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Next Topic For Discussion- EC

Jack's-Jane

Wise Old Thumper
Well it is Wednesday, so .................... :lol:

I know that the word 'EC' can strike fear into us Rabbit carers. Whilst EC can be fatal, it is not inevitably so. I thought that we could share our own experiences of dealing with a Rabbit diagnosed with EC. What were the initial symptoms ? What diagnostics did your Vet run and what treatment did he/she prescribe ?

Do you have a protocol for minimising the risk of an 'active' case of EC such as prophylactic use of Panacur/Lapizole ?

Also, please post any useful links to information about EC. I think this is an excellent article

https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&...N3ISKU&sig=AHIEtbR1V0Bkgl46nxoM3IZVX7iM5Uaz_Q
 
When Gypsy was 7 she developed head tilt, literally over night. I could not get a vet appointment the same day so I ran to the pet shop and bought lots of panacur as a precaution. Her symptoms worsened. She was rolling around un able to keep her balance. She needed help to eat and drink. She used storm as a prop to stay up right.
Before going to the vets I came here. I went armed with information and the vet reluctantly aggreed to treat with metacam baytril and the panacur. They were not hopefull. The stress of the vets made her symptoms worse. She looked terrible :cry:

It was a very worrying time. No one held a lot of hope for her. It was very distressing to see her so out of control and vulnerable.

Gypsy had head tilt, was rolling around unable to stay on her feet. Needed feeding and water syrined into her mouth. She was incontinent and needed help to keep clean. She lost weight but she never lost her spirit. Within a week of intenive nursing she could eat for her self. Her head tilt slowly went away. Within a month she was almost back to normal. Unfortunately the ec left her hind legs weaker than before. She never periscoped again. She regained control of her bladder, most of the time. She did develop arthritis shortly after recovering from ec. Maybe the ec weakened her? Gypsy went on to live another 3 happy years Before her arthritis left her unable to move :cry:

Gypsy was amazing :love:
 
Martha rabbit was suddenly wobbly earlier this year, no head tilt but just completely unable to hop and falling over if she tried to get out of a litter tray for example. I took her to the vets immediately (it was about 2pm) who took a blood test, and I started her on baytril (in case of ear infection), loxicom and panacur. I had to argue for it because the vet was suggesting it could be arthritis and I had to say no, she definitely is wobbly. By 4.40pm she was in the small cage alone so that she didn't have anything to fall over. By the next morning she was looking much less wobbly, and a day later you wouldn't have known there had been anything wrong. She was in the small cage for another couple of days just in case and then back into the normal set up. She and the others (as they share free-range area) were on panacur for 28 days and Martha was on the baytril and loxicom for two weeks. Deep cleans were conducted on days 21 and 28. When Martha's blood tests came back they showed a long standing EC infection, rather than one which had just been introduced.
 
Has anyone had a Rabbit/Rabbits with any other clinical symptoms of EC other than those related to the central nervous system ?

I have had 2 Rabbits who's only clinical symptoms were weightloss and drinking and weeing a lot. Both were found to have severely impaired renal function almost certainly due to EC. Sadly neither Rabbit survived as eventually their kidneys just gave up all together :cry: Neither of these two Rabbits had any neurological symptoms at all.

Then I have had 3 other Rabbits with Lens rupture/cataracts/uveitis, all attributed to EC. One Rabbit eventually had to have an eye removed, the other two were kept comfortable on treatment (eye drops to reduce inflammation and to control intra-ocular pressure). Both passed away as a result of problems unrelated to EC.

In my experience over the last 18 years head tilt is far more likely to be caused by a middle ear infection than by EC. But I suppose in cases where diagnostics are not possible it would be sensible to cover all bases and treat head tilt with both antibiotics and fenbendazole.
 
My very savvy vet told me that he's had several rabbits with very fast onset dental issues which have tested positive for EC - his theory is that this is due to partial facial paralysis leading to asymmetrical chewing.
 
I had two rabbits with persistent chronic stasis issues. This went on for some months (approximately 10) and escalated, without diagnosis. One of them was diagnosed as having had a reasonably high exposure to EC, so the decision was made to treat them for it. I saw immediate improvement when Panacur was administered (within 24-36 hrs), but I believe that both were left with permanent issues (long term medication was needed).

Neither rabbit had any of the traditional symptoms of EC. When discussing this on RU, it became apparent that at least one other person had similar issues with their rabbits. I remember that she explored it with her vet and treated for EC successfully (more successfully than with my rabbits actually - less permanent issues) and the chronic stasis issues ended.

The biggest issues around EC that remain for me are:

1. The lack of a good test for anything more than exposure
2. The lack of a definitive answer for a course of Panacur/Lapizole
3. The fact that some vets don't seem to rate Panacur/Lapizole as a treatment. What else is there?
 
We are struggling at this very moment with a 'sudden' flare up of EC amongst our buns.

It is very difficult to see why or really when it started.

I guess the onset of very severe head tilt with Fudge a few months ago was a marker point - though at the time no other buns appeared to be affected - (Fudge is now recovered from tilt completely but still thin and I suspect long term kidney damage) -

We had also had longer term issues with a couple of house buns who became un-litter trained during the house move (14 months ago) and the fact that they improved after panacur treatment suggests EC involvement.

