Cardiac arrhythmia

(Edit, if you're starting from the beginning, note the date of this post - it's been bumped in 2015!!)

Poor Bertram has suddenly developed a very severe arrhythmia. He was fine yesterday but this morning he didn't want his breakfast. I'd actually already got appointments at the vets this morning for other things (long story which I won't go into right now!!) but he obviously took priority. His heart was all over the place, it was missing beats and adding extra ones and all sorts, and now he's back home with armfuls of meds, he is eating again with limited enthusiasm, but his heart is still sounding very wrong. His colour was a little subdued but was refilling at normal pace when pressed so circulation at least vaguely ok, no obvious fluid accumulation or breathing difficulties, temperature slightly on the low side. He's obviously going to be going back for more detailed diagnostics which they couldn't do over the weekend, but I was just wondering what could be causing it, I've not known a heart problem quite like this before or manifesting so suddenly. Anyone got any ideas or experiences? Bertram is a 3kg lop and he is somewhere in the region of 5 yrs old. It's possible that he has been exposed to the myxomatosis virus, he is vaccinated and is not displaying any symptoms, but could this cause a sudden arrhythmia?

Thank goodness for (a)vets open 7 days a week and (b)pet insurance!!

Sorry, I don't have any advice, but wanted to send loads of vibes x

Thank you! Oddly, his heart was nearly (but not quite) back to normal this morning. Back to the vet this pm for another check and to decide what to do next!!

Sorry I missed this yesterday

Could he have ingested a toxin ? Foxglove maybe ??

Funnily enough you're the second person to sugget foxglove, Jane! I don't see how, because they don't free range and their pen is double meshed, so it wouldn't be easy for anything to blow in unless it was already in the hay or something. But the fact that it was so horrendous yesterday and much better today does suggest some kind of acute toxicity doesn't it. I am in my way home from work now to take him for a check up, so I will give the pen a thorough look through.

By the time I took him back to the vet today, it had completely resolved itself. Sam said that if she hadn't seen him yesterday, she would have thought I'd taken a different rabbit today. So we are obviously going to keep a very close eye but the best guess is that it was some kind of acute toxicity, but we have no idea to what :? They don't free range and he was fine at bedtime so it has come on overnight, and I've looked carefully round their pen and in their hay and can't find anything untoward. I'd rather know, so at least I know what it is that I need to be preventing!!

Glad to hear he is all better now.

Could someone have fed him something through the mesh?

You haven't got any oleander bushes about have you ? Although if he doesn't free range it seems unlikely that a bush external to his enclosure would be a problem :?

I had to google oleander, but no, I don't think so!! Googling did lead me to a web page which lists a load of plants which share the foxglove toxin and none of them look familiar - i guess the 'joy' of having moved house in october is that everything here was already here so i have no idea what most of it is, and we haven't been through a full garden cycle yet.

Their enclosure is on a concrete plinth in the middle of the lawn, so it's not even as if anything can grow through the sides, it has a roof so nothing could be dropped in from above and there's no chance of anyone coming in and feeding them anything. I do feed them forage rather than veg but it's all from within the garden so i know it hasn't been sprayed with anything, and it's all pretty much from eye height or above. The only thing I can think is that a bird had dropped something into their lawn run which is accessed via a runaround which they sometimes use when I'm around to watch - but they wouldn't have been in that after about 7pm at the latest and he ate his dinner that evening as normal, and seemed fine when I went to check on them at bedtime.

Beatrice his partner also came down with nodular myxi (just one nodule) on Saturday so we were also wondering if it could have been related to that, but it resolved so quickly and spontaneously that we don't think so.

It's all a mystery at the moment...but at least all is well for now...

I've been thinking about this, and wondered if there was any chance of a bee sting causing a reaction?

I'm glad that things seem to have resolved. Also that the arrhythmias didn't lead to breathlessness or other complications.

An irregular heart beat can also be brought on by extreme stress.

