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Not breathing under anesthetic and dental issues ud 19/10/12

Crunchie

Warren Veteran
JayJay went in for a dental today as he has a missing molar at the back of his mouth the bottom one has nothing to grind against. He had a dental around three months ago for the same tooth and was apparently ok during this but the bottom tooth has grown massive.

However this time he apparently didn't breathe on his own during the op and had to be given assistance. He started again after being taken off the anesthetic and came round well but obviously the news is rather concerning given we're probably looking at a dental every 3 months for him. Removal of the tooth was considered but as it's not loose the vet didn't want to risk fracturing his jaw. Is this a route they'd maybe take in the future at all or is the risk too great?

Just wondering how common this is and whether I'm right to be worried or if I'm being paranoid. JayJay apparently started eating, pooing and weeing more or less as soon as he came round and the vet didn't seem worried about the fact but it's not really what I wanted to hear.
 
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Sorry I've no experience of this. Didn't want to read and run.

Hopefully someone with experience in this area will be along soon.

Glad to hear that Jay Jay is doing well.:thumb::love:
 
Do you know if the same anaesthetic was used? It's difficult to say how each anaesthetic will effect him as there is multiple factors to consider mainly how well he is before the dental, dehydration and lethargy can mean everything is slower before the anaesthetic is administered.
My bun has a dental every 5 week's and she is usually fine but on the odd occasion she doesn't breathe, I always think though if I don't do the dental she will starve though so I just have to trust my vet and nurses
 
Do you know if the same anaesthetic was used? It's difficult to say how each anaesthetic will effect him as there is multiple factors to consider mainly how well he is before the dental, dehydration and lethargy can mean everything is slower before the anaesthetic is administered.
My bun has a dental every 5 week's and she is usually fine but on the odd occasion she doesn't breathe, I always think though if I don't do the dental she will starve though so I just have to trust my vet and nurses

I'm not sure if the same one was used this time but I'll find out from the vet tomorrow. He was assessed before the op and was fine and had put on a little weight since his last visit. He's quite a lean bunny though and the thought of putting him through an op every 3-4 months when he's struggling to cope with it isn't exactly thrilling.
 
Just want to say, I understand your worries completely. I'm so sorry.

Yes, it's well worth checking the anaesthetic, & drugs used for induction.
As you know Thumper had a GA every month for a dental. As Marie got used to him she'd soon adjusted the drugs to a fine art of rapid recovery. All subsequent vets used the same drugs in the same dose. I think it's well worth suggesting this.
 
Just want to say, I understand your worries completely. I'm so sorry.

Yes, it's well worth checking the anaesthetic, & drugs used for induction.
As you know Thumper had a GA every month for a dental. As Marie got used to him she'd soon adjusted the drugs to a fine art of rapid recovery. All subsequent vets used the same drugs in the same dose. I think it's well worth suggesting this.

Thank you thumps I'll definately ask if the drugs were the same when I pick them both up at 2pm today.

What I don't understand is he's never had a dental before now either with his previous owner or at the rescue. There was no ulceration this time though the vet said it wouldn't have been a good idea to leave it any longer. I just don't get how his tooth can apparently be so bad yet he's survived without dentals up til now. Before his dental yesterday the tooth was apparently very close to touching his palate. If this is the case how on earth did it not puncture the roof of his mouth when he went so long without a bur before? I'm really confused regarding this and can't help but think my husbandry is wrong somehow.

He certainly isn't in the best of condition but his previous owners didn't seem to be caring for him very well. At first we hoped his poor body condition would improve with a good diet and exercise though he's not gained as much weight as he could I think. He was 2.2kg the first time I took him to the vet and is now it fluctuates between 2.4 and 2.6 and his coat is certainly glossier after his recent moult. I'm not sure what weight he should be but will ask the vet today. At the moment my list of questions are as follows:

Did JayJay have the same drugs as last time?
What would be a more ideal weight for both JayJay and Honey?
Exactly how much science select pellets should both rabbits have (JayJay gets 40g and Honey 10g)?

I'm not exactly looking forward to our appointment as the vet that's on today is the one that clearly thinks we're overfeeding Honey. The vet I spoke to yesterday asked us a load of questions regarding the diet of both and said there was nothing wrong with the way we're feeding them. Honey gets only a small amount of forage food, spring greens, curly kale and herbs while JayJay also gets odd pieces of root veg and fruit. Neither of them are given store bought treats any more aside from dried dandilion and both are fed seperately. Honey was 3.4kg when she last seen this vet in April and now weighs 3.2kg but I'm getting sick fed up of being lectured every time I take her in.
 
Thank you thumps I'll definately ask if the drugs were the same when I pick them both up at 2pm today.

What I don't understand is he's never had a dental before now either with his previous owner or at the rescue. There was no ulceration this time though the vet said it wouldn't have been a good idea to leave it any longer. I just don't get how his tooth can apparently be so bad yet he's survived without dentals up til now. Before his dental yesterday the tooth was apparently very close to touching his palate. If this is the case how on earth did it not puncture the roof of his mouth when he went so long without a bur before? I'm really confused regarding this and can't help but think my husbandry is wrong somehow.

He certainly isn't in the best of condition but his previous owners didn't seem to be caring for him very well. At first we hoped his poor body condition would improve with a good diet and exercise though he's not gained as much weight as he could I think. He was 2.2kg the first time I took him to the vet and is now it fluctuates between 2.4 and 2.6 and his coat is certainly glossier after his recent moult. I'm not sure what weight he should be but will ask the vet today. At the moment my list of questions are as follows:

Did JayJay have the same drugs as last time?
What would be a more ideal weight for both JayJay and Honey?
Exactly how much science select pellets should both rabbits have (JayJay gets 40g and Honey 10g)?

I'm not exactly looking forward to our appointment as the vet that's on today is the one that clearly thinks we're overfeeding Honey. The vet I spoke to yesterday asked us a load of questions regarding the diet of both and said there was nothing wrong with the way we're feeding them. Honey gets only a small amount of forage food, spring greens, curly kale and herbs while JayJay also gets odd pieces of root veg and fruit. Neither of them are given store bought treats any more aside from dried dandilion and both are fed seperately. Honey was 3.4kg when she last seen this vet in April and now weighs 3.2kg but I'm getting sick fed up of being lectured every time I take her in.

There's nothing whatsoever wrong with your husbandry for Jay Jay & his tooth. You said it all correctly in the beginning. Rabbit teeth grow remarkably quickly 11-12 cm a year:shock: & they need to close against another tooth to wear them down. As soon as 1 tooth is lost the remaining tooth has completely unrestrained growth. they won't get symptoms from this, unless it's rubbing against the tongue or hitting the opposite gum or palate when they chew.
I'm not sure, but think that a few top vets can stop tooth growth in these circumstances by injecting the pulp at the base of the unapposed root. Maybe worth a referral to the Royal D1ck Vet or at least enquire whether I'm right? Even should the treated tooth fall out that's what we want really!

Lloyd Ferris had this problem a few years ago. I was flummoxed how a tooth could grow 2 cms long & the rabbit be able to close his mouth:shock::oops: It was indeed the loss of the apposing tooth which caused this.
NOT YOUR FAULT. I'd put money on it that the top tooth has only fallen out fairly recently.
 
Apparenty his heartbeat was irregular throughout the procudure and he held his breath at the start, he did receive the same drugs as last time and the vet said it'd be possible to try different ones when he next requires dental work.

1st premolar on right cheek was around an inch too long and was nearly touching the palate on the opposite side. There were also spikes growing on the cheek side of all the right teeth. The left cheek teeth all had spikes growing on both the tongue and cheek side so these were all burred. Apparently the only teeth that didn't require burring were the upper right and left cheek teeth.

JayJay is being treated at the Royal **** vet school currently and has been registered there since we got him. The vet we seen today said that although there was no ulceration his mouth would have been very uncomfortable and he'll most likely need dental work done every 8 weeks or so to keep him happy. I'm finding it really hard to take in to be honest given the rescue we got him from said he had no health problems.
 
