurella

T

toffee

Mama Doe
Dexter is about 4-5 mths old. He was sneezing when I got him but the vet thought it was something in the environment that had irritated him (he was bedded on woodshavings before I got him) and that settled down within a few days. He was neutered about 2 weeks ago which went well but then last week he started sneezing again and had thick white snot coming from his left nostril. The vet gave me Baytril to inject but he's still sneezing thick white snot from the left nostril. The vet has booked him in for an endoscopy on Friday to see what's up there and he's going to culture the snot as well.

I'm worried it might be something serious. :( Any ideas?
 
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How long has he been on Baytril for ?

Sometimes Baytril is ineffective against the specific bacteria causing the symptoms and a different abx may be needed. The Vet obviously hopes to establish the precise bacteria involved by taking swabs for C+S testing. This would enable the Vet to prescribe the most appropriate abx to treat the infection. Whilst 'Snuffles' can be very stubborn to get under control it is in no way a 'no hope' situation, so try not to worry too much.
 
Jack's-Jane said:
How long has he been on Baytril for ?

Sometimes Baytril is ineffective against the specific bacteria causing the symptoms and a different abx may be needed. The Vet obviously hopes to establish the precise bacteria involved by taking swabs for C+S testing. This would enable the Vet to prescribe the most appropriate abx to treat the infection. Whilst 'Snuffles' can be very stubborn to get under control it is in no way a 'no hope' situation, so try not to worry too much.
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Thanks Jane. He only had a 4 day course of Baytril (subcutaneously) but with no sign of improvement - like you say it may not be an effective abx for what he has. If we can identify the bacteria that's half the battle I think if it's an infection. I'm worried in case the endoscopy shows polyps or some other type of growth because I haven't had to deal with that before. I've had 3 rabbits with snuffles and recurring pneumonia before so I know what I'm dealing with there - the worry is what happens if and when the infection reoccurs. Possibly a foreign body as only one nostril has the snot? I guess I'll know more on Friday. Dexter doesn't seem bothered by whatever it is - still eating like a pig and getting up to the usual baby-bunny mischief.
 
Good luck. My bunny has got a wet nose but she is making an awful grunting/squeaking sound, her throat is inflamed. She's on baytril but only day two. The specialist said there is a lot of respiratory issues with bunnies at the moment. She isn't bothered by it either and is eating well but it worries me!
 
toffee said:
Thanks Jane. He only had a 4 day course of Baytril (subcutaneously) but with no sign of improvement - like you say it may not be an effective abx for what he has. If we can identify the bacteria that's half the battle I think if it's an infection. I'm worried in case the endoscopy shows polyps or some other type of growth because I haven't had to deal with that before. I've had 3 rabbits with snuffles and recurring pneumonia before so I know what I'm dealing with there - the worry is what happens if and when the infection reoccurs. Possibly a foreign body as only one nostril has the snot? I guess I'll know more on Friday. Dexter doesn't seem bothered by whatever it is - still eating like a pig and getting up to the usual baby-bunny mischief.
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4 days of Baytril is not even a 'course' so that may be part of the problem. Maybe you could ask the Vet if trying a course (at least 10 days long) of Septrin may be an option rather than doing the Endoscopy which would require a GA ? Just a suggestion of another option to try, it is obviously for you and the Vet to decide on the most appropriate course of action.
 
toffee said:
Thanks Jane. He only had a 4 day course of Baytril (subcutaneously) but with no sign of improvement - like you say it may not be an effective abx for what he has. If we can identify the bacteria that's half the battle I think if it's an infection. I'm worried in case the endoscopy shows polyps or some other type of growth because I haven't had to deal with that before. I've had 3 rabbits with snuffles and recurring pneumonia before so I know what I'm dealing with there - the worry is what happens if and when the infection reoccurs. Possibly a foreign body as only one nostril has the snot? I guess I'll know more on Friday. Dexter doesn't seem bothered by whatever it is - still eating like a pig and getting up to the usual baby-bunny mischief.
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I expect your vet put Dexter on Baytril as a 'holding' operation, before the culture and sensitivity test? 4 days isn't long enough to judge it's efficacy, as I'm sure you know.

I would wait until the C&S has been done, then you can (hopefully if there's a result) target the bacteria with a wallop and it will be far more effective.

Several specialist rabbit vets I know don't use Baytril at all for rabbits. There are loads of alternatives :thumb:

Good luck for Dexter for Friday x
(PS it's a really good sign he is still his normal self!)
 
The vet mentioned Septrin so I think he might try that depending on the results of the culture. I think the reason it was such a short burst of antibiotics is that we're not sure whether it is an infection so it was just to se if Dex would improve on it I think plus the vet wanted to see if the mucous was coming from both nostrils or just one because he said that if it's just one it probably isn't an infection. The vet also suggested that it could be an allergy because I mentioned that he seems to sneeze more on the days that I do - if it turns out t be an allergy he suggested steroids through a nebuliser. I think the endoscopy is a good idea because I think the mucous is only coming from one nostril so there might be something going on up there.
 
toffee said:
The vet mentioned Septrin so I think he might try that depending on the results of the culture. I think the reason it was such a short burst of antibiotics is that we're not sure whether it is an infection so it was just to se if Dex would improve on it I think plus the vet wanted to see if the mucous was coming from both nostrils or just one because he said that if it's just one it probably isn't an infection. The vet also suggested that it could be an allergy because I mentioned that he seems to sneeze more on the days that I do - if it turns out t be an allergy he suggested steroids through a nebuliser. I think the endoscopy is a good idea because I think the mucous is only coming from one nostril so there might be something going on up there.
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Your vet seems to know what he's doing - I hope all goes well for Friday!
 