Best wishes for you and Bertram :wave:

Yes we discussed the possibility of something like a bite or sting, but would have expected to see at least some kind of localised reaction at the site of any puncture. It's possible though, I guess! We also thought about stress, but the arrhythmia was so severe that it seems unlikely, especially as nothing had changed and he wasn't behaving like a stressed bunny, just like a poorly one. He leapt up for breakfast this morning so all seemed normal today...

Santa said:

Yes we discussed the possibility of something like a bite or sting, but would have expected to see at least some kind of localised reaction at the site of any puncture. It's possible though, I guess! We also thought about stress, but the arrhythmia was so severe that it seems unlikely, especially as nothing had changed and he wasn't behaving like a stressed bunny, just like a poorly one. He leapt up for breakfast this morning so all seemed normal today...

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With all the stress of trying to find out what caused it you'll end up with a cardiac arrhythmia !!

I am glad he seems to be OK now

To me it really does seem like toxin ingestion is the most likely. IME Rabbits with heart disease seldom 'act ill'. The fact that he did was probably due to GI tract irritation from a toxin and then once the toxin entered the bloodstream the heart issues developed.

Yes I agree it sounds most like some kind of acute toxicity...and foxglove does seem to fit the bill - cardiac symptoms and low body temperature...and three people mentioned it to me independently - you, Helen and my vet, so it's obviously something that really looks like it fits. I'll have to look back through my garden photos through the season but I do recall someone mentioning that I had a foxglove somewhere although I'm sure the flowers have passed now, so I'll hunt them out and dig them up and get rid of them, just to be on the safe side. If there's a risk it could be carried into an enclosure by wind or wild animal, I'd rather just get rid of them. If it's not that, it's not going to hurt to get rid of them anyway, and it looks as if they are toxic to cats too, so best they go!

Boing! Just dug this thread up from last year, as strolling round my garden today I noticed that some very suspicious foxglovey looking plants have started to bloom. Once I'd seen them, I found them everywhere, and I ended up digging up about 40 foxgloves :shock: So although I still don't know how he managed to ingest it, I'm pretty sure this must have been the cause of Bertram's episode last year, but the flowers must have passed by then so I didn't recognise the plants in their declining state. Just goes to show how important it is to be vigilant for highly toxic plants!

I was just reading this thinking 'this all sounds incredibly familiar' and my poor brain trying to catch up. Then I suddenly spotted the date. :lol:

Scary stuff.

Santa said:

Boing! Just dug this thread up from last year, as strolling round my garden today I noticed that some very suspicious foxglovey looking plants have started to bloom. Once I'd seen them, I found them everywhere, and I ended up digging up about 40 foxgloves :shock: So although I still don't know how he managed to ingest it, I'm pretty sure this must have been the cause of Bertram's episode last year, but the flowers must have passed by then so I didn't recognise the plants in their declining state. Just goes to show how important it is to be vigilant for highly toxic plants!

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Eek, thank goodness you are so vigilant and that you have gotten rid of it all !!

Yeah I found just one or two of them!! In fact now I've got my eye in, I stared out the window this morning while having my first cup of tea and spotted another one :shock:

I know they're fairly tucked away, but I have no idea how I managed to miss these last year!

Santa said:

Boing! Just dug this thread up from last year, as strolling round my garden today I noticed that some very suspicious foxglovey looking plants have started to bloom. Once I'd seen them, I found them everywhere, and I ended up digging up about 40 foxgloves :shock: So although I still don't know how he managed to ingest it, I'm pretty sure this must have been the cause of Bertram's episode last year, but the flowers must have passed by then so I didn't recognise the plants in their declining state. Just goes to show how important it is to be vigilant for highly toxic plants!

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Goodness, amazing you spotted it. You must be eagle-eyed, as it looks like you have a rather large garden. Not a lot could escape my vision in my London 'handkerchief' :lol:

Santa said:

Yeah I found just one or two of them!! In fact now I've got my eye in, I stared out the window this morning while having my first cup of tea and spotted another one :shock:

I know they're fairly tucked away, but I have no idea how I managed to miss these last year!

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Are you sure you are not looking at a Royal Park !! Your garden is humungous !!

Would love to see some more photos of it, just to make me even more jealous :lol: