Luna has stasis again and it's stressing us both out.

When I first joined this forum a little while ago it was to ask about Luna and her stasis issues. She had her first one on New Years Day this year- she refused to come out of the hutch or to eat. The second was in March and was a similar situation. More recently she experienced when he brother died, and then she was eating but not pooing. I thought that that time it was linked to stress and grief. Each time she has been given gut stimulants and it has cleared up. The first couple of times, the vet was not particularly rabbit-savvy, but the last time I went to see a different vet who seemed a lot more knowledgeable and said that if it happened again, we should investigate the cause of it.

After the last one, I spent a while trying to figure out what it was that had caused it. I thought stress, but then looking at the shape of some of her poos, I worried about megacolon. I have been speaking to Thumps on here and she does not think that Luna is a true megacolon bunny, but I have been slowly introducing her to a forage diet all the same, and she seemed to be doing quite well on it. There were a couple of times when she looked like she might have stasis coming on, but when I gave her some bramble leaves and apple and pear leaves and bark, she picked up very quickly.

However, last Saturday she seemed a bit down and did not want her bramble or much else. I resorted to giving her some of the gut stimulant medicine we had left from the last time we were at the vets. She did lots of poos and was much better. The only thing was that there were some oblong poos that I hadn't seen in a while, and some that were linked together with string type stuff which I have gathered from research means that she is ingesting too much fur? There were also a couple that looked almost sticky, but they were normal shaped.

She had a vets appointment monday but I cancelled it as she seemed so much better by then. She is not a very handle-able rabbit and gets really stressed with the vets, and as she is due to be spayed Friday, I didn't want to take her twice in the same week if she did not need to go.

Today I've come back from work and she is slumped in the corner of her run. She's nibbled at bits and bobs this morning, but has left quite a bit and is turning her nose up at coriander, which is usually her favourite. There were also a couple of cecotropes in corner of the run. She ate them when I shuffled them towards her, but I'm a bit worried that they had been left. There is a bit of normal poo in the hutch, but not a huge amount.

I have a vet appointment in about an hour, but it's not with my normal vet as she isn't in. I've been assured this vet also knows about bunnies, but I'm not sure how much I believe that. I have given her a bit of infacol in the mean time as her gut stimulant meds are now a month and a bit old and I'm not sure I should still be using them.

I'm guessing that from here she will need bloods and x-rays? Although I have been told that an ultra sound would bring up many of the same things as an x-ray so I might ask about that, as she won't need to be under GA for that.

She just seems to get ill every time I want to get her spayed and it's stressing me out because I would really like it to be done and out of the way.

Does anyone have any ideas or advice of what it could be before we go to the vets?

No great advice but wanted to send some support your way, stasis is so stressful really hope the vet has some answers and can make Luna feel better.

My bunny Ruby tends to get stasis when she has a bad moult, despite brushing, so I know where you are coming from xx

Thanks very much for the reply. I really appreciate it

The vet wasn't amazing. She kept repeating the last few words of every sentence when I was explaining Luna's history, which was a bit annoying and gave me the impression that she didn't really know what she was talking about. But she did give me lots of emeprid syrup and some fibreplex paste. She has also agreed to x-ray Luna when she is under GA for her spay friday (presuming she is better by then) just to check for megacolon or anything else that might show up. She mentioned bloods too, but I think she wanted to do an x-ray first and see what that brings up.

She does seem to have picked up a bit this evening and is eating. I'm off work tomorrow so I'm going to keep an eye on her She is moulting quite a bit at the moment, and because she is so nervy I cannot even stroke her without her running away after a few seconds, so brushing her isn't really an option. I am hoping this is something I can build on after her spay when she is a bit less hormonal.

Luna seemed much better this morning; ate all her pellets and nibbled at a bit of pear and strawberry leaves. However, a couple of hours ago she was slumped in the corner again and didn't want anything to eat. I left her with the food for an hour and she still hadn't eaten it. I gave her some emeprid and some of the fibreplex paste and now it is just over an hour later. She is slumped in a different spot, and still doesn't seem to want to eat anything. I can't work out if she is ill or stressed out or just hot. She hates being handled and her last bout of stasis was made worse by me giving her meds constantly. I can't keep checking on her as I feel that stresses her out too.

Could it be the heat mixed with stress? I'm considering taking her back to the vet, but I don't want to make her more stressed.

Sorry I've missed this thread before, but adding vibes for Luna. It is such a worry when bunnies go off their food, especially if they are resistant to being given meds.

Sometimes bunnies pick up on our anxiety, so I would try to seem as relaxed as possible with Luna - even if this means pretending!

If she is still not eating I would definitely take her to the vet, although I appreciate your dilemma if vet trips stress her out.

Good luck.

I don't want to worry you even more, but I would personally not get this bunny spayed at the moment until the stasis investigations have been done. If there is pain in the body already causing the stasis, the spay will obviously add a whole lot more. Have the teeth been investigated? Sorry if I've missed this in your posts.

Whereabouts in Essex are you, out of interest?

edit: forgot to say, I found peppermint tea to be a God-send for my stasis bunnies.

She's a bit better now. Eating more, but still not as well as she should be, and the same with her poos. There are some, and they look normal, but not really enough.

My thoughts were that I should bring her along Friday anyway even if she can't be spayed, just to get the x-rays done? Does that sound like a good idea?

She obviously would have to be booked in for an x-ray otherwise, and I think if I bring her back before then, they will just tell me to keep up with the emeprid and fibreplex.

It's just tricky with her because it is a fine line between her being actually ill and then her getting ill from me stressing her out and giving her meds to sort out the original illness if that makes sense?

I gave her emeprid at lunch time and have been trying to hold off giving her her next dose until this evening because she gets so worked up having regular meds and got to the point before where she would just run off every time she saw me because she thought I was going to medicate her again.

The spaying is stressing me out too, because I'm a bit worried that the fact that she hasn't been spayed has something to do with her illness. Is that me being paranoid or is it possible? She's just over two years old. She just seems to get ill every time I book her in to get spayed, so it keeps getting put off.

Do you just make the tea and then give it to the bunny when it has cooled down?

And I'm in Clacton-on-sea.

Yes, I'd definitely get her back to the vets for extra tests. Blood tests would be really useful. But have the teeth also been looked at, including the back ones? Stasis can be caused by pain anywhere in the body.

Another possibility, which I found with my bunnies, was that E Cuniculi was the culprit, despite having none of the regular symptoms (head tilt, hind leg weakness, eyes, etc).

Yes, I just used to make a cup of peppermint tea (quite a small cup with one bag), then let it cool. Some bunnies will apparently drink it voluntarily, but my two hated it (I'm afraid!), so it had to be syringed in. Peppermint is great for soothing bunny and human guts.

Best of luck. I do feel for you, as I know how stressful bunny stasis can be. Especially the not knowing what's up part.

I'm in Braintree *waves across to the seaside*

SarahP said:

Yes, I'd definitely get her back to the vets for extra tests. Blood tests would be really useful. But have the teeth also been looked at, including the back ones? Stasis can be caused by pain anywhere in the body.

Another possibility, which I found with my bunnies, was that E Cuniculi was the culprit, despite having none of the regular symptoms (head tilt, hind leg weakness, eyes, etc).

Yes, I just used to make a cup of peppermint tea (quite a small cup with one bag), then let it cool. Some bunnies will apparently drink it voluntarily, but my two hated it (I'm afraid!), so it had to be syringed in. Peppermint is great for soothing bunny and human guts.

Best of luck. I do feel for you, as I know how stressful bunny stasis can be. Especially the not knowing what's up part.

I'm in Braintree *waves across to the seaside*

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Oh sorry, yes I meant to write in the last test, her teeth were checked by my decent vet about a month ago, and the not so good one yesterday and both said her teeth looked perfect. Although my good vet did say that if she was put under GA for x-ray or spay then she would be able to give them a proper look as there might be a small something that she missed because Luna does just try and eat the teeth checking implement.

