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At a loss with rabbit and gas, plz help!

sunnibunny

sunnibunny

Alpha Buck
Leah a week ago had stasis and so the usual was done of vets, pain med, etc.
In the past few days she is all fine and well and seems healthy, then the next day is stomach pressing. Then the past two days she is all well and healthy during the day but then in the evening she is stomach pressing. T_T

I have cut down her muesli big time as well as her pro fibre nuggets. Plus give her more hay, but she never has eaten this anyway. Give her grass too as she prefers that to hay, but she isnt a fan of that either. Giving her reduced amounts of forage too so she eats either the grass and hay, but also dont want to give her no forage as scared she goes into stasis by not eating anything at all, as a protest of not getting the food she wants. The forage available all in small amounts is blackberry leaves, plantain, banana leaf, apple leaf, dandelion. Im scared if i take out grass, for reasons of "spring" grass, and then no forage either as that gives mushy poops if in large quantities then she literally wouldn't have anything to eat!!!

Im at a loss. Please help. Everytime she is stonach pressing, including tonight i give her pain relief med and gut stimulant and tummy massage.

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You need to take her to the vet (not tonight but soon) to discuss a long-term plan.

Could you provide a list of exactly what she will eat daily, and the quantities of each? It would be helpful if you did the muesli by either volume in table-spoons or weight, to get a more accurate picture.

Does she ever have anything different to usual, or has she had anything different lately? Do you know what triggered the stasis? Do you know if there is anything particular in the forage that gives her mushy poops?

Has she had any blood tests, xrays, ultrasounds or any other diagnostics done? Has the vet looked at her teeth with an otoscope? Did he do this consciously or under anaesthetic?

Also, what is banana-leaf? Not actual leaves from banana trees?

And are these the profibre pellets that you feed? http://www.vetuk.co.uk/rabbit-suppl...rotexin-pro-fibre-for-rabbits-800g-pot-p-1178
 
nessar said:
You need to take her to the vet (not tonight but soon) to discuss a long-term plan.

Could you provide a list of exactly what she will eat daily, and the quantities of each? It would be helpful if you did the muesli by either volume in table-spoons or weight, to get a more accurate picture.

Does she ever have anything different to usual, or has she had anything different lately? Do you know what triggered the stasis? Do you know if there is anything particular in the forage that gives her mushy poops?

Has she had any blood tests, xrays, ultrasounds or any other diagnostics done? Has the vet looked at her teeth with an otoscope? Did he do this consciously or under anaesthetic?

Also, what is banana-leaf? Not actual leaves from banana trees?

And are these the profibre pellets that you feed? http://www.vetuk.co.uk/rabbit-suppl...rotexin-pro-fibre-for-rabbits-800g-pot-p-1178
Click to expand...

She eats dandelion, smooth cow thistle, hogweed, plantain, blackberry leaves, apple leaves, herb Robert, goose weed, banana tree leaf. I give each of these in a few leaves/small amounts each with the exception of blackberry leaves and plantain in increased amounts as they help digestion.

Yes those are the profibre pellets, and yes to banana tree leaf as rabbits can eat them. But also get a small amount.

She gets just a pinch of muesli just to encourage her to eat, as well as about 10 pellets of that pro fibre.

She had an ultrasound, nothing unusual except one small kidney. Teeth are fine checked with scope both front and back while awake.

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Not a clue why she went into stasis, and no changes in diet occurred.....hence why im at a loss.

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sunnibunny said:
She eats dandelion, smooth cow thistle, hogweed, plantain, blackberry leaves, apple leaves, herb Robert, goose weed, banana tree leaf. I give each of these in a few leaves/small amounts each with the exception of blackberry leaves and plantain in increased amounts as they help digestion.

Yes those are the profibre pellets, and yes to banana tree leaf as rabbits can eat them. But also get a small amount.

She gets just a pinch of muesli just to encourage her to eat, as well as about 10 pellets of that pro fibre.

She had an ultrasound, nothing unusual except one small kidney. Teeth are fine checked with scope both front and back while awake.

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Click to expand...

What did the find in the gut when they did they ultrasound? Was the lining inflamed? Was the stomach the right size, or enlarged? Could they see much gas? Was the gut slow as well as gassy? Was there any build-up of food or poo in the gut?

Does she have/has she had any other health problems? Any problems with calcium in her wee?

I would personally not feed banana leaf. It isn't a part of their natural diet and the point of forage is that it is stuff they would eat naturally. Bananas are also grown with extreme amounts of pesticides, which undoubtedly would be on and in the leaves too. I just wouldn't want to risk it. Bunnies with gut problems often can't have foods that are technically safe but unnatural.

Her diet sounds good, with the exception of the lack of hay. So unfortunately, I think that is where the answer lies. What brands and types have you tried? Some buns are very fussy (like my Barney) and will not touch some brands but will eat others.