Big (((((HUGS)))))
It must all be a terrible shock to you.
Yeah Benjie had a clean bill of health too but I noticed the tiny discharge from his eyes - nose the next day & then found 2 abscesses. I was non too pleased at the time, & it took a while for me to recover, but now I love him to distraction.

I wonder if you see Elizabetta Manicelli? She was Thumper's vet after Marie & went "Up there" (Ridiculous that the correct name of a vet college should be censored!!!)

Breath holding can certainly happen with a ga induction, & is easily avoided by giving them a short acting sedative so they're sleepy & don't breath hold when they use the gas.

I think there's a good chance that all the spurs on the other teeth are simply because with that overgrown one shooting right across his mouth no way could they get that proper side to side movement they need.
If you give him 3-4 days to settle down, is there any chance you can get him really using his jaw like on some fine willow twigs? If not used properly the jaw can stiffen up quite quickly. I'll send some up to you if you wish, just drop a pm.
 
You're probably right re the other teeth, it must have been so uncomfortable for him the poor wee thing.

It was indeed Elizabetta we seen and it was her who performed the dental, she seems to know her stuff and after the situation with Roly we thought it best just to register with the best vets we could find. I'll go a hunting tomorrow for sticks and such but thank you for the kind offer. They do currently have willow sticks in their shed and although both of them are in a strop they are both eating and using the litter trays.
 
You're probably right re the other teeth, it must have been so uncomfortable for him the poor wee thing.

It was indeed Elizabetta we seen and it was her who performed the dental, she seems to know her stuff and after the situation with Roly we thought it best just to register with the best vets we could find. I'll go a hunting tomorrow for sticks and such but thank you for the kind offer. They do currently have willow sticks in their shed and although both of them are in a strop they are both eating and using the litter trays.

Elizabetta really does know her stuff - a very high flyer academically. She tends to use gas inductions too, for the more rapid recovery time, so they get back eating quickly. Fine for most buns but the occasional one breathholds.

I'm going to put my feet right in it. :oops::oops::oops: I thought that when we 1st. "met" on here you had a bun called Honey in stasis? Am I having a "senior day" or has she sadly passed?
 
Elizabetta really does know her stuff - a very high flyer academically. She tends to use gas inductions too, for the more rapid recovery time, so they get back eating quickly. Fine for most buns but the occasional one breathholds.

I'm going to put my feet right in it. :oops::oops::oops: I thought that when we 1st. "met" on here you had a bun called Honey in stasis? Am I having a "senior day" or has she sadly passed?

We still have Honey and she is sadly still a bit stasis prone though Elizabetta gave us advice on her diet which has helped we think. Honey's had two bad bouts this year one in March and a really bad one in either August or September. When she went in to the vet school for this they performed an X-ray and noticed two white blobs on the X-ray, she had an ultra sound today which confirmed these were mineral deposits and thankfully not anything major. There's a photo of her in the Stories and Photos forum with her wee shaven tummy heh.:lol:

We lost my first rabbit Roly in March who was Honey's partner due to an incompetent vet which was the reason we transferred Honey to the vet school and registered JayJay there when we got him in May.
 
We still have Honey and she is sadly still a bit stasis prone though Elizabetta gave us advice on her diet which has helped we think. Honey's had two bad bouts this year one in March and a really bad one in either August or September. When she went in to the vet school for this they performed an X-ray and noticed two white blobs on the X-ray, she had an ultra sound today which confirmed these were mineral deposits and thankfully not anything major. There's a photo of her in the Stories and Photos forum with her wee shaven tummy heh.:lol:

We lost my first rabbit Roly in March who was Honey's partner due to an incompetent vet which was the reason we transferred Honey to the vet school and registered JayJay there when we got him in May.

Thank you for keeping me up to date. I'm so sorry about Roly, but very pleased to hear that Honey is soldiering on. bless her! Hey there, are you posting naughty photos of nude rabbits?:oops::lol:
Please let us know how Jay Jay gets on.
 
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