What could the blood tests show up that would explain it? The not so good vet I saw seemed to think that they were a bit of a novelty for rabbits and wasn't sure. I know that the x-rays would show up a blockage or if she has megacolon.

If it were E Cuniculi would they be able to detect that with any tests? Or would she just get given a course of pancur or something to just see if it made any difference? If she had to have that is there a way of giving it to her other than a tablet or syringe? I just think that me giving her long term meds would make her ill through stress and then we would just be going round in circles. She has got better at people-interaction since her brother died, but it is still on her terms, and the closest I get to her is her hopping up to me and sniffing me for a few seconds to see what I'm doing, or eating food near me because she thinks I might have more on me.

I will try the peppermint tea. Hopefully I won't have to syringe it.

Here is a wave back to you in land :wave:

I'm so sorry your rabbit is having stasis issues. I know how stressful it is to have a rabbit with this.

I have two megacolon rabbits. My experience with megacolon, has been that their poop is always irregular. There is always odd shaped poop, football shaped, very tiny, very large, mixed in with normal looking poop. So it's not just an occasional thing, but every day. Sometimes they have had issues with their fecal poop being soft and mushy, and sometimes spongy, but I've been able to stabilize that part of it by adjusting their diet. One of my rabbits was born with it, and one developed it after repeated bouts with stasis. This particular rabbit got really stressed when I first brought him home, and ended up in stasis. It took a couple weeks for him to fully recover from it only to get it again a few weeks later. And shortly after that he got it again. It was after the second time that I started to suspect that it might have to do with his pellets, added to the fact that he wasn't used to hay and would hardly touch it. So after he recovered from the stasis, I started to switch him over to a pellet that was similar to the critical care recovery food that he had gotten used to being fed while having his stasis issues. He seemed to go onto the new food fine, but then went into stasis again after a little while, and it also seemed like he was starting to have problems with the critical care as well. I was in a bit of a bind as he didn't seem to be able to tolerate pellets anymore, but yet wasn't eating hardly any hay. I found a plain alfalfa/timothy hay pellet, used for horses, at my local feed store, so I decided to try that out, and it worked. He liked the hay pellets and once I started feeding them and stopped the rabbit pellets, he got better and hasn't had a bout of stasis since. It's been about a year since his last one.

I did try a few times reintroducing various types of rabbit pellets back into his diet, after he seemed to be doing really well. I went extremely slow, starting off with just a couple pellets and slowly increasing, but every time he would start to have problems and act uncomfortable. So I stopped trying to see if he could tolerate rabbit pellets anymore. For more than 6 months he's been on a hay and veggie only diet. He gets a measured amount of his alfalfa/timothy hay pellets, along with unlimited grass hay, which he now eats just fine. Then he gets very specific green leafy veggies and never gets any treats. And he's done really well so far on this diet. Though his poops are still a little odd shaped, they are much more stabile in size and consistency since on this diet.

My other rabbit that was born with megacolon, isn't quite as sensitive. He is able to have a very small amount of rabbit pellets each day, less than 1 tbsp. I do have to use a specific brand that doesn't have added grain and sugar, as ones with these things would cause him to have mushy poop. Then he's also on a little alfalfa hay to keep his weight up, and grass hay, a little bit of forage, but not many veggies as he's less tolerant of them.

So I don't know if it's something that will help your rabbit, but if you think the pellets may be causing her stasis problems, you could maybe try stopping them for a while to see how she does without them, and just feed her hay, veggies, and forage. Though another possibility is that one or more of the veggies or forage could be causing upset. I know that sometimes with these upsets, sometimes it works best to cut out everything and only feed a non grain grass hay until the rabbit is feeling better, then you can slowly reintroduce things back in one at a time, and just going very slow to watch out for any signs of discomfort. The signs can be pretty subtle too. With my bun when I was trying to see if he could tolerate another brand of pellet, the first sign of discomfort was him laying on his belly and squinting. It was really hard to tell, but I knew it just didn't look like his normal behavior to me.

I really hope you are able to find a solution to your buns digestive problems, and that she starts feeling better soon.

I have found a stash of poo that wasn't there when I cleaned her out this morning, so she has done a fair amount of poo. She is eating grass and strawberry leaves, and picking at pear leaves, so I am tempted to put her to bed and then check on her in a few hours to see if she has pooed on her own rather than give her emeprid now and risk stressing her out more. She is up and about now and seems a lot brighter than earlier. Does this sound like a reasonable idea?

Thank you for that Jbun. I will look into those pellets too. Where do you get them from? I worry about taking her off pellets because I think they are keeping her at a decent weight and I worry that her weight will drop without them because she is so picky with hay and forage.

I went out to put her to bed and she bounded up for me beginning for food. She ate her small amount of evening pellets (I was just curious if she would eat them- and she wolfed them down). She also ate a few fresh pear leaves from my hand. Some of the poo I found in the corner was very slightly sticky to the touch, which I believe means it is quite fresh.

I gave her emeprid at 1pm today so fresh-ish poo now is making me think that she has done that without the aid of the syrup? I will check on her in a couple of hours to see if she has pooed. I am going to give her some more syrup if she hasn't. I'm just wondering if I should give her some anyway even if she has? I have always been told to give it as and when she needs it, but I'm just wondering what you guys think?

I'd be tempted not to give her it unless she needs it. Just a few thoughts based on what you've written (sorry if it all sounds very short!)

Teeth: They can only see the back ones under anaesthetic, as I understand it (unfortunately!) So if there is a problem there, the vet won't find it with the bunny conscious.

E Cuniculi test: There is a blood test for this, but it isn't hugely accurate. Basically, it shows whether the bunny has had exposure to EC, rather than whether there is an active infection currently. So, it's not a bad test, and a useful guide, but it isn't brilliant, so some vets seem to treat for it anyway with a course of Panacur, rather than doing the blood test. I'm no expert on the other things they could test for, but I think liver function etc.

Pellets: I'd personally try to reduce these down very gradually (so as not to make her lose a lot of weight), and check that she eats more or plenty of hay, and see if that helps. Some bunnies' guts just don't get on well with pellets and actually get on better with muesli. With my stasis bunnies, I ended up having to just give hay and dried herbs only, with no pellets at all.

SarahP said:

I'd be tempted not to give her it unless she needs it. Just a few thoughts based on what you've written (sorry if it all sounds very short!)

Teeth: They can only see the back ones under anaesthetic, as I understand it (unfortunately!) So if there is a problem there, the vet won't find it with the bunny conscious.

E Cuniculi test: There is a blood test for this, but it isn't hugely accurate. Basically, it shows whether the bunny has had exposure to EC, rather than whether there is an active infection currently. So, it's not a bad test, and a useful guide, but it isn't brilliant, so some vets seem to treat for it anyway with a course of Panacur, rather than doing the blood test. I'm no expert on the other things they could test for, but I think liver function etc.

Pellets: I'd personally try to reduce these down very gradually (so as not to make her lose a lot of weight), and check that she eats more or plenty of hay, and see if that helps. Some bunnies' guts just don't get on well with pellets and actually get on better with muesli. With my stasis bunnies, I ended up having to just give hay and dried herbs only, with no pellets at all.

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I've just checked her a there is a pile of poo in the corner of the hutch

I'm thinking of seeing how she goes tomorrow. I'm guessing that even if she is better tomorrow, she probably shouldn't be spayed Friday as it is too close to her being ill and will possibly cause the stasis to reoccur?

So if she goes to the vet on Friday she could get x-rayed to check for anything that might show up on that, and then get her teeth checked at the same time? And then if nothing comes up from either of those we could try a course of panacur as a precautionary measure?

The only problem is that I'm guessing that she should wait until the course of panacur is finished to get spayed? How long would she have to have it for? I really just want it out of the way so that I'm not worrying about it any more and so she can get paired up with a new bunny. She seems fairly content on her own and I have seen her binky a couple of times, but I think she'd be so much happier with a new boyfriend Obviously the most important thing is getting her well again, but I just feel like every time I try and get this all sorted we face another setback.