What amount of forage does she have a day then, total? A handful, 2 handfuls...?

How much hay would you say she eats daily? What are her poops like?
 
nessar said:
What did the find in the gut when they did they ultrasound? Was the lining inflamed? Was the stomach the right size, or enlarged? Could they see much gas? Was the gut slow as well as gassy? Was there any build-up of food or poo in the gut?

Does she have/has she had any other health problems? Any problems with calcium in her wee?

I would personally not feed banana leaf. It isn't a part of their natural diet and the point of forage is that it is stuff they would eat naturally. Bananas are also grown with extreme amounts of pesticides, which undoubtedly would be on and in the leaves too. I just wouldn't want to risk it. Bunnies with gut problems often can't have foods that are technically safe but unnatural.

Her diet sounds good, with the exception of the lack of hay. So unfortunately, I think that is where the answer lies. What brands and types have you tried? Some buns are very fussy (like my Barney) and will not touch some brands but will eat others.

What amount of forage does she have a day then, total? A handful, 2 handfuls...?

How much hay would you say she eats daily? What are her poops like?
Click to expand...

Everything from ultrasound was fine. Lining was fine, liver, stomach all good size. No obstructions in gut. No build up of food or poo. It was all fine except for the small kidney.

Taken away banana leaf, apple leaf, herb Robert, hogweed, goose grass. Think i take away dandelion too as she had some last she ate as she not eating anything else, and gave her dandelion to appetise her to start eating her grass and hay as she needs an appetiser to get her eating going.

Ive tried all sorts of hay including farm hay, timothy, oxbow, readigrass, meadow, etc. Even tried the hay variety sample from hay for pets. I give her a handful of forage. If she finishes it, i get another handful lot. Otherwise she finishes it at night.

No calcium deposits in wee. She has some fur with her poo currently as she is moulting. Her poo is small and dark as she isnt eating much due to her stasis and naturally dark due to forage than hay.

She goes through cycles of weepy eye as she has a root tooth elongation.
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Last edited:
sunnibunny said:
Everything from ultrasound was fine. Lining was fine, liver, stomach all good size. No obstructions in gut. No build up of food or poo. It was all fine except for the small kidney.

Taken away banana leaf, apple leaf, herb Robert, hogweed, goose grass. Think i take away dandelion too as she had some last she ate as she not eating anything else, and gave her dandelion to appetise her to start eating her grass and hay as she needs an appetiser to get her eating going.

Ive tried all sorts of hay including farm hay, timothy, oxbow, readigrass, meadow, etc. Even tried the hay variety sample from hay for pets. I give her a handful of forage. If she finishes it, i get another handful lot. Otherwise she finishes it at night.

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Click to expand...

I wouldn't take away all the forage so quickly, try to take one at a time, as big changes to diet can do more harm than good. You also won't be able to isolate what (if anything) is causing the problem if you change multiple things at a time.

So is she only eating 2 handfuls of food a day, total? Any hay?

Even the slightest change in brand can make a difference to hay eating, so I'd try any brands that she hasn't had before. Did she eat ANYTHING of the ones you have mentioned? Have you tried Burns Green Oat hay? Have you tried orchard grass? Have you tried alfalfa?

Hmmm... is her gut slow then? Or is it purely gas? A slow gut can cause gas, you see, as the food builds up and sits there longer, producing gas. But if the gut is not slow, the gut is not inflamed and there is no build-up of food at all... well that seems to point to it being something that she is eating.
 
nessar said:
I wouldn't take away all the forage so quickly, try to take one at a time, as big changes to diet can do more harm than good. You also won't be able to isolate what (if anything) is causing the problem if you change multiple things at a time.

So is she only eating 2 handfuls of food a day, total? Any hay?

Even the slightest change in brand can make a difference to hay eating, so I'd try any brands that she hasn't had before. Did she eat ANYTHING of the ones you have mentioned? Have you tried Burns Green Oat hay? Have you tried orchard grass? Have you tried alfalfa?

Hmmm... is her gut slow then? Or is it purely gas? A slow gut can cause gas, you see, as the food builds up and sits there longer, producing gas. But if the gut is not slow, the gut is not inflamed and there is no build-up of food at all... well that seems to point to it being something that she is eating.
Click to expand...

She is dwarf size rabbit and 5 years old. She doesnt eat huge anounts unless its pellets or oats. Lol. Doesn't eat any hay at all. I cant get her to. Not tried green oat hay, where do you buy it? Cant remember orchard grass if tried or not. Tried alfalfa, didnt like it. How can you tell if she has a slow gut?

Really appreciate you replying and helping me nessar. Im so scared of losing her. :-(



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sunnibunny said:
She is dwarf size rabbit and 5 years old. She doesnt eat huge anounts unless its pellets or oats. Lol. Doesn't eat any hay at all. I cant get her to. Not tried green oat hay, where do you buy it? Cant remember orchard grass if tried or not. Tried alfalfa, didnt like it. How can you tell if she has a slow gut?

