Rabbit with snuffles

My 9 year old rabbit Henry has been struggling with snuffles on and off for about 3 years now. The last year he has become a lot worse, he's been on practically non stop baytril or septrin.

Two weeks ago I found him gasping for breath the vet gave him injections of enrocare? And put him back on the baytril. He is loosing weight and seems quite down in himself. He has constant white eye and nasal discharge.

He also has suspected windpipe and lung scaring from several emergancy ops 3 years ago after a neuter that went wrong.

The vet has told me that he's probably not going to get much better and basically it's palliative care until he cannot battle on. He is also outside which I'm sure is not doing him any good in our -3 winter.

Should I bring him inside? Can anyone give advice on any alternative medications or advise anything that might help him?

Thank you.

Poor Henry

I would definitely bring him indoors as he will struggle in the sub zero temperatures.

Has the Vet considered using any other antibiotics. Enrocare is the same as Baytril (enrofloxacin). My Vet has prescribed an injectable penicillin for Respiratory Tract problems. Is he on a non steroidal anti-inflammatory such as Metacam ? This could help with inflammation within his respiratory tract.

Is he having antibiotic eye drops-eg Tiacil or Fucithalmic ?

If there is a lot of thick mucus then a mucolytic such as Bisolvon can be given to thin out the mucus.

Sometimes nebulising can be useful, eith just with sterile saline or with F10 Solution. Antibiotics can be given via a nebuliser too.

Henry_Dixie said:

My 9 year old rabbit Henry has been struggling with snuffles on and off for about 3 years now. The last year he has become a lot worse, he's been on practically non stop baytril or septrin.

Two weeks ago I found him gasping for breath the vet gave him injections of enrocare? And put him back on the baytril. He is loosing weight and seems quite down in himself. He has constant white eye and nasal discharge.

He also has suspected windpipe and lung scaring from several emergancy ops 3 years ago after a neuter that went wrong.

The vet has told me that he's probably not going to get much better and basically it's palliative care until he cannot battle on. He is also outside which I'm sure is not doing him any good in our -3 winter.

Should I bring him inside? Can anyone give advice on any alternative medications or advise anything that might help him?

Thank you.

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If Henry is on his own, then I would definitely seriously consider bringing him indoors, permanently.

There are other antibiotics your vet could prescribe, and maybe you could have a conversation about which one may be best for him now.

I have nebulised bunnies in the same situation as Henry, but to be honest buying a nebuliser and setting it up is quite a fiddle. However, sometimes vets prescribe Biosolven or some other decongestant.

Have you thought of boosting Henry's own immune system? I have recently had a chronically congested bunny who hasn't responded too well to antibiotics, but with echinacea he's fighting it so well there's now no white mucous around his nose

Henry has reached a good age for a rabbit! Welcome to the Forum :wave:

He does have a companion, I'm sure he's had other antibiotics over the years for snuffles but I cannot think of
there names... He was given two injections today one being the enrocare and the other being an anti-inflammortary. I have been bathing his eye with cool boiled water but nothing has been prescribed for it as there is no infection in the eye.

I haven't tried biosolvon but I do have some in the cupboard that I use for my rats. It did cross my mind to use a nebuliser but I think it would be to much stress for him.

He's not eating a great deal so I think he's using far more energy fighting this illness and also trying to keep himself warm in this awful weather, I am seriously considering bringing him in but what will the temp change do to him?

He was a house bunny for the first 5 years off his life so has been used to living indoors.

Where would I find echinachea for him? What form is it best to give? We have the teabags but I don't think that would be suitable?

Henry_Dixie said:

Where would I find echinachea for him? What form is it best to give? We have the teabags but I don't think that would be suitable?

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Whilst it is usually OK to give Echinacea I always check with my Vet before administering any complimentary treatments to my Rabbits. So I would check with your Vet first and if the Vet OKs it then you can obtain an alcohol free tincture here :

http://www.baldwins.co.uk/herbs/ext...ea-goldenseal-alcohol-free-fluid-extract-30ml

I expect Health Food Shops may stock an equivalent too, but I buy mine online xx

Henry_Dixie said:

Where would I find echinachea for him? What form is it best to give? We have the teabags but I don't think that would be suitable?

