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Help!!!

S

StacySasnett

New Kit
Hello,

I am new to having baby bunnies in the house as I did not intend to breed. It's kind of a funny story. My husband and I picked out two male lion head bunnies at the pet store this last Christmas and we named them Smith & Wesson, they were about nine weeks old. I was cleaning out the cage on 3/20/14 (as I do weekly) and found a litter of 6 babies which absolutely scared the daylights out of me because I had two MALE bunnies! I did enough research to determine that I must keep them until 6 weeks of age and can then wean them from momma and find new homes for them. I made an appointment for the buck to be fixed and the earliest date I could get is 4/26/14. I was not smart enough to separate them and on 4/21/14 she kindled another litter of 5 kits! The first litter appear to be doing very well and healthy as far as I can tell.

So I have two litters! 5 kits are 1 day old and 5 kits are 4 weeks old (one did not make it from the first litter) I realize there is a lot I do not know about this whole business, but first things first. Can the momma nurse both litters???

Any advice would be greatly appreciated!!!!

Sincerely,
Stacy
 
She can, but was the father removed before she gave birth to the second litter? If not, she may have a third on the way - they can pregnant within a couple of hours of giving birth.

I assume he has been separated now? He must not be allowed back with the others until they are also neutered (bonding adult rabbits is different to putting babies together and you have to follow certain rules for it to work, but you won't have to worry about that for at least 3 months).

I'm not going to sugar-coat it too much - she is young and one litter will be hard work for her body, two may be too much. Her body is going to be under an awful lot of strain. But it can be done, let her try - do not try to handrear the babies.

The babies should start to eat solids by 6 weeks but they will continue to nurse for many more weeks. The usual earliest time for separating them from mum is 8 weeks, but if her health deteriorates you may have to remove them a little sooner.

The best thing you can do is look after her health. She needs a quiet, stress-free home and she needs to know her nest is safe and secure, this is very important, as she may kill her babies if she feels she can't cope. You need to keep an eye on her weight, to make sure she doesn't get too skinny. She also needs a good diet with plenty of pellets. What is her current diet? Does she have a healthy tummy? What pellets do you feed her?
 
Nursing both litters usually doesn't work out, as the newborns can't compete with the older kits, not to mention the strain that it will put on the mom. Though not ideal, it's usually necessary to wean the older kits. At that age they are usually eating solids well enough that they should be fine. But you'll need to keep an eye on them to make sure they are eating and drinking well, and make sure they are getting plenty of hay.
 
Yes, they are separated! Momma looks good and eating really well, but am worried that nursing 10 bunnies will be to hard on her

So are you saying that it's ok to have both litters in the same cage with om as long as dad is not?

Your input is helpful, thank you!
 
Jbun said:
Nursing both litters usually doesn't work out, as the newborns can't compete with the older kits, not to mention the strain that it will put on the mom. Though not ideal, it's usually necessary to wean the older kits. At that age they are usually eating solids well enough that they should be fine. But you'll need to keep an eye on them to make sure they are eating and drinking well, and make sure they are getting plenty of hay.
Click to expand...

Yes, they are getting lots of hay and from what I can tell drinking lots of water. they are very playful! Will they be ok without nursing further?
 
In normal circumstances it is best to not wean until the kits are 6-8 weeks old, preferably 8 weeks if the mom will allow it and is healthy, as it's best for the health of the kits. But because of your bun having a new litter, if you want the newborns to survive you will need to wean the 4 week olds. It's not the best thing for them as weaning early can sometimes leave them open to developing digestive problems, but the new babies simply will not be able to compete with the older babies for the milk if both litters are kept in with mom. The new babies would likely not get to nurse at all because the older kits could just push their way in. It's not ideal, but there's not much else you can do if you want the new litter to have it's best chance at surviving as well.
 
I don't think it would be a good idea to remove the older babies unless you have to. I don't think this a a situation where we can say you definitely should or shouldn't right now, it has to be played by ear. If the youngest litter are being fed then I would leave them both for now. Some does do cope with two okay. If she stops feeding them properly, then think about removing the older litter. Removing the older litter now carries significant risk of them getting upset guts, as their guts won't have adjusted fully to solid food yet. Are they eating pellets yet? You will be able to tell if the younger litter are feeding as their tummies will be round. It is unlikely that you will actually see the feeding take place.