Then in the last 6 weeks we have had 3 buns come down with partial blindness in one eye , and another two with hind leg issues - one of which has also started to loose weight and become wobbly - and again I suspect kidney issues. They include individuals from several different groups.

We are in the middle of treating all the buns for 28 days with 'Panacur' and any with actual symptoms are also having metacam and if thought advisable Baytril - but because of the way our runs are set up with a very large shared area on a lawn (and one group of four totally free range house rabbits) it is simply not going to be possible to do the bleaching etc.

We have always known that some of ours (probably all) 'carry' EC - they are a large and motley group from all sorts of rescue situations - but we have never had this sort of flare up before. Usually just one will become stressed from some other unrelated ill health issue and the EC will flare up and then be dampened down again with treatment - but not seemingly affect any other rabbit.

I have never known this sort of flare up which has affected several rabbits - and I have been keeping multiple rabbits for probably about 15 years now.

I should add that what is so frustrating is that they now live in even better conditions than before our move - they are in a peaceful setting, lots more grass so it keeps up with then in the run, loads and loads of forage, more space, fewer predators around at night/day, etc etc

If anyone has any clues I would be grateful -

PS of all these only one (Fudge) had head tilt - - no ear infection at all) - and the others have either eye problems or leg problems not both - although Fudge (Head Tilt) and now Milk Thistle (Leg problem) have sudden weight loss which points at kidney involvement.
 
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not had any experiences but thanks for the thread, its useful to hear about others experiences so we can at least keep an eye out :wave:
 
Am very scared now - couple of weeks ago it was the Stasis thread and Holly came down with Stasis within 2 days of the thread going up :shock::shock::shock: (thankfully we caught it almost as soon as it started occuring and she was treated straight away and made a very quick recovery).

However - I am very grateful for threads like these - and read them avidly - any bit of extra knowledge is always a good think 'just in case'.

Loads of vibes for all those buns currently suffereing from EC.:thumb:
 
A year gone April Cleo suddenly, within a matter of hours got a head tilt. We took her to the vet immediately who diagnosed EC as the most likely cause and was started on lapizole.

Overnight she developed a worse tilt and nystagmus. She was still mobile and getting around ok. She went back to the vet that evening and was started on steroids. The next day she had made a dramatic improvement, and her tilt had almost gone. She went on to receive two more steroids over the next few days and she was doing great, but a few days after the last steroid she took a huge turn for the worse. Her head became upside down and she lost all mobility, we thought we'd lost her.

She was then started on metacam, and a two week course of Zithromax antibiotic.

Over the next few weeks we went to hell and back. She couldn't stand, she rolled violently and her head remained twisted the whole way round and she dropped a huge amount of weight but she was fighting. She ate like a horse and she had plenty of life in her, she was just the wrong way round.

We'd just got to the point where we had to have 'the chat' with the vet when we started to see small improvements, her head got a bit better, she slowly learnt to stand, and then to hop again and her weight began to increase.

Over the next few weeks she went from strength to strength. She's still with us today and going strong. She's still quite wonky, and she is a lot slower than a 'normal' rabbit but she does fine.

All in all, it was almost two months until we saw any real improvement, and about 4 months until we were confident she'd be ok and have a decent quality of life. She remained on metacam until the beginning of October having been on it since early may.

Since then, she's had blood tests which came back fine and she was vaccinated with no ill effects. She's put all her weight back on (and a bit more!)

There's lots of bits I've missed out with what she went through when she was ill - but id be typing forever! It was a long, hard, heartbreaking road but we just never felt she wanted to give in.

If anyone has any questions, please just ask me.
 
I hate EC/head tilt. Its the most evil disease to poor bunnies. Personally I really do think far more research needs to be done into what causes it but also the long term health problems it causes after the bunny has recovered from it. Darcy suffered with head tilt many years ago now. His first sign was a slight tilted head and his eye looking up at the ceiling. I got him to the vet straight away and it was confirmed. I found that sometimes one months worth of Panacur or Lapizole really isn't enough. It took a good 3 months for Darcy to recover. Maybe there should be a stronger strength of Panacur/Lapizole for ACTIVE infections.

The long term effects are what need more education as many vets still don't know about treating rabbits who suffer with seizures. My vet believed the seizures are a result of possible brain scarring from the EC/head tilt. :cry:
 
I hate, loathe, despise EC. It took my soul bunny away from me & broke my heart. He was only 7 months old :cry: I didn't have RU then or a rabbit savvy vet either & it cost him his life :cry:

Right now I don't feel up to rewriting our story here, but it's all in a very long thread on rainbow bridge.

Love you Dexy xxxxx


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FAO Jacks Jane.

William more than likely.

He has said the same to me. I have had 20 rabbits over the years. Two which presented with dental disease, one of whom also had hind leg weakness. William suggested that I do a 6 week course of panacur at the time of needing first dental.
 
I agree that there is probably a lot that is not yet known about EC. Also, the opinions of Vets in the US are often very different to UK Vets as far as EC treatment goes. Having said that, there is often disagreement between UK Vets about treatment protocols !! It's no wonder we are often very confused about it all.
 
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