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I use a tincture of echinacea which is preserved in alcohol, as it's much more stable. The amount of alcohol is small, but you can easily burn it off by putting a few drops into a dessert spoon and heating up over a flame for a few moments.

All the vets I have consulted have recommended echinacea, and it's best used once or twice a day for periods of about three weeks. Then take a break for a couple of weeks if you wish to begin again.

Alternatively, if you can find echinacea capsules, you can pull them apart and sprinkle a small amount (usually a quarter of a capsule) onto the food.

Henry_Dixie said:

He does have a companion, I'm sure he's had other antibiotics over the years for snuffles but I cannot think of
there names... He was given two injections today one being the enrocare and the other being an anti-inflammortary. I have been bathing his eye with cool boiled water but nothing has been prescribed for it as there is no infection in the eye.

I haven't tried biosolvon but I do have some in the cupboard that I use for my rats. It did cross my mind to use a nebuliser but I think it would be to much stress for him.

He's not eating a great deal so I think he's using far more energy fighting this illness and also trying to keep himself warm in this awful weather, I am seriously considering bringing him in but what will the temp change do to him?

He was a house bunny for the first 5 years off his life so has been used to living indoors.

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If his eye is just tearing, he may have a clogged tearduct. Sometimes the vet can flush the tearduct and the runny eye will stop, but it may not work in all cases.

I've been researching respiratory issues quite a lot recently and I have read that bringing a snuffly bunny indoors can make them worse, however if you can bring him into a room with the same temperature as outside and very gradually increase it, then it may help, it will also give you options to control the air quality, such as using an over water air purifier. You can add essential oils to this help his breathing if he tolerates it.

In addition to echinacea (5 days on 5 days off) feed coltsfoot, its an excellent plant to support the respiratory system, about a tablespoon a day of the dried kind. Dandelion root is also known for its respiratory properties. Both can be bought online. Fresh herbs to try are sage, oegano, thyme and mint.

With regard to medicines, agree with bisolvin, Ive never used as by bun is not congested it but read its very good for loosening the mucous. Many other antibiotics to try although Baytril & Septrin are well tolerated, if they are not working then its definitely worth trying new ones, Ronaxan (Doxycycline) is usually well tolerated and is sited specifically for respiratory disorders. Zithromax in another good one, but my bun had a bad reaction to it. If he's really struggling then you are looking at injectibles such as Oxytet or Depocillin, Perhaps have another discussion with your vet about switching meds, there are many more than the few I have listed.

Cant echo enough the importance of twice daily metacam as an anti inflammatory and pain reliever, this really supports the antibiotic action.

Search this forum there are many great threads with wonderful information.

Good luck with him

Coneflower (echinacea)
https://www.thehayexperts.co.uk/coneflower.html

Coltsfoot:
https://www.thehayexperts.co.uk/catalogsearch/result/?q=coltsfoot

Dandelion Root:
https://www.thehayexperts.co.uk/dandelion-root.html

Henry's cultures came back form his eye and nose, neither grew anything! What the hell do I do now? He still has the White discharge. He's also dropped from 1.84kg -1.65kg in under a month. He's due for a review an weigh in on Thursday. Not sure where I should go from here?

Henry_Dixie said:

Henry's cultures came back form his eye and nose, neither grew anything! What the hell do I do now? He still has the White discharge. He's also dropped from 1.84kg -1.65kg in under a month. He's due for a review an weigh in on Thursday. Not sure where I should go from here?

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Unfortunately it is not unusual for cultures to come back as 'no bacterial growth', especially if the swabs were only superficial and not from deep within the nasal passages where the core of infection may be located.

Have you brought your Rabbit indoors now ? I honestly think this is essential. It may be that the respiratory problems are a secondary symptom of another issue that is impacting on his immune system. Given his age it may be related to his kidney function. Chronic renal failure can present as unexplained weightloss/flare ups of 'snuffles' amongst many other things. A blood test is the only way to accurately establish if there is a problem with his kidney function. Perhaps you could discuss this with the Vet on Thursday ?