She's never been a brilliant hay eater. She prefers grass but she has eaten all the grass in her pen and I can't move it around as it's all attached to the hutch which is on slabs. I pick her grass but obviously she's not getting as much grass as she should have hay. This is why I opted to start her on a forage diet, which she has for the most part adapted to (although I don't think she's eating enough to keep her weight up). I think she eats more hay now that she has access to constant brambles and tree leaves as well. I would be happy to slowly cut her pellets out when she is eating enough leaves and stuff. It's just getting to that point.

I really feel for you, I'm going through this at the moment with my bun. He's just come out from his overnight stay at the vets where he was on a drip as he lost a lot of weight. He's weights back up now and he seems to be eating but we have to remind him to eat, without it being in front of him it's just nibbles of hay here and there. He hasn't drunk a thing since coming out so I'm waiting for the vet to ring me back. And getting him to take all his meds is nearly impossible without stressing him out more as he doesn't like being handled, so it's hard what to do for the best!

Hope he gets better soon, and you find out the cause x

I truly feel for you, having a bun in stasis is so stressful

I have 2 buns that really struggle with their mounts, and go into stasis everytime despite me brushing and plucking them regularly. So I do wonder whether Luna is struggling with her moult too? Apparantly aswell as them having trouble passing the fur and the gut slowing down, it also makes them feel "fluey" as it uses a lot of their energy. My bun Max becomes really grumpy and stroppy when he's moulting

The usual course for Panacur is 28 days to treat for EC. Sounds sensible about the x ray and teeth check.

Yes, I'd definitely not get her spayed tomorrow, given this setback, even if she seems improved now.

How much in the way of pellets is she getting? You might find the hay eating increases if the pellets are reduced. When I first got my bunnies, they were filling up with dried food and looked at hay like it was something alien.

SarahP said:

The usual course for Panacur is 28 days to treat for EC. Sounds sensible about the x ray and teeth check.

Yes, I'd definitely not get her spayed tomorrow, given this setback, even if she seems improved now.

How much in the way of pellets is she getting? You might find the hay eating increases if the pellets are reduced. When I first got my bunnies, they were filling up with dried food and looked at hay like it was something alien.

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She gets just over a tablespoon of pellets morning and evening. I did try reducing them more but she is a phenomenally picky hay eater so then she just wasn't really eating anything. The only hay she has eaten for more than a couple of days before ignoring it is the Burns meadow hay that I have for her at the moment, and even then it is just the odd mouth-full. She eats much more tree leaves and bramble than she does hay, which made me think that maybe she isn't getting enough fibre from the hay and is seeking things that have a higher fibre content?

If it is EC how long would it take to start to see an improvement in her health? Am I right in thinking that that could put back her spay for another month if she was on meds for EC?

Gemmapookie said:

I truly feel for you, having a bun in stasis is so stressful

I have 2 buns that really struggle with their mounts, and go into stasis everytime despite me brushing and plucking them regularly. So I do wonder whether Luna is struggling with her moult too? Apparantly aswell as them having trouble passing the fur and the gut slowing down, it also makes them feel "fluey" as it uses a lot of their energy. My bun Max becomes really grumpy and stroppy when he's moulting

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This could also be something as she is doing quite a few poos with stringy stuff holding them together which I think is from he ingesting too much fur? Obviously when Neville was here she had him to help groom her and so it wasn't such a big deal then. She will not let me stroke her normally, let alone with a brush, so if that is the problem I don't know how I'm going to resolve it

DebbieC said:

I really feel for you, I'm going through this at the moment with my bun. He's just come out from his overnight stay at the vets where he was on a drip as he lost a lot of weight. He's weights back up now and he seems to be eating but we have to remind him to eat, without it being in front of him it's just nibbles of hay here and there. He hasn't drunk a thing since coming out so I'm waiting for the vet to ring me back. And getting him to take all his meds is nearly impossible without stressing him out more as he doesn't like being handled, so it's hard what to do for the best!

Hope he gets better soon, and you find out the cause x

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It is really stressful I hope your bunny picks up soon.