MightyMax said:
Your vet seems to know what he's doing - I hope all goes well for Friday!
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Thanks,

I'm taking them both in this evening to stay the night at the vet because I can't get there in the morning. It'll be a bit of luxury for them - the vet hospital has air-con which will be better for them than the fan they've got here. This heat is nice for me but it's been a real effort to keep the buns cool.

I'll be relieved when I know what's causing Dexter's problem, his sneezing fits are starting to upset me because I can't help him.
 
Good luck. I hope Dexter enjoys his little holiday and you find out what's causing him to sneeze
 
Dexter's had his endoscopy now. The vet said there wasn't much snot today but there was greenish mucous at the top of both nostrils. We're going to start him on depocillin injections while we wait for the results of the culture which should come back on Tuesday.
 
toffee said:
Dexter's had his endoscopy now. The vet said there wasn't much snot today but there was greenish mucous at the top of both nostrils. We're going to start him on depocillin injections while we wait for the results of the culture which should come back on Tuesday.
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I hope you get a result from the C&S and in the meantime he remains OK ... Poor lad x
 
We've had the results and it's Pasteurella. Good news is that the culture showed it should be sensitive to pretty much every antibiotic going plus his snot is now runny not thick and sticky so he seems to be improving. We're going to keep going with the depocillin injections for 2 weeks then try another antibiotic if that doesn't do it (I can't remember which one the vet said but it began with "Z"). Appetite is still good and he still seems well in himself. I've had Pasteurella buns before but I'm hoping Dexter won't be too bad because he's pretty laid back. I think it was stress of moving home + neuter that brought this episode on (he was sneezing when I got him and it got worse after his neuter). Good news for Preya is she's lived with 2 Pasteurella rabbits before and never presented symptoms so hopefully she's an asymptomatic carrier and won't be affected by living with Dex. In any case she's the happiest I've ever seen her since she bonded with him. She's still anxious around people but happy and relaxed when they're alone together.

Also the vet removed a lump from under Dexter's tongue when he was having the endoscopy - we'll get the lab results for that tomorrow but the vet thinks it's a virus (again I can't remember which one he said) and he's pretty sure Dexter's immune system will take care of it. Also he had some molar spurs which have been filed. I'm really glad we opted for the endoscopy because otherwise the vet wouldn't have found the other things and hopefully we've prevented some problems.
 
toffee said:
We've had the results and it's Pasteurella. Good news is that the culture showed it should be sensitive to pretty much every antibiotic going plus his snot is now runny not thick and sticky so he seems to be improving. We're going to keep going with the depocillin injections for 2 weeks then try another antibiotic if that doesn't do it (I can't remember which one the vet said but it began with "Z"). Appetite is still good and he still seems well in himself. I've had Pasteurella buns before but I'm hoping Dexter won't be too bad because he's pretty laid back. I think it was stress of moving home + neuter that brought this episode on (he was sneezing when I got him and it got worse after his neuter). Good news for Preya is she's lived with 2 Pasteurella rabbits before and never presented symptoms so hopefully she's an asymptomatic carrier and won't be affected by living with Dex. In any case she's the happiest I've ever seen her since she bonded with him. She's still anxious around people but happy and relaxed when they're alone together.

Also the vet removed a lump from under Dexter's tongue when he was having the endoscopy - we'll get the lab results for that tomorrow but the vet thinks it's a virus (again I can't remember which one he said) and he's pretty sure Dexter's immune system will take care of it. Also he had some molar spurs which have been filed. I'm really glad we opted for the endoscopy because otherwise the vet wouldn't have found the other things and hopefully we've prevented some problems.
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Goodness it really was a good move to have the endoscopy :thumb:

The antibiotic you mention is probably Zithromax?

Also regarding his immune system - you could try giving him some echinacea. I find it effective alongside antibiotics, to help them overcome infection etc ..
 
MightyMax said:
Goodness it really was a good move to have the endoscopy :thumb:

The antibiotic you mention is probably Zithromax?

Also regarding his immune system - you could try giving him some echinacea. I find it effective alongside antibiotics, to help them overcome infection etc ..
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Yes it was Zithromax. Echinacea sounds good - how much should I give him and where can I get it?

I think the depocillin is working - he's been ok throughout apart from the snot but today he really fought with me when I gave him the injection and then ran and jumped around his run like a mad thing so I think he's feeling better. Waiting for the vet to phone to get the lab results for the lump.
 
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toffee said:
Yes it was Zithromax. Echinacea sounds good - how much should I give him and where can I get it?

I think the depocillin is working - he's been ok throughout apart from the snot but today he really fought with me when I gave him the injection and then ran and jumped around his run like a mad thing so I think he's feeling better. Waiting for the vet to phone to get the lab results for the lump.
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You can get it here:

http://www.baldwins.co.uk/baldwins-echinacea-angustifolia-herbal-fluid-extract/

I myself buy the capsules or grind down the dried plant and feed it, but that's harder to obtain ...

Hope the lump results are OK :thumb:
 
Lump results are back and it's Papilloma virus. The vet said it should clear up on its own but there's a small chance it could become cancerous. The vet did say he'd only seen that happen twice in thirty years of practice so it's probably ok. He said just watch out in case there is dribbling or blood from the mouth. Why are rabbits never straightforward?!!
 
toffee said:
Lump results are back and it's Papilloma virus. The vet said it should clear up on its own but there's a small chance it could become cancerous. The vet did say he'd only seen that happen twice in thirty years of practice so it's probably ok. He said just watch out in case there is dribbling or blood from the mouth. Why are rabbits never straightforward?!!
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Oh God! Tell me about it :shock:
 
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