What pellets are you feeding mummy bun? And how many?
 
If you leave the older babies in with the younger ones when she nurses the smallest will get trampled and pushed out. If the four weeks olds are good and healthy they should survive if weaned now. Some people, not the nice ones, regularly wean at four weeks- and wild rabbits (I know they are different) also wean at four weeks.
 
nessar said:
I don't think it would be a good idea to remove the older babies unless you have to. I don't think this a a situation where we can say you definitely should or shouldn't right now, it has to be played by ear. If the youngest litter are being fed then I would leave them both for now. Some does do cope with two okay. If she stops feeding them properly, then think about removing the older litter. Removing the older litter now carries significant risk of them getting upset guts, as their guts won't have adjusted fully to solid food yet. Are they eating pellets yet? You will be able to tell if the younger litter are feeding as their tummies will be round. It is unlikely that you will actually see the feeding take place.

What pellets are you feeding mummy bun? And how many?
Click to expand...

She is eating the Kaytee Gourmet Vriety diet and I notice that she is picking out all the good stuff (pumpkin seeds, carrots, hay) and leaving the pellets.She loves the Vitakroft Nibble rings, I give her about 8 daily. The new borns look good so far, nice round bellies.
 
Jbun said:
In normal circumstances it is best to not wean until the kits are 6-8 weeks old, preferably 8 weeks if the mom will allow it and is healthy, as it's best for the health of the kits. But because of your bun having a new litter, if you want the newborns to survive you will need to wean the 4 week olds. It's not the best thing for them as weaning early can sometimes leave them open to developing digestive problems, but the new babies simply will not be able to compete with the older babies for the milk if both litters are kept in with mom. The new babies would likely not get to nurse at all because the older kits could just push their way in. It's not ideal, but there's not much else you can do if you want the new litter to have it's best chance at surviving as well.
Click to expand...

I have them separated now. Mom is with the newborns and I can tell they nursed early this morning. I thought I would let mom rest and then maybe put her with the 4 week olds for a few hours this afternoon, maybe they will nurse and can wean them slowly instead of cold turkey, what are your thoughts?
 
nessar said:
She can, but was the father removed before she gave birth to the second litter? If not, she may have a third on the way - they can pregnant within a couple of hours of giving birth.

I assume he has been separated now? He must not be allowed back with the others until they are also neutered (bonding adult rabbits is different to putting babies together and you have to follow certain rules for it to work, but you won't have to worry about that for at least 3 months).

I'm not going to sugar-coat it too much - she is young and one litter will be hard work for her body, two may be too much. Her body is going to be under an awful lot of strain. But it can be done, let her try - do not try to handrear the babies.

The babies should start to eat solids by 6 weeks but they will continue to nurse for many more weeks. The usual earliest time for separating them from mum is 8 weeks, but if her health deteriorates you may have to remove them a little sooner.

The best thing you can do is look after her health. She needs a quiet, stress-free home and she needs to know her nest is safe and secure, this is very important, as she may kill her babies if she feels she can't cope. You need to keep an eye on her weight, to make sure she doesn't get too skinny. She also needs a good diet with plenty of pellets. What is her current diet? Does she have a healthy tummy? What pellets do you feed her?
Click to expand...

Yes, the father has been removed but I'm not sure exactly when she kindled the kits so there is a window of time he was with her and I am concerned I have a third litter in the oven!
The 4 week olds started pellets last week and have also been eating hay -I am thinking about putting mom with them for a couple of hours this afternoon separate from the newborns of course) and maybe they will nurse. What do you think?
 
That sounds like a good way to do it to me. The main problem with two is the four weeks olds are so much bigger they will compete for all the milk but if you restrict their access then hopefully there will be enough to go around.

I'd suggest introducing dry food aimed at young rabbits - it's higher protein so will help the kits but will also help mum with milk production/keeping weight on. Introduce it really slowly over the next couple of weeks.
 
Both litters appear to be doing really well so far. I feel like the first 10 days are the most critical (and stressful) in what little experience I have. Momma is happy and I'm spooling her as much as I can and dad has calmed down a lot. His appointment is this Saturday ;)

Thanks for all the feedback everyone, I really appreciate it!
 
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