As far as treatment for his Snuffles goes then I would also ask the Vet about giving longterm antibiotics as part of his palliative care. Whilst the abx may not 'cure' him they may contain the infection and buy him a bit more time.

I hope the Vet is able to offer some more help xx

He's not happy, he just sits hunched over now. I'll discuss getting his teeth x-rayed and blood tests but for his sake I think it's maybe time to call it a day.

Henry_Dixie said:

He's not happy, he just sits hunched over now. I'll discuss getting his teeth x-rayed and blood tests but for his sake I think it's maybe time to call it a day.

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Is he living indoors now ? It does not sound as though he would be strong enough for a GA which would be needed for the Xrays, but it should be possible to obtain a blood sample without having to sedate him. I hope that the Vet can assist you on making a decision as to what is best for your Rabbit. You and the Vet are really the only ones in a position to make that judgement xx

I wouldn't want him under another GA he's had 3 traumatic experiences under GA which has left him with
Lung scarring. If we can gave him a whiff that might be ok to get x-rays and bloods. Someone mentioned it could be his tooth roots pressing on his tear ducts/ nasal passage which would also account for his loss of weight...

Whatever is wrong he's clearly stopped being happy.

Henry_Dixie said:

I wouldn't want him under another GA he's had 3 traumatic experiences under GA which has left him with
Lung scarring. If we can gave him a whiff that might be ok to get x-rays and bloods. Someone mentioned it could be his tooth roots pressing on his tear ducts/ nasal passage which would also account for his loss of weight...

Whatever is wrong he's clearly stopped being happy.

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I'm so sorry he's not happy at the moment

I do hope you find a way forward for yourself and the little man soon xx

Had a long discussion with the vet re his teeth, they look fine for the inside but he did agree the roots could be the problem.

Given his age and his poor health neither of us think he would tolerated the GA. we have agreed to put him on metacam and monitor him.

Can rabbits stay on metacam indefinitely?

Henry_Dixie said:

Had a long discussion with the vet re his teeth, they look fine for the inside but he did agree the roots could be the problem.

Given his age and his poor health neither of us think he would tolerated the GA. we have agreed to put him on metacam and monitor him.

Can rabbits stay on metacam indefinitely?

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That depends on the dosage level.

Henry_Dixie said:

Had a long discussion with the vet re his teeth, they look fine for the inside but he did agree the roots could be the problem.

Given his age and his poor health neither of us think he would tolerated the GA. we have agreed to put him on metacam and monitor him.

Can rabbits stay on metacam indefinitely?

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Each case needs to be judged individually. It is a case of weighing up risks v benefits. In an elderly debilitated Rabbit who is in need of pain control then sometimes the benefits by far outweigh any risks. Also, for an elderly and debilitated Rabbit 'long term' is unlikely to be as long as it may be when dealing with a much younger Rabbit who has a chronic pain issue.

I have had numerous elderly Rabbits over the years and many of them have been on daily Metacam for various chronic issues that require pain management. None of the Rabbits had any adverse effects from daily Metacam and the treatment enabled them to remain comfortable for how ever long they had left.

A blood profile to assess kidney and liver function could be run. This could help the Vet decide what may be the best course of action re dose rates and whether using another type of analgesia might be appropriate.

How is he within himself now ?

since his first dose yesterday he seems quite sleepy but his appetite has picked up quite a bit which was one of my main concerns, so I am quite happy with the results.

What other pain killers can be used for rabbits?

Henry_Dixie said:

since his first dose yesterday he seems quite sleepy but his appetite has picked up quite a bit which was one of my main concerns, so I am quite happy with the results.

What other pain killers can be used for rabbits?

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There are different groups of pain killers which have different modes of action, but Metacam is certainly one of the best as far as acting as an anti-inflammatory goes. There are various opiates , but these have limited anti-inflammatory properties and they are far more likely to cause extreme sedation. Some also appear to effect gut motility.There use in a Rabbit with Respiratory problems is also more risky as opiates can suppress respiration and heart rate. Tramadol can be useful for bone pain, in humans with renal impairment it can be used relatively safely at a low dose.