Really appreciate you replying and helping me nessar. Im so scared of losing her. :-(



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Click to expand...

Well your vet should have been able to see if she had a slow gut on the ultrasound. They can also tell by feeling the gut to see how much food and poo is in it (should be a fair amount of poo and some food but not a build-up of mass of food) and listening to it with a stethoscope. Also, small, hard poos are a symptom of a slow gut, so these are a fairly good indicator. What are her poos like?

I think your rabbit probably does have a slow gut, which is why I'm surprised nothing was sitting in her gut building up and producing gas. Her diet and the fact that the vet has given her a gut stimulant does suggest that she has one. Which gut stimulant is she on?

I know exactly what you're going through, and it is scary. I've been through a similar thing with Barney. He is on gut stimulants for life now, but thankfully is stable.

She is eating a very small amount a day, and this won't be helping. Rabbits need to constantly forage or their guts can't cope. If she refuses to eat any other hay, she'll have to have something else in her diet to replace it. Have you ever fed larger amounts of forage? If so, how did her tummy cope? It may be worth looking at VERY high fibre pellets for her to eat, I'm thinking ones that are mainly hay, I'd recommend VetCare Digestive or Fibafirst. Both are made by supreme and are as high in fibre as hay. VetCare Digestive is the better of the two for guts, but less yummy. You can buy both online.

Burns green oat hay is available online mainly, the hay experts do it. Might be worth trying the vita-verde hays too, as they have bits mixed in. I'd also try a sample pack of hay4pets.
 
nessar said:
Well your vet should have been able to see if she had a slow gut on the ultrasound. They can also tell by feeling the gut to see how much food and poo is in it (should be a fair amount of poo and some food but not a build-up of mass of food) and listening to it with a stethoscope. Also, small, hard poos are a symptom of a slow gut, so these are a fairly good indicator. What are her poos like?

I think your rabbit probably does have a slow gut, which is why I'm surprised nothing was sitting in her gut building up and producing gas. Her diet and the fact that the vet has given her a gut stimulant does suggest that she has one. Which gut stimulant is she on?

I know exactly what you're going through, and it is scary. I've been through a similar thing with Barney. He is on gut stimulants for life now, but thankfully is stable.

She is eating a very small amount a day, and this won't be helping. Rabbits need to constantly forage or their guts can't cope. If she refuses to eat any other hay, she'll have to have something else in her diet to replace it. Have you ever fed larger amounts of forage? If so, how did her tummy cope? It may be worth looking at VERY high fibre pellets for her to eat, I'm thinking ones that are mainly hay, I'd recommend VetCare Digestive or Fibafirst. Both are made by supreme and are as high in fibre as hay. VetCare Digestive is the better of the two for guts, but less yummy. You can buy both online.

Burns green oat hay is available online mainly, the hay experts do it. Might be worth trying the vita-verde hays too, as they have bits mixed in. I'd also try a sample pack of hay4pets.
Click to expand...

The vet didnt mention anything about a slow gut. But it sounds possible for Leah. if i gave leah more forage, she would just eat just what she normally has. But finish dandelions first over any other forage. She doesnt like fibafirst, but will try the vetcare digestive.

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I'm so surprised reading this that she still won't eat her hay after you cut her muesli and fibre pellets back. Its really good you are feeding her the blackberry leaves- I think they are really good for rabbits. When I lived in Virginia that's where the wild rabbits prefered to live, in the blackberry bushes, so I think its something really close to what they eat naturally. If she has gas do you give her simethicone? That is supposed to be really safe for rabbits and can't hurt but might help. Also, I wonder if you should slowly, slowly wean her over to another brand of pellets, like Oxbow since they have a very good reputation, just to see if she does better on a different feed. With the muesli since there are lots of different things in it- maybe she is sensitive to some little bit of it that she is eating. I hope she gets better soon.
 
sunnibunny said:
The vet didnt mention anything about a slow gut. But it sounds possible for Leah. if i gave leah more forage, she would just eat just what she normally has. But finish dandelions first over any other forage. She doesnt like fibafirst, but will try the vetcare digestive.

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Click to expand...

What are her poos like? What gut stimulant is she on?

Does she never finish her forage between meals? So she is literally just eating 1-2 handfuls of stuff a day? If so, the volume she is eating is way too small.
 
Have emailed supreme for vetcare digestive sample. Will look into oxbow. Her poo ranges from mushy poop, to small dark and hard. She is on emperid gut stimulant. She defo eats small amounts frankly. Ugh. I just wish she would eat hay and then gut problems would be over and teeth would be better. Im sure bunnies make humans life so difficult!!! Arghhh.

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sunnibunny said:
Have emailed supreme for vetcare digestive sample. Will look into oxbow. Her poo ranges from mushy poop, to small dark and hard. She is on emperid gut stimulant. She defo eats small amounts frankly. Ugh. I just wish she would eat hay and then gut problems would be over and teeth would be better. Im sure bunnies make humans life so difficult!!! Arghhh.

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Click to expand...

Her poos don't sound good at all, it sounds like her gut is not coping with her current diet.

How often and how much of the emeprid is she on? What is her weight?

The thing is, with a slow gut they feel full, which makes them not want to eat, which leads to a slow gut which makes them feel full... and so on. It's a nasty cycle. A slow gut can also be very painful, which makes them not want to eat even more.

Throughout the day and night, does she ever run out of food?
 
Has she had a recent thorough Dental examination/treatment under GA including skull radiographs to see the precise situation with regards to her tooth roots? TRE can be exceptionally painful and regular Dental treatment under GA is required to try to manage this chronic and progressive condition.

Her breed, her age and her eating/GI tract symptoms all scream 'Dental Issues' to me.

Given that an abdominal U/S was totally OK I think the primary problem may be in her mouth. Her not eating hay may be due to the fact that the 'mechanical' action of her jaw required to do so causes her oral discomfort. Either in her mouth or as a result of the tooth root elongation, or both The continued lack of crude fibre in her diet then leading to the GI tract hypomotility/abdominal pain/gas etc.

In short if the primary cause is Dental then the gut problems wont resolve until the Dental issues are thoroughly addressed. She is probably not eating hay because she cant, not because she wont. Both the lack of crude fibre and the chronic pain from elongated tooth roots will both cause GI tract hypomotility.
 
Last edited:
She never runs out of food. She is 1.6kg. She is on 0.2ml emperid. She hasnt had a recent ga dental xray observation. Think im gonna call the vet.

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Jack's-Jane said:
Has she had a recent thorough Dental examination/treatment under GA including skull radiographs to see the precise situation with regards to her tooth roots? TRE can be exceptionally painful and regular Dental treatment under GA is required to try to manage this chronic and progressive condition.

Her breed, her age and her eating/GI tract symptoms all scream 'Dental Issues' to me.

Given that an abdominal U/S was totally OK I think the primary problem may be in her mouth. Her not eating hay may be due to the fact that the 'mechanical' action of her jaw required to do so causes her oral discomfort. Either in her mouth or as a result of the tooth root elongation, or both The continued lack of crude fibre in her diet then leading to the GI tract hypomotility/abdominal pain/gas etc.

In short if the primary cause is Dental then the gut problems wont resolve until the Dental issues are thoroughly addressed. She is probably not eating hay because she cant, not because she wont. Both the lack of crude fibre and the chronic pain from elongated tooth roots will both cause GI tract hypomotility.
Click to expand...

This morning she is chewing on hay!!! Not eating, but chewing. Thats a big step of interest in hay for leah!!!

She was in the past on a high dose pain med to see if that would start her eating hay and thus determine if it was her tooth root, but she didnt go for hay as usual.

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That's a good thought, Jane, I didn't think of tooth roots.

It is odd that she won't eat any hay even after cutting everything else down. And to never run out of food even though she is only having 1-2 handfuls a day...

Good plan on calling the vet to get another dental exam and xray. When you see them, I would also enquire about whether the dose of metaclopramide (emeprid) she is on can be upped. My rabbit is 3.5kg and is on 3ml twice a day, and has had it three times a day before. Now I'm not a vet, but her dose is a lot lower per kg of weight, so it may be able to be increased, or you may be able to give it more times a day, so I'd ask.

It's great that she is showing interest in the hay! Maybe give her a fresh handful to help encourage her more.
 
My rabbit has digestion problems. She is 1.2kg and has been on 0.5ml metaclop three times a day so your little one is on a low dose. I also give her infracol for her gas and this seems to keep her pain free. Doughnut's gut just seems to stop and she gets constipated even though she eats lots of hay. She is on 23g of muesli a day and then just hay and this is the formula that I found is good for her.

May up the medicine a bit until you can get to the vets and then hopefully they can find out the cause, which like Jane says may be her teeth. Hope she gets better soon.
 
Just given another dose of emperid of 0.5ml. Put her outside too, so she can get some exercise and sun. Been to shops this morn and got some yummy hay mixes and basil and coriander herbs. Frankly if i was a rabbit
I would be having a feast! I asked about infracol and simethicobe (sp?), but my vet wasnt advocate on it but who knows frankly. Each vet is diff in their views. Where would you buy such a thing and what dose would yup give hypothetically?

Thank you everyone so much for replying. I really appreciate your thoughts and opinions, as it makes me more informed when i see the vet. And i am really trying my best to get leah